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#281460 28/03/05 02:19 PM
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Just because a single game is hack&slash, it doesn't mean the whole world is now accepting only hack&slash, Alrik. Sacred did not sell that well (in fact, I saw it only once in stores and only a few copies: nobody I know knows what the game is about) and it was last year. As for Blizzard, Diablo 2 was made five years ago...

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[H&S]games don't need as much work as full RPGs need.

- (Therefore) We willsee much more H/S in the future, mainly bought by a younger generation.

You are wrong.
Hack and Slash games (at least the better ones), require a lot of work. Such games have a lot more different monsters, items and spells than non-H&S RPGs. Since those games are also made for multiplayer, balance also comes in. The developes have to work their backside off to make sure character A is as strong as character B and that's a hell of a work.

There have been H&S games, there are H&S games and there will always be H&S games. With Diablo released, many companies went and ripped this game off. Some games were inspired by D2, such as Divine Divinity. The combat in DD is no different form Diablo 2, as you might know. H&S is not "growing" not "will dominate the market soon". There have always been such games yet there are still story-driven RPGs. It would be a misconsiderment to say that those games attract younger players. No, those games attract people who play games for F U N. They are not looking for an involving story; those players want to play, nothing more. To say H&S games are for kids is the same as saying amusement parks are for people under 12: each time I go to an amusement park, I notice the great percentage of the crows are adults.

#281461 28/03/05 06:23 PM
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I have currently my "see-everything-in-black" mood, especially regarding RPGs (and Adventures). <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />

Fact is, nevertheless, that Adventures have almost dies out, except from some few "Newlings".


When you find a big kettle of crazy, it's best not to stir it.
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"Interplay.some zombiefied unlife thing going on there" - skavenhorde at RPGWatch
#281462 28/03/05 07:02 PM
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I heard Broken Swords 3 is a rather successful game.

#281463 28/03/05 10:26 PM
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At most arcades/video game stores/amusement parks, etc, over 50% of the people there are adults who want fun.




#281464 29/03/05 04:27 AM
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Ok I played the demo too, and my opinion differs a lot from yours. Though I'll admit at first I was very confused, but once you get used to the controls everything becomes a lot better. Also, from what I read on the official forums the demo's character development has been highly modified to make it easy to try out different skills. And in the full game "reviving" your character will give you an advance point penalty and you'll come back wounded and stunned. Now, what I thought of the game so far.

The graphics are nothing great but the game's far from ugly. But what I really love about this game is the combat, a lot of people complain about it but I honestly think fighting is a VERY fun thing in this game. Combat usually involves a lot of ennemies and it can get pretty chaotic at times, and you don't win by just clicking. You can do several "combos" by pressing on different movement keys while attacking, you can do front and side rolls to dodge ennemy attacks and you can bring your shield up to completely block an incoming attack (though the shield will break after too much hits, but so far I only lost one and it was against a big war troll) Then there are the spells, which I think are very cool. You got your usual magic missile and fireball, and some more exotic ones like ice shards which freezes your opponents. There are four schools of magic and most of them have a different to recharge "spells". Arcane and Celestial magic have a number of uses, which you get back with time (bigger spells take more time to recharge). Nether magic also has charges, but to get those back you have to mix some ingredients and "create" the spell. The last school, rune magic, works with mana. There are a number of Gods and each has his own mana pool, and spells require mana from different gods. Gods will regenerate mana overtime. While Arcane and Celestial magic seem pretty basic, Nether and Rune magic require a bit more of thinking before using, if you use all your monky palms to create a lot of Blade of Baal spells you won't be able to make any Nether Blast spells after, and if you cast Rune Strike a certain God might not have enough mana for your Rune Shield spell.

Another reason combat can be so fun is the level of satisfaction you get by beating that mob of goblins accompanied by a big bad War Troll who broke your shield with a mighty swing, or the "whew" you let out by barely dodging a huge ballista bolt that would have pushed you back across the whole room had it hit you in the chest, or even the "Muahahahahahaha!!" you say after blasting a dozen wolves with a single Blast Nova spell (careful though, that spell only has two charges at the start and takes a LOT of time to recharge).

Finding sexy equipment can be lots of fun too! When you successfully disarm a chest (disarming is a lot funner than it sounds too) and find a powerful Azure Sword or some imposing Great Sword, or when you dodge a goblin wizard's many fireballs to finally kill him and take his Burning Staff that sets on fire every ennemy you hit.

The demo's final battle involves a mob of goblins, the goblin wizard and war troll plus a goblin ballista firing at you from higher. The fight is quite challenging (try forgetting the revive button, or keep in mind that the full version of the game will give you a penalty for it and you will see the challenge) and very satisfying when you managed to clear the place.

Then, there's the multiplayer, and while many of you think this isn't a must, there's nothing quite like playing through a game alongside a good friend who'll comment with you on cool moments and who will accidentally shoot a few arrows at you while you try to block the war troll's massive punches (Yes there is "friendly fire" in that game)

I love this game, and I intend to buy it the day it comes out. I don't think I enjoyed playing a game with my brother this much since Serious Sam and Icewind Dale. Add in more races, more spells, more skills, more loot, more ennemies, more locales, some towns in which to trade and get some quests and add that darned map (which normally should exist, since they mention it in the help pop-up when you start, but for some reason doesn't work in the demo) and you'll get a very fun game to enjoy alone or better yet with a few of your friends.

Yes, it's hard to get into it at the start since you don't know what to do, but give the game a chance and look around and try stuff. Don't worry if things don't go as planned, reviving your character has no penalty in the demo.

Rythok


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#281465 29/03/05 04:47 AM
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Oh I will add one more thing, I agree that the starting forest is a boring place. So I will write here some instructions to quickly get to the sewers part which in my opinion is a very interesting place with lots of chests and cool things to do.

When you start, you're right by a campfire. On the other side of that campfire is a messenger. Talk to him and to get a letter. Read that letter. Then look behind you, you should see a post that points left (if you see the text on it) which says "Fargrove" go in the direction it points and follow the road. You'll then get to a wall with a closed gate and a guard behind it, talk to the guard. After you talk to the guard a goblin named Scorch will come talk to you. Do NOT kill him yet, I'm not sure if you can but don't attack him until he attacks you. After you beat him and his friends up, go through the small gate the goblins opened into the sewers. There you will find a switch, pull it and wait (there's a lengthy loading time, you don't even get a loading screen <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/disagree.gif" alt="" /> )And here you are in the sewers, enjoy!

Yes this contains "spoilers" but i'm quite sure a lot of you people didn't make it to the sewers which is the best place in the demo. Besides I don't really see how I can "spoile" a demo.

Last thing, if any of you want to try the multiplayer with me, pm me a day and time and if I don't work or sleep I'll gladly play the game with you.


Shikin Haramitsu Daikomyo
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#281466 29/03/05 05:01 AM
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I have the demo, but never tried it out. I'll try it in a few days.



#281467 29/03/05 02:24 PM
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I found the sewers very quickly, and spent most of my time in them. My comments still stand <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

I could add more I didn't like, too, but I won't. Overall, I didn't get the impression it's my type of game.


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#281468 29/03/05 02:46 PM
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Different people have different tastes <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> but honestly I don't think the demo is very representative of the full game, like DD's demo (only this time you don't even have a town and quests) I'm one of the rare persons who enjoys the fighting in this game, so it's too bad they released a demo like this since it will probably put off a lot of people.

Oh, and ninjutsu should be called karate <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />


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#281469 29/03/05 05:45 PM
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I hope you enjoy the full version as much as you expect to, Rythok <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Like you say - different tastes <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />


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#281470 29/03/05 06:23 PM
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I hope so too, I know I might just be disappointed by the full game. But since the developers promise more of what I liked in the demo, I think I'll happy with the game <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggrin.gif" alt="" />

Now there's something else I wanted to say...

Oh right, on the dreamcatcher forums there is a dev person telling the fans what they are working on right now. They say they're working on the "sliding when hit" thing and they're lowering the difficulty at the start.

I agree with you Elliot that the "sliding" is weird, but in the end I just killed the ennemies fast enough that never had a chance to hit me <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/evilgrin1.gif" alt="" /> At first it is very awkward though, as you try to get close to an ennemy to hit him but keep getting pushed back. That feature(?) also caused other problems in the demo, ennemies can push you over cliffs so you can see more of the game than what the demo is supposed to let you see. Never tried it but I read stories <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/delight.gif" alt="" />


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#281471 30/03/05 02:10 AM
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After playing Severance: Blade of Darkness with it's amazingly complete and challenging fighting, I find this game pathetic. Oh well, it's good that at least someone likes it.

#281472 30/03/05 08:32 AM
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@ death -> wow! i didn't know u played BoD before. that is a great game with fighting combos, much like PoP. except of course BoD was first.

now that u guys mentioned it, i don't think i'll be trying DL anymore.

@ Elliot Kane -> hey, long time no see! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wave.gif" alt="" />



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#281473 30/03/05 10:47 AM
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@ Elliot Kane -> hey, long time no see! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wave.gif" alt="" />


You know me, Janggut - I always pop up when least expected <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />

Nice to see you, too <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />


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#281474 30/03/05 09:04 PM
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I am glad to see you too, Elliot <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />.

#281475 31/03/05 12:33 AM
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I am glad to see you too, Elliot <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />.


Likewise, DATD <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />


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#281476 04/04/05 05:16 PM
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mentioning of everquest = i lose interest and stop reading <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggrin.gif" alt="" />


This is SpArTa!! oh im sorry, I must have took a wrong turn..somewhere...(runs away)
#281477 06/04/05 08:01 AM
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I found this thread by a search on good ol' goog to find more of what people were saying about this demo, hopefully quelling some of my forebodings.

In my critical eye there WERE TWO THINGS!
1)Revive... Logical; who wants to run their asses all the way back from a respawn point only to possibly get the beatdown again, BUT IT REQUIRES A PUNISHMENT FACTOR!
2)The jerk move reverse ice-skating trick your hero does everytime a lowly pawn lands a blow on him. (Which [nocando] Rythok mentioned was not so much of a problem when you're able to SLAY whatever presents itself before that happens.)

Rythok, your inquisitive self what hast brought on your well informedness hath also brought DROUGHT to my scepticism and complaints, and handed thier asses back to them!

This game ROCKS in that it has brought a more involved action element to a RPG than any before it. The ability to use earned points immediately rather than at level marks is like art to me, and adds to the fast pace.

Further more, I welcome the swarms of enemies that may come, even on the MODE OF MOST PLENTY! And yall know the graffical settings were all dumbed down for the demo.. right? I mean... you did. Didn't you?

<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/birthday.gif" alt="" /> We'll just see how pretty things get! YAha!


I'd be glad to do a HEARTY SLAM DANCE all OVER this game sometime with you Rythok. It would give me much pleasure.


HAVE AT YE' AND SO FORTH!
#281478 06/04/05 01:58 PM
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Well you'll be happy to know that reviving your character will take away some of your xp, and the skating problem has been fixed, apparently only the bigger monsters, like war trolls and goblin ballistas, will be able to knock you back.

As for the graphics, it will mostly look like what we saw in the demo, though you can now get the resolution up to 1600x1200 and if they have enough time they will reanimate the main character for right handed combat.

Yes I like the random encounters, but I do agree that it might frustrate some people. There are options to lower them, but they didn't seem to work in the demo. Hopefully it will be fixed when the game is out.

To those who didn't like the first demo, IF they release a new one I suggest you try it. With all the changes they made this game might look a lot more like you want. Now I'm not saying you'll certainly love it, but the main problems may have been fixed. I just don't want this game to be a sleeper if it deserves more attention.


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#281479 06/04/05 02:53 PM
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If the main problems are fixed, I'd probably try a second demo, I must admit. There were certainly some good ideas in there - just overwhelmed by the bad stuff, IMO.

Is there any danger of a single pickup button, does anyone know? Having to pick up 30-40 item individually after every long fight is a chore and a half...


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