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Will Ego Draconis require online activation? #361949
19/04/09 04:48 PM
19/04/09 04:48 PM
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North West, United Kingdom
Stargazer Offline OP

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My main concern with Ego Draconis is whether Larian will require online activation prior to install or purchase. Such systems, while they purport to fight piracy, actually do little other than inconvenience legitimate users and guarantee that their software will die an early death (see Shamus Young's Authorization Servers article for more on the problems posed by online activation).

I personally have boycotted every game requiring this system from Half Life 2 onwards (including Spore, Bioshock, Empire Total War, Far Cry 2 and Mass Effect) so I would be interested in knowing whether Ego Draconis should be added to that list - or whether Larian hold their customers in higher regard that EA, 2K and Ubisoft.

Re: Will Ego Draconis require online activation? [Re: Stargazer] #361954
19/04/09 05:32 PM
19/04/09 05:32 PM
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London, England
Elliot_Kane Offline
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That and activation limits are probably the two biggest blights facing legitimate gamers right now, IMO.


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Re: Will Ego Draconis require online activation? [Re: Elliot_Kane] #361957
19/04/09 07:29 PM
19/04/09 07:29 PM
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Equisilus Offline
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This is likely going to be a publisher call, with details like that coming along very late (i.e. just before release, so as not to scare people away).

Offline games should never have online activation and none should have activation limits, ever. Definitely two big pet-peeves of mine. However, only BioShock caused me any issues, and that was due to the DRM detecting that I had run Process Explorer at some point without a reboot before installing. Annoying, but I got over it enough to play the game and enjoy it. Unfortunately, the experience stayed with me and now I'm leaning negative on a lot of different DRM. Give me back a good ole media check any day.

Re: Will Ego Draconis require online activation? [Re: Equisilus] #361967
20/04/09 06:54 AM
20/04/09 06:54 AM
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swordscythe Offline
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As long as it's not Starforce, I'm happy.

Re: Will Ego Draconis require online activation? [Re: swordscythe] #361984
20/04/09 12:22 PM
20/04/09 12:22 PM
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Stabbey Offline
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I don't mind online activation, but install limits and malicious copy protection (Starforce) are big no's. Is the rumor that Beyond Divinity had Starforce in it true?

Re: Will Ego Draconis require online activation? [Re: Stabbey] #361985
20/04/09 12:29 PM
20/04/09 12:29 PM
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drazac Offline
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Personally, I don't care as long as there are NO INSTALL LIMITS

Re: Will Ego Draconis require online activation? [Re: Stabbey] #361988
20/04/09 12:49 PM
20/04/09 12:49 PM
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Foetsy Offline
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 Originally Posted By: Stabbey
Is the rumor that Beyond Divinity had Starforce in it true?

It had, but was removed later on with a patch (right?)

Re: Will Ego Draconis require online activation? [Re: Foetsy] #361993
20/04/09 02:25 PM
20/04/09 02:25 PM
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Myrthos Offline
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Unless DTP has had a bad experience with the copy protection of Drakensang I would expect that Divinity 2 would use the same (SecuROM).


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Re: Will Ego Draconis require online activation? [Re: Myrthos] #361996
20/04/09 03:16 PM
20/04/09 03:16 PM
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There's a very good article about online protection and games.

http://www.shamusyoung.com/twentysidedtale/?p=1680

Re: Will Ego Draconis require online activation? [Re: DrunkenTofu] #362001
20/04/09 05:09 PM
20/04/09 05:09 PM
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Foetsy Offline
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 Originally Posted By: Raito
There's a very good article about online protection and games.
http://www.shamusyoung.com/twentysidedtale/?p=1680

same link as in the first post ;\)

Re: Will Ego Draconis require online activation? [Re: Myrthos] #362003
20/04/09 05:23 PM
20/04/09 05:23 PM
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Ragon_der_Magier Offline
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 Originally Posted By: Myrthos
Unless DTP has had a bad experience with the copy protection of Drakensang I would expect that Divinity 2 would use the same (SecuROM).


My guess, too.
Besides not having heard anything like that around in the The Dark Eye: Drakensang forums after the release (but would they confess anyway, if it were so?! ;\) ), but instead the proud sales numbers of 100k units+ sold, i´d lean to thinking they´d stick with the method.

Which was a relatively mild implementation of SecuROM, basically doing nothing than merely standard, that being the usual checking of the DVD´s presence in the drive.

If they will employ the newish strategy of (rumorwise) implementing intentional bugs only triggered in a cracked game, however, remains to be seen.
It would require definitely the close cooperation of the Larians again in return.


Ragon, the safely protected Mage


Last edited by Ragon_der_Magier; 20/04/09 05:27 PM.
Re: Will Ego Draconis require online activation? [Re: Foetsy] #362004
20/04/09 05:26 PM
20/04/09 05:26 PM
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Yep. And yes, Starforce was removed in the latest BD patch. Slightly different issue though, as Starforce can actually cause physical problems to your CD drive (and other malware like behavior) while online activation limits your ownership of the game you paid for, possibly to the extent that you can't play it at all.

Re: Will Ego Draconis require online activation? [Re: flixerflax] #362056
21/04/09 12:21 PM
21/04/09 12:21 PM
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AlrikFassbauer Offline
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I e-mailed to a few developing companies which used Starforce for their copy-protection.

Every one of them mailed me a patched version of the game executables with the Starforce copy-protection removed.


When you find a big kettle of crazy, it's best not to stir it.
--Dilbert cartoon

"Interplay.some zombiefied unlife thing going on there" - skavenhorde at RPGWatch
Re: Will Ego Draconis require online activation? [Re: AlrikFassbauer] #362061
21/04/09 12:50 PM
21/04/09 12:50 PM
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Equisilus Offline
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I thought most companies had dropped Starforce because of the bad reputation that haunted the name for so long. These days, SecuROM seems to be the main DRM company on games that I've bought.

Re: Will Ego Draconis require online activation? [Re: Equisilus] #362096
22/04/09 01:14 AM
22/04/09 01:14 AM
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There really is not easy way to handle activation, as the game would have to "call home" and report what system it is on (going off Mainboard Serial Numbers) and wait for a response from Larian that it is legal and playable. What if the system is offline?

After single activation, what if computer dies and you get a new one?

There will always be pirates. Back in DOS days, a single copy of a floppy was done. VHS days, get another VHS and play tape in one, pop blank in other and record. Today there is software being sold that is updated like virus scanning software to remove copy protections.

DRM is gas on the fire. Only way to put it out is to catch and arrest distributors of software and execute them. Then it will be less likely people will become pirates. But is it right or wrong to take such drastic action over computer software?

It comes down to plain honesty. DRM is an utter failure and causes far more problems than help. Sony's copy protection was the invention of the "root kit" that can render windows unusable and need to format now that malware programmers know how to code that type of virus. Best way to stop piracy now is to require logging in to Larian studios and have the log in server verify that you paid for it. This game (like all) will be most likely be cracked in less than 24 hours by someone, software crackers love bragging rights. The'll sell it themselves and make a small profit and it will get on some "sharing" sites within a week if it's really hard to crack.

That is the sad truth of DRM and piracy.

Now, do you love Larian and want to pay them for their hard work?

My answer is yes.
If they don't get paid, we don't get Divinity 3.

Last edited by LightningLockey; 22/04/09 01:19 AM.

Every time there I run into trouble on the road, there is always a dwarf at the bottom of it. Don't they know how to drive above ground?
Re: Will Ego Draconis require online activation? [Re: LightningLockey] #362116
22/04/09 12:26 PM
22/04/09 12:26 PM
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Elliot_Kane Offline
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Online activation for a single player offline game is actually one of the worst developments yet created by DRM companies. Not only do we have no idea WHAT information is being sent (And getting a straight answer to that is pretty much impossible) but we don't know how long the servers will be up.

I like playing old games and quite a lot of my favourites were made by companies that no longer exist. If I needed online activation for those every time I re-installed them, all those wonderful old CDs would be only useful as drinks coasters.

Online activation on single player games is a red line, to me - cross it and I don't buy the game. I don't care what it is or how long I've been waiting to get it, that kind of DRM is NOT acceptable! It never will be.


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Re: Will Ego Draconis require online activation? [Re: Elliot_Kane] #362117
22/04/09 12:57 PM
22/04/09 12:57 PM
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Wishmaster Offline
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Any kind of copy protection is useless and it's simply a waste of time "integrating" it into a software because it will get cracked within few days or even hours... It would be nice to install the game and be able to play it without CD/DVD because then the CD/DVD will last longer (it won't be so scratched and eventually unusable) and people (who bought game) wouldn't trouble finding no-cd/dvd cracks.If someone already downloaded game illegaly and likes it, then chances are that he will buy it just because to show some respect to the developers. No copy protection will ever stop this illegal distribution, but quality game and respecting those who buy them - will.
I don't think that this SecuROM ever stoped illegal distributing...

Re: Will Ego Draconis require online activation? [Re: Wishmaster] #362120
22/04/09 01:51 PM
22/04/09 01:51 PM
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Lynn Offline

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Stopping? No, but it decreases the illegal distribution tremendously.

Re: Will Ego Draconis require online activation? [Re: Lynn] #362128
22/04/09 04:23 PM
22/04/09 04:23 PM
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Elliot_Kane Offline
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No it doesn't, Lynn. The most pirated game in 2008 was, apparently, Spore - which is protected by SecuROM Internet Edition.

Plenty of people are put off from buying games because of limited installs and online activation, though. You only have to look at a few threads on the Mass Effect and Spore forums to see that. Not to mention the Amazon users' campaign against excessive DRM.

Excessive DRM drives away legitimate customers and has no effect on pirates at all.

I (And many like me) would NEVER pirate a game. End of. I want games companies to thrive because I love playing games and quite apart from the 'piracy hurts people' argument I see it as being in my OWN interests to support the making of good games. Being a writer myself, I completely understand why people want to protect their intellectual property and I thoroughly approve of them having the right to do so.

However, NO company has the right to treat me with contempt when I am a legitimate paying customer who has done them no wrong. If they try, I simply do not buy their product. If I have to miss out on a game I really wanted because of that, so be it.

I have no problem with any reasonable copy protection methods and I never have had. But UNreasonable methods are a whole other thing.


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Re: Will Ego Draconis require online activation? [Re: Elliot_Kane] #362138
22/04/09 06:31 PM
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AlrikFassbauer Offline
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I'm not put off from buying as long as a copy protection makes no hassle and I can get an official no-CD patch a few years later.

What I don't like, actually, is having to have 7 or so CD- or DVD-drives in my PC because I just want to play a game !


When you find a big kettle of crazy, it's best not to stir it.
--Dilbert cartoon

"Interplay.some zombiefied unlife thing going on there" - skavenhorde at RPGWatch
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