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Re: 20 points to make a great game even better [Re: Vayra] #515303
10/07/14 12:49 PM
10/07/14 12:49 PM
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Tanist Offline
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Originally Posted By: Vayra
The reason for the game not sorting by type does have its reasons:

- items are not categorised by types as they are in other games. Tooltips say what items do, loot has rarities and stats, but other than that, an item is an item. In essence players can 'use' every item in several ways - even loot.

- categorisation by type also inherently reveals too much about the usefulness of certain items. Just like a Quest Item tab would destroy much of the obscurity in the game and automatically 'solves' puzzles in the game, categories would do the same for several other aspects of the game such as crafting. You are supposed to try this and find it out yourself, or use the crafting manuals to learn more.


Depends on how you do the categorization. If you do it from an internal perspective of the game, then you would sort based on generic aspects (weapons, armor, food, tools, scrolls, books, etc...) which would not provide any advantage in terms of spoilers.

Now if you sort by external aspects (quest items, stat items, unique items, legendary, etc...) then you run a high risk of spoiling some aspects of play.

That way you get a little more reasonable ease in managing your inventory, but no spoilers. An orange for a quest will still sort as food, the same as a sword as a weapon, etc...

Re: 20 points to make a great game even better [Re: LordCrash] #515304
10/07/14 12:50 PM
10/07/14 12:50 PM
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Is it indeed ungainly, I would simply like a button that auto-sorted the items to fill up empty spaces at the top of the bag as opposed to leaving spaces scattered throughout so that have to scroll down to see all items, does that make sense? smile

Re: 20 points to make a great game even better [Re: Vayra] #515308
10/07/14 12:53 PM
10/07/14 12:53 PM
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Hiver Offline
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Originally Posted By: Vayra
The reason for the game not sorting by type does have its reasons:

- items are not categorised by types as they are in other games. Tooltips say what items do, loot has rarities and stats, but other than that, an item is an item.


An item is an item?

hahaha


Quote:
In essence players can 'use' every item in several ways - even loot.


So?


Quote:
- categorisation by type also inherently reveals too much about the usefulness of certain items.


Yeah? How so?
Quote:


Just like a Quest Item tab would destroy much of the obscurity in the game and automatically 'solves' puzzles in the game,


Whaaat? hahaha How would it "automatically solve puzzles" in the game - exactly?

You must know because youre claiming it so assuredly.

Quote:

categories would do the same for several other aspects of the game such as crafting.

You are supposed to try this and find it out yourself, or use the crafting manuals to learn more.


There is already a sort of category for crafting items, among many others and that reveals absolutely nothing about any specific crafting combination.

Sorting by type - does not mean sorting by category, by the way. It means "sort my inventory so all weapons, armors, arrows, potions, spells, etc, etc are sorted in groups together.

Since crafting uses almost all items in the game it would be pretty much impossible to sort them all into one single category and glean any information from it.

welcome

Re: 20 points to make a great game even better [Re: LordCrash] #515323
10/07/14 01:06 PM
10/07/14 01:06 PM
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1. Well, that diary looks aweful. The current is fine as is. If you want a walkthrough, find one, don't expect the journal to be one (oh, how I hate people expecting the journal just explicitely telling them what to do).

2. Fine enough.

3. No. Defeats the whole purpose of having repair and identify. No.

4. No. What stupid game makes everyone sneak instead of the rogue. What is this even?

5. Not gonna happen. There was a quest in Silverglenn that took gold from another character if your selected didn't have enough, and when I pointed that out to them Octaaf stated that definitely wasn't the intention and gold should remain seperate at all times (I assume it got fixed before release). Understandable seeing it's co-op nature.

6. Teleport? I don't see any reason for this. Simply scroll over there and click, they walk automatically. Seriously.

7. Cause the item type is... well, the sub-tabs. If you want to sort on gear, go to the gear tab. If consumables go to consumables. There's not much point to sort like that if an entire seperate tab just to see them is available. They do need to sort out some bugs here though, but your wish is already granted.

8. Sounds good!

9. Nope. They just need to fix that if you switch characters you really switch them, so it will be compared to the person trading. No need to clutter the screen with 4(!) comparisson windows.

10. HANDHOLDING ALERT. Sorry, this game is not your modern Elder Scrolls game who stops you from being stupid. Don't be stupid yourself. It's not so hard. Try it sometimes. You can only complain if you have a bug, not if you just messed up. Pay attention, don't force the game to pay attention for you. Got plenty of other RPG's that are willing to do so for you if it's too hard.

11. That's reasonable, and a proper suggestion.

12. What about "unique" is difficult to understand. This isn't Diablo and it's all about loot and you can collect a full set etc. It puts an unnecessary focus on something that's not the goal of the game.

13. Haha, no. Doh.

14. Not that far yet, so can't explain. Bugfixes are hardly suggestions though going on the title (to be truth I only read the titles not all the text ;))

15. Lol, no. Stop with the dumbing down suggestions already. Why return to old-school if you just want to crap over it back to the modern age right 1 week after release. Seriously.

16. Bugfix, not suggestion.

17. There's mapnotes, there's directional signs *everywhere*... so, no, not necessary. They just have to adapt. Soft-gloving them this early on and they are really unprepared for the old-school beating coming for them. So no, it wont help new people, it will do them more harm than good. So why do it?

18. Too early for me to tell (first I was 'what's a sarong XD').

19. Hahahaha... No. You remember the old games which end after it was done. Yes, good times right. Not sure why people expect endgame content and post-boss stuff and exploring after the game's done. Would you know how much extra dialogue one potentially needs to write to allow NPC's to say the big baddie is dead. In a braindead environment like The Elder Scrolls that's easy, but with the amount of proper NPC's in OS. Nope, just... nope... not gonna happen.

20. Too early for me to judge here.

So yeah, like Hiver, I disagree with pretty much all of them. And I gave reasons...

Re: 20 points to make a great game even better [Re: LordCrash] #515324
10/07/14 01:10 PM
10/07/14 01:10 PM
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I have a lot of sugestions and i do agree with some (not all) sugestions made here, but i'm reserving my opinion to after this week (or next?) patch that sven already promissed on an interview.

As far as i could understand on the interview, a lot of stuff will be added as hotfixes and new content. It will be the first "major" patch besides the ones that were critical in the first 2-3 days of launch so i'm expecting something big.

After the patch i'll try to pitch in with some sugestions and add to the discussion. Good post tough.

Re: 20 points to make a great game even better [Re: LordCrash] #515329
10/07/14 01:13 PM
10/07/14 01:13 PM
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Fixes that make the game slightly less frustrating - yes!
Anything that causes the game to 'dumb-down' - no!

Re: 20 points to make a great game even better [Re: Hiver] #515345
10/07/14 01:25 PM
10/07/14 01:25 PM
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Originally Posted By: Hiver
You two shouldn't represent your own personal devolved superficial thinking as truths.

Nor you should speak for other people, using strawman arguments to bolster your nonsense arguments.


Nothing in my argument was a strawman. It was addressed to specific points the OP brought up.


Originally Posted By: Hiver
Neither of those things are tedious or clunky.


Says you? I find it tremendously tedious and clunky.

Originally Posted By: Hiver
They are such only to you - personally. That you have the right to think does not actually mean whatever you think is therefore valuable or true.


I've never said my opinions were anything other than my own.


Originally Posted By: Hiver
This is not about any kind of superficial notion of "charm" either. You only leaped to grab onto that term because it diminishes the actual role of these things into some sort of personal preference and implied nostalgia - which is all crap you want to push in as relevant.


I never leaped to the notion of charm. Another poster did.


Originally Posted By: Hiver
Quote:
Since this is a single player game I see no reason not to allow a player to experience the game as they wish within certain constraints (I.E. the game becomes so easy as to eliminate any challenge or sense of discovery whatsoever).


Where in this sentence is the internal coherence and consistency of the setting, the story, the game and its specific gameplay? Where is the importance of the world and characters in it compared to those cheap metagaming desires of two spoiled, devolved lard-asses?


Nothing in that sentence has anything to do with internal consistency of the setting, story, etc. To imply otherwise would suggest you didn't understand the point. If you want to make the point that it would disrupt such consistency, do so.

Originally Posted By: Hiver
How does one character identify items others are holding exactly?


He turns his gaze over to the item the character is holding.

Originally Posted By: Hiver
How does one character fixes all items at once?


Does it matter? You'll be fixing all the items eventually anyway.

Originally Posted By: Hiver
And how the fact it would be an "option" doesnt detract from the structure as it is now and effect it has on players view and relation to the game world?


It is a simple change that eliminates a lot of tedious clicking.

Originally Posted By: Hiver
Doesnt matter, right? BECAUSE YOU SAY SO! Lets just push the whole party into a blender and remove any individuality from any of them, because some joebart says thats better and not so laborious. And because some biodrone who thinks ass deffect 3 is a great game - great - not good, not even ok, (and that would be a laughable, extreme karma destroying thing to say) but GREAT RPG no less - would think this would be less "tedious and laborious" to him personally and his opinion is great because he can think.


I don't see what this has to do with party individuality. That individuality is accomplished by how you develop and role play your character.

I've never played "ass deffect 3" but find it interesting such a title very much piqued your interest.

Additionally, I never said my opinions were great. I simply said these options would remove some of the tedium, especially after playing the game for many hours.


Originally Posted By: Hiver
Its not enough that such psychological failures distorted a whole genre into a flood of always the bloody same games, but you need to come here and turn it into that same crap. Bit by bit. Not because youre evil... but because you are just that limited and ignorant.


I don't really see this game as a significant departure from Baldurs Gate, Fallout, etc. In essence it is very similar. I also fail to see how any of my suggestions make me limited or ignorant. Ignorant would be me being unaware these possibilities exist. Limited would suggest I can't think outside the context of the game, or have any thought whatsoever as to what could make the game better.


Originally Posted By: Hiver
Quality of life improvements? What the flying fuck do you mean by that?
Whose life?
What quality? How is that an improvement of anything and why should anyone care what you just "think" about any of that nonsense?


You clearly don't understand the meaning of "quality of life improvements" within the context of the gaming world. A better term perhaps would be ease of use.


Originally Posted By: Hiver
What "options" does any of this "give" ? Option to you to get your way?


It clearly gives the player the option to repair/identify all items.

Originally Posted By: Hiver
Is there anything at all behind those declaratory empty statements except vacuum of your heads?


Indeed there is.


Originally Posted By: Hiver
btw, there is no chance in hell that you will get most of those wishes, especially 19 and 20, any time soon, if ever. Because the game is done. Its finished. You will only get patches, fixes and smaller corrections.

Nothing of any kind of bigger additions that would completely change the structure of leveling of different areas and the game scope.

The only way to see such additions now is through mods.


It was simply a list of suggestions from the poster that he thought could improve the game. And I'm sure there will be some folks who mod this into the game. If the developers happen to patch in some of these suggestions that would be great as well.

Last edited by JoeBart; 10/07/14 01:32 PM.
Re: 20 points to make a great game even better [Re: LordCrash] #515346
10/07/14 01:26 PM
10/07/14 01:26 PM
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But if loot isn't part of the game, then why the RNG loot that falls like rain? Part of developing a character is obtaining better loot and gear, and previous Divinity games did indeed have unique item sets (Blood Echelon, Aleroth Archmage, Hunter's, Scorpion's, Dragon Wizard, etc).

I'm just saying that the loot and craft system can be expanded and improved on, devoted crafters should be able to craft unique items, like the Sword of Planets and the Buffalo Sabre already in game. Why are there no staff, dagger, bow, spear, 2handed equivalents? Why aren't there any unique armor? Most old school RPGs had handplaced non-RNG gear.

Re: 20 points to make a great game even better [Re: Hassat Hunter] #515364
10/07/14 01:44 PM
10/07/14 01:44 PM
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Tanist Offline
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Originally Posted By: Hassat Hunter
1. Well, that diary looks aweful. The current is fine as is. If you want a walkthrough, find one, don't expect the journal to be one (oh, how I hate people expecting the journal just explicitely telling them what to do).


Kind of off topic, but related in a way. Does anyone know if there is a bug with the journal? I only can see the dialogue for the present day (ie all the listings will say Day-4 etc..., but I can't see the dialogue from the previous days.

That would be my biggest complaint about the journal. I want to be able to look back through my discussions to double check things for a quest or the like.

Re: 20 points to make a great game even better [Re: LordofBones] #515367
10/07/14 01:45 PM
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Tanist Offline
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Originally Posted By: LordofBones
But if loot isn't part of the game, then why the RNG loot that falls like rain? Part of developing a character is obtaining better loot and gear, and previous Divinity games did indeed have unique item sets (Blood Echelon, Aleroth Archmage, Hunter's, Scorpion's, Dragon Wizard, etc).

I'm just saying that the loot and craft system can be expanded and improved on, devoted crafters should be able to craft unique items, like the Sword of Planets and the Buffalo Sabre already in game. Why are there no staff, dagger, bow, spear, 2handed equivalents? Why aren't there any unique armor? Most old school RPGs had handplaced non-RNG gear.


Diablo ----> j/k

Though you do tend to obsess over loot. It reminds me of reading the WoW forums. /shrug

Last edited by Tanist; 10/07/14 01:46 PM.
Re: 20 points to make a great game even better [Re: LordCrash] #515370
10/07/14 01:50 PM
10/07/14 01:50 PM
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@ LordofBones;

The funny thing is... I'm still in Cyseal and *HAVE* an unique armor, unique staff and an unique two-hander on my characters.

So what game do you play?
And yes, Divinity 2 had, but it's somewhat different league of game than Divinity: OS.

EDIT; @Tanist: It only displays the last few conversations.

Re: 20 points to make a great game even better [Re: Hassat Hunter] #515382
10/07/14 02:02 PM
10/07/14 02:02 PM
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LordofBones Offline
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Originally Posted By: Hassat Hunter
@ LordofBones;

The funny thing is... I'm still in Cyseal and *HAVE* an unique armor, unique staff and an unique two-hander on my characters.

So what game do you play?


What unique armor? Apart from the various smelly items in Cyseal, there is no other unique armor I've seen in the game. I've seen plenty of legendary armor, but no unique armor. If you can provide a name and the stats, I'd be happy to say I'm wring. Does the armor have a new model, or do unique armors also look like the generic armors that drop off enemies?

Unique weapons, sure. Madora's lugging around one.

That said, I'm still kind of sore that there's only one robe mesh in the game. The Immaculates wear wonderful robes...

Re: 20 points to make a great game even better [Re: Hassat Hunter] #515386
10/07/14 02:06 PM
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Originally Posted By: Hassat Hunter
1. Well, that diary looks aweful. The current is fine as is. If you want a walkthrough, find one, don't expect the journal to be one (oh, how I hate people expecting the journal just explicitely telling them what to do).

Let me guess: you haven't played Inquisitor? The journal in the game can hardly be called a "walkthrough", not at all. Inquisitor is in terms of no hand-holding at least as old-school hardcory than D:OS, be assured. But the difference is that you can really find hints and goals by reading your diary and combining various things you've encountered in the game. The difference is that in D:OS information is scattered and not stored in a central place (like a diary) which isn't be best solution imo.

Quote:
3. No. Defeats the whole purpose of having repair and identify. No.

How so? What is the purpose of having repair and identify? Again, in D:OS identifying and repairing are only skill-based. Once you have a certain skill level the respective character can just repair or identify every item (with either repair hammer or identifying glas in the inventory). What's better in clicking on each armour and weapon piece indiviually? There is no 4th wall breaking in a repair all function because the whole process is already quite abstract. You do repairing in identifying in inventory (abstract level) already, without the need to be at a forge or a study room and there is no direct gameplay or roleplaying mechanic connected to it. It's an abstract task with no gameplay value whatsoever. I never claimed that the skill level needed for repairing or identifying should disappear. That's all still the same. The only difference is a reduction of clicks and (non gameplay) processes needed for these tasks.

Quote:
4. No. What stupid game makes everyone sneak instead of the rogue. What is this even?

Well, I think you haven't properly read what I wrote. In D:OS every character - no matter if rogue or not or if someone even has a point in sneaking - can sneak by design. Of course you could only let your rogue sneak. In that case you would in almost every case delink him from the rest of the party anyway. I wasn't demanding that pressing the sneak button should put the whole party in sneak mode, I was demanding that every LINKED charcter should be put in sneak mode. That's quite easy to understand since the usual purpose of linking them together is to let them walking together. And there are situations in which you can sneak with your whole group, for example the Luculla mines.

5
Quote:
. Not gonna happen. There was a quest in Silverglenn that took gold from another character if your selected didn't have enough, and when I pointed that out to them Octaaf stated that definitely wasn't the intention and gold should remain seperate at all times (I assume it got fixed before release). Understandable seeing it's co-op nature.

No, I disagree that it's a co-op nature. Again I made a distinction between WHOLE party and LINKED characters. I only suggested shared gold for LINKED characters. Linked character are only controlled by only one human person, no matter if in co-op or in SP. If it's technically possible or easy to change the system is another question but that's of course up on Larian to decide.

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6. Teleport? I don't see any reason for this. Simply scroll over there and click, they walk automatically. Seriously.

Teleport??? I never suggested any form of teleport. I don't understand what you mean...

Quote:
7. Cause the item type is... well, the sub-tabs. If you want to sort on gear, go to the gear tab. If consumables go to consumables. There's not much point to sort like that if an entire seperate tab just to see them is available. They do need to sort out some bugs here though, but your wish is already granted.

It's not. A consumable tab is worth nothing if I want to craft an item with a consumable and a weapon because - of course - the weapon is not in the consumable tab. Many crafting processes has to be done in the main inventory tab because you combine items from different item types. With a sorting filter for item types (I don't know why you even oppose this...) finding ingredients for crafting would be much easier without the need to endlessy search thing in a huge inventory.

Quote:
9. Nope. They just need to fix that if you switch characters you really switch them, so it will be compared to the person trading. No need to clutter the screen with 4(!) comparisson windows.

Again you misunderstood me. I don't want four comparison windows, not at all. I want one, but based on the character for which the character who leads the trade actually buys stuff. If I talk to a merchant with my Rodrick (who has a high bartering skill) it's only Rodrick talking to him (so switching between characters completely would be a real 4th wall breaking and unimmersive). But Rodrick can buy stuff for other people in his group, for example for Scarlett by taking her bag. But when Rodrick wants to buy a new robe for Scarlett the automatic comparison compares the robe to Rodrick's armour instead which makes absolutely no sense. So it's pefectly fine that only one characters leads a barteing dialogue, but it's not very well designed if he can buy stuff for other party members but not compare items to their gear. That could be solved by just switching the comparison to the character who is active in the bartering menu.

Quote:
10. HANDHOLDING ALERT. Sorry, this game is not your modern Elder Scrolls game who stops you from being stupid. Don't be stupid yourself. It's not so hard. Try it sometimes. You can only complain if you have a bug, not if you just messed up. Pay attention, don't force the game to pay attention for you. Got plenty of other RPG's that are willing to do so for you if it's too hard.

ELITISM ALERT. Sorry, but what you say makes little sense. What I suggested has nothing to do with being stupid. Messing something up requires to have proper information. And sometimes stuff just happens accidentially. That's not because people are stupid but because people are human. It's one thing to have a super hardcore attitude but another thing to make a game really frustrating for people who find out after perhaps 10 hours of playing that they lost an item they needed for quest. That may cause Schadenfreude by the elitist hardcores but it's just an unnecessary drawback for some people. We're not talking about quest markers, easy puzzles or hand-holding here. We're talking about a system that allows little "mistakes" which aren't really obvious to cause great frustration very later on.

Quote:
12. What about "unique" is difficult to understand. This isn't Diablo and it's all about loot and you can collect a full set etc. It puts an unnecessary focus on something that's not the goal of the game.

My suggestion was more about making the loot of bosses and special chests "better" (on the average) than the stuff you find in random containers. It's not Diablo but you cannot deny that the random loot system plays an important role in D:OS. So there should be imo a nice "reward" for finding a chest or killing a boss on top of getting some XP. At least the whole "treasure map" feature is kind of worthless if the chests only contain "normal" gear that can be found in every other container or can be dropped by any random enemy.

Quote:
13. Haha, no. Doh.

I got it. Too stupid and not hardcore enough for you. Maybe you're just not into the game enough to notice that there are some skills that can be only found one or twice in the game which makes respecing utterly worthless although it's as an option in the game.

Quote:
14. Not that far yet, so can't explain. Bugfixes are hardly suggestions though going on the title (to be truth I only read the titles not all the text ;))

Why do you even dare to answer my post if you don't even take the time to read it? That's insulting, dude. Do you think other people take your seriously if you openly admit that you don't give a shit about their opinion and what they wrote? Sorry, but I clearly wrote in my initial post that I will tackle design issues AND fixes.

Quote:
15. Lol, no. Stop with the dumbing down suggestions already. Why return to old-school if you just want to crap over it back to the modern age right 1 week after release. Seriously.

Strange. Do you even know what I'm talking about? This suggestion is nothing about being hardcore or not. Step back from your black and white thinking, we are adults and can look at the issues a bit less dogmatic, can't we?
But back to the point: if rot infection is Hiberheim is ok, why not also in Cyseal? Wouldn't it be even more hardcore if you could already infected by rot in the tutorial dungeon, suffering from it for at least 20-30 hours before you even get the chance to cure it? Even the most old-school hardcore gamers should see that this is not about making the game more "dumbed down". It's a question about pacing. As I said, the problem with the encounter in Hiberheim is that you can meet it hours before you even know about Tenebrium or rot for the first time. I don't know what is enjoyable or "hardcore" to be forced to constantly heal a character for no apparent reason...

Quote:
16. Bugfix, not suggestion.

Read my damn initial post before you make stupid comments. I think you hate stupid games and you want to use your brain more often? So please use it here as well and don't make stupid comments. Thank you.

Quote:
17. There's mapnotes, there's directional signs *everywhere*... so, no, not necessary. They just have to adapt. Soft-gloving them this early on and they are really unprepared for the old-school beating coming for them. So no, it wont help new people, it will do them more harm than good. So why do it?

Well, let's agree to disagree here. But one basic design goal (no matter if for a casual game or a balanced game or a hardcore game) is to have a slightly increasing difficulty curve. It may fit the super hardcore attitude well to even block out less experienced gamers right at the start but it doesn't necessarily do a great service to the whole game. I think there would be many people who could enjoy this game if the they get more chances to inform about the ingame mechanics. It's also not about being forced to hand-holding or everything. And tbh, this whole old-school beating thing is way over the top. D:OS is challenging, but not difficult. It's also quite accessible to a wide variety of gamers without being casual or consoly or whatever. But that doesn't mean that there isn't room for improvements. Giving the people the possibility to gain more immersive information (which is not the same as e.g. quest markers) should always be a design goal for devs.

Quote:
19. Hahahaha... No. You remember the old games which end after it was done. Yes, good times right. Not sure why people expect endgame content and post-boss stuff and exploring after the game's done. Would you know how much extra dialogue one potentially needs to write to allow NPC's to say the big baddie is dead. In a braindead environment like The Elder Scrolls that's easy, but with the amount of proper NPC's in OS. Nope, just... nope... not gonna happen.

I never said that I wanted this stuff to be available AFTER the end of the game. Please read more carefully. I was comparing it to Kangaxx of BG2 (which is one of these old games...). It's about bosses you can fight BEFORE the end of the game but not necessarily while you happen to meet them for the first time. but I guess you just read the headline and thought, "ha, endgame content, I heard that before from MMOs, why bothering with reading the whole passage if I could just comment on the headline". Well, epic fail, dear sir. wink


Quote:
So yeah, like Hiver, I disagree with pretty much all of them. And I gave reasons...

Well, while Hiver is an aggressive and rude person I don't want to talk with anymore I think he at least read my whole post. You obviously don't and you misunderstood most of my points (either it's on me because I didn't make them clear enough or on you because you didn't read them properly without putting down the elitist old-school hardcore glasses for a second). But well, nobody's perfect... wink


WOOS
Re: 20 points to make a great game even better [Re: Tanist] #515390
10/07/14 02:09 PM
10/07/14 02:09 PM
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One of the reasons to play an RPG is for the loot. Loot is integral to the development of a character as he grows in power, unless you want to tackle that great wyrm red dragon or the 20th level lich wizard with a +1 longsword.

And there are two entire trees devoted specifically to the crafting of equipment.

Given that in MMOs, you have to beat enrage timers and mechanics with better gear, then yes, you do need gear in those games.

Re: 20 points to make a great game even better [Re: Hassat Hunter] #515391
10/07/14 02:10 PM
10/07/14 02:10 PM
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Posts: 1,801
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LordCrash Offline OP

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Originally Posted By: Hassat Hunter
@ LordofBones;

The funny thing is... I'm still in Cyseal and *HAVE* an unique armor, unique staff and an unique two-hander on my characters.

So what game do you play?
And yes, Divinity 2 had, but it's somewhat different league of game than Divinity: OS.

EDIT; @Tanist: It only displays the last few conversations.


Legendary and unique are not the same thing. Not at all. Legendary is just an item description, it's not a hand-crafted item. There isn't even one unique armor in the game (apart from weresheep armor), at least not in my game after more than 110 hours of playing it...

It's also quite funny that you think you can argue with people who obviously played the game A LOT longer than you, experienced A LOT more than you, seen A LOT more than you. Think about it. Don't act like a wise guy if you're only a beginner so far (don't want to be offensive, just a tip)... wink

Last edited by LordCrash; 10/07/14 02:12 PM.

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Re: 20 points to make a great game even better [Re: KnightPT] #515392
10/07/14 02:12 PM
10/07/14 02:12 PM
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Mikus Offline
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Originally Posted By: KnightPT
I have a lot of sugestions and i do agree with some (not all) sugestions made here, but i'm reserving my opinion to after this week (or next?) patch that sven already promissed on an interview.

As far as i could understand on the interview, a lot of stuff will be added as hotfixes and new content. It will be the first "major" patch besides the ones that were critical in the first 2-3 days of launch so i'm expecting something big.


Since I'm not sure which interview you're talking about - was there any mention of UI/usability improvements in the upcoming patch(es)?

And I'll yet again agree with the repair/identify request in the OP. I'm not convinced this suggestion does anything to "dumb down" the game as a few people imply - it would actually make it less dumb by retaining the underlying skill requirements and the element of "surprise" when identifying which some have mentioned, while removing the incessant...ridiculous...tedious...constant...clicking. wink

Re: 20 points to make a great game even better [Re: Mikus] #515394
10/07/14 02:13 PM
10/07/14 02:13 PM
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LordCrash Offline OP

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Originally Posted By: Mikus
Originally Posted By: KnightPT
I have a lot of sugestions and i do agree with some (not all) sugestions made here, but i'm reserving my opinion to after this week (or next?) patch that sven already promissed on an interview.

As far as i could understand on the interview, a lot of stuff will be added as hotfixes and new content. It will be the first "major" patch besides the ones that were critical in the first 2-3 days of launch so i'm expecting something big.


Since I'm not sure which interview you're talking about - was there any mention of UI/usability improvements in the upcoming patch(es)?



Swen just said that about the big patch next week in the PC Gamer interview, apart from the coming AI personalities:

Quote:
We basically have two types of things. We're doing hotfixes where we see problems that we can fix right away for people, and then the patch will contain some extra content. Balancing fixes.

Last edited by LordCrash; 10/07/14 02:14 PM.

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Re: 20 points to make a great game even better [Re: LordCrash] #515397
10/07/14 02:15 PM
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Ah, OK - thanks LordCrash. Too bad there's no mention of interface improvements, but I'm still hoping.

Re: 20 points to make a great game even better [Re: Hassat Hunter] #515402
10/07/14 02:18 PM
10/07/14 02:18 PM
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Tanist Offline
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Originally Posted By: Hassat Hunter

EDIT; @Tanist: It only displays the last few conversations.


Damn... wish I would have known that when I started. I didn't really notice it until I went back to look for some dialogues when working on some older quests.

The following is an example of a problem with one of the quests in Cyseal. It concerns the cat in the inn.

Click to reveal..
For instance, the one with Sam (?) the cat where he talks about a location and item of his. When you speak to him, he tells you where he thinks it might have been lost, but if you continue on through the game questing in other things and then go back to work on that one, the dialogue is no longer there with that hint and when you go back to him to talk to him, he no longer has anything to say about it.


Anyway, if I would have known that, I would have taken notes or used map markers to write down some basic hints from the conversation.

What this game really needs is an in-game notebook.


Yeah... that is it... how about a book that just allows you to put notes in. Nothing special, just a simple text input system. That way I could type in the date, the person I spoke with and some basic hints/facts I got from their conversation.

Heck, I would even like that better than them giving access to the full dialogue in the entire game.

Last edited by Tanist; 10/07/14 02:20 PM.
Re: 20 points to make a great game even better [Re: JoeBart] #515409
10/07/14 02:26 PM
10/07/14 02:26 PM
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Hiver Offline
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a few things for joebart inanity that are too long to just leave open:
Click to reveal..
Originally Posted By: JoeBart

Nothing in my argument was a strawman. It was addressed to specific points the OP brought up.

You both claim that many people find these features tedious and clunky while thats only your own personal opinion - therefore you use strawman arguments.

Not to mention that splurge in your firts post talking to me, accusing me of various inane things.

Originally Posted By: JoeBart

Originally Posted By: Hiver
Neither of those things are tedious or clunky.

Says you? I find it tremendously tedious and clunky.

Yes, says me and yes - you find them such - which does not mean they are such.

Anyone with modicum of intelligence and reasonable thought would be able to understand the difference between these tow concepts.

I even explained why these features are neither clunky nor tedious and what is their real purpose and how and why they fit in the game design.

You on the other hand can only repeat empty declarative statements like a mindless parrot thinking that having a personal opinion about something makes that a fact.

Originally Posted By: JoeBart

Originally Posted By: Hiver
They are such only to you - personally. That you have the right to think does not actually mean whatever you think is therefore valuable or true.

I've never said my opinions were anything other than my own.


For the fifth or sixth time, nobody is saying you should not have your own opinions. I AM BLOODY SAYING that just because you have an opinion - it does not mean a feature of the game is actually, really clunky or tedious. Even IF it seems as such to you.


Quote:

Originally Posted By: Hiver
Quote:
Since this is a single player game I see no reason not to allow a player to experience the game as they wish within certain constraints (I.E. the game becomes so easy as to eliminate any challenge or sense of discovery whatsoever).

Where in this sentence is the internal coherence and consistency of the setting, the story, the game and its specific gameplay? Where is the importance of the world and characters in it compared to those cheap metagaming desires of two spoiled, devolved lard-asses?


Nothing in that sentence has anything to do with internal consistency of the setting, story, etc.

ouch rolleyes

EXACTLY!!!

Quote:

To imply otherwise would suggest you didn't understand the point. If you want to make the point that it would disrupt such consistency, do so.


... jesus f...
The point is that you did not mention or took in regard the most important features of the game in that post of yours, instead declaring that everything in the game can be changed to suit whatever any player wants so he can "experience the game" as he wishes as long as it doesnt make the game too easy or removes sense of "discovery" and i would rather not even hear what someone like you thinks difficulty or discovery means or should be.

By omitting to even mention, let alone regard the actual core values and features of a game, you directly revealed that you dont think those are important, or that they are secondary and tertiary to retarded notion of players entitlement to "fun and entertainment" - which is something you repeatedly expressed in other threads.

Quote:

He turns his gaze over to the item the character is holding.

Are you that stupid and superficial?
First, item is in the inventory of the other character. Second, identification is not some sort of telepathic magical stunt.

Quote:

Does it matter? You'll be fixing all the items eventually anyway.

Yes it matters and i told you why already which just means you are not capable of understanding simple sentences as long as they dont align with your internal desires or just intentionally refuse to read what im saying before replying to me based on that same motivation.


Quote:
Originally Posted By: Hiver
And how the fact it would be an "option" doesnt detract from the structure as it is now and effect it has on players view and relation to the game world?

It is a simple change that eliminates a lot of tedious clicking.

Which doesnt answer my question at all but simply refuses to address it and just repeats the same pointless one liner.


Quote:

I don't see what this has to do with party individuality. That individuality is accomplished by how you develop and role play your character.

Of course, you answer that as expected, with that repeating superficial simplification so common for your type of mass market player.

You simply dont see and dont want to see how any feature fits with the whole - based on whether it conforms with your superficial desires and notions.


Quote:
I've never played "ass deffect 3" but find it interesting such a title very much piqued your interest.

Its also called a mass defect, you should try it because its designed specifically for you.

Its story doesnt make any sense at all, it goes directly against cores of the setting established in previous games and it even retcones itself and previous sequels along the way, without ever explaining how or why any of that happens as it does.

In return it has a lot of cutscenes and forceful extreme emotional engagement that even soap operas surpass in complexity and depth, plus some really badly made 3d models having vidya gaem secx!!

And you can do it with whoever and whatever you want because liek its opinions man!!

the gameplay is complete shit so it should be perfect for you too. Just brainless action with some fake RPG features that have been streamlined into comatose drooling.


Quote:

Additionally, I never said my opinions were great. I simply said these options would remove some of the tedium, especially after playing the game for many hours.

And you just repeat that same line over and over.
There is no tedium.

Your opinion does not count as a fact.


Quote:

I don't really see this game as a significant departure from Baldurs Gate, Fallout, etc. In essence it is very similar.

So? Am i supposed to guess what does that idea have with anything here?

Quote:
I also fail to see how any of my suggestions make me limited or ignorant.
If you could see that then you wouldnt be limited or so ignorant.


Quote:
Ignorant would be me being unaware these possibilities exist. Limited would suggest I can't think outside the context of the game, or have any thought whatsoever as to what could make the game better.

No, it means that you cannot see outside of that crude box of ease of use (quality of "life hahaha ) features in your head and you will try to distort any game to fit that constricted selfish mold.


Quote:

You clearly don't understand the meaning of "quality of life improvements" within the context of the gaming world. A better term perhaps would be ease of use.

Clearly, right? Just because you think so.

No, i find it especially hilarious attempt to bolster superficiality in a very fake way.



Quote:
Originally Posted By: Hiver
Is there anything at all behind those declaratory empty statements except vacuum of your heads?


Indeed there is.

Yeah...?

Oh, you mean thats all? You just say indeed there is and ... thats it?

:lol:

Quote:

It was simply a list of suggestions from the poster that he thought could improve the game. And I'm sure there will be some folks who mod this into the game. If the developers happen to patch in some of these suggestions that would be great as well.


And i simply replied to that list with my simple answers.

You could have left it at that but of course you cannot stop yourself from reacting without thought or logic or real capability to understand what you are reacting too.


How about you dont address me and never again start screaming at my posts and just stick to the knowledge i have you on ignore for these specific reasons - which doesnt mean i will never read anything you say but that i dont want to see your posts talking to me at all and im willing to let you do whatever you want (more or less) as long as you dont address me with your simpleton strawmans and ad hominems?

Didnt you get that the last time?



Originally Posted By: Tanist


What this game really needs is an in-game notebook.

Yeah... that is it... how about a book that just allows you to put notes in. Nothing special, just a simple text input system. That way I could type in the date, the person I spoke with and some basic hints/facts I got from their conversation.

Heck, I would even like that better than them giving access to the full dialogue in the entire game.


That was already asked - requested. But maybe the devs havent noticed it in all the fuss and hubbub of impending release and tonns of work they had in the last few months of alpha and beta stages.


I would like that too, of course. I can hardly imagine anyone who wouldnt... ahem...

So maybe we could ask a bit more strongly again.
After all its just a small text editor... how hard could that be? Right?

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