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Charm arrows: Do they work? #592034
06/10/16 03:09 AM
06/10/16 03:09 AM
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EinTroll Offline OP
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Simple question: Has anyone who has used Charm arrows had any success?

Because I'm trying to charm Emmie with one such arrow (stolen) and am getting 100% fumble after trying for at least a dozen reloads.

The user is vanilla Sebille, level 5, points in Finesse. If that is of any relevance whatsoever.


Unrelated to this is how does one even talk to Emmie? Must I make my way into the dungeon without triggering hostility with the magisters?


Unless otherwise specified, just an opinion or simple curiosity.
Re: Charm arrows: Do they work? [Re: EinTroll] #592043
06/10/16 03:52 AM
06/10/16 03:52 AM
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Darxim Offline
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Who's Emmie?

Re: Charm arrows: Do they work? [Re: EinTroll] #592046
06/10/16 04:05 AM
06/10/16 04:05 AM
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Kresky Offline
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She must have high Willpower laugh

Re: Charm arrows: Do they work? [Re: EinTroll] #592047
06/10/16 04:13 AM
06/10/16 04:13 AM
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CharityDiary Offline
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It could be that reloading your save doesn't change the outcome of the arrow. The outcome of the next charm attempt or two (or ten) could already be written into your file. If you were unlucky and rolled 10 Fails, then the next 10 charm attempts will fail no matter how many times you reload.

I'm not sure that's how it works; I'm just throwing the possibility out there.

Re: Charm arrows: Do they work? [Re: EinTroll] #592085
06/10/16 08:02 AM
06/10/16 08:02 AM
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Elwyn Offline
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Yes, reloading the game in DOS EE and performing the same magic attack/firing an arrow seemed to surprisinlgly yield the same fail result quite often... (not sure whether it was just my perception but I swear that save-scumming did not work in that case) Maybe you should try executing another action after you reload and then try to fire the arrow?

Re: Charm arrows: Do they work? [Re: EinTroll] #592086
06/10/16 08:03 AM
06/10/16 08:03 AM
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SupaMonkey Offline
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I hope that is the case; otherwise, people will just load/reload until they get the result they want.

Re: Charm arrows: Do they work? [Re: EinTroll] #592089
06/10/16 08:59 AM
06/10/16 08:59 AM
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I'm guessing its like in Xcom where the random number seed is preserved so you'll get the same result each time. Try doing other things just to reset the seed.

Remember you also need to take down her magic armour first.

Re: Charm arrows: Do they work? [Re: SupaMonkey] #592117
06/10/16 01:59 PM
06/10/16 01:59 PM
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CharityDiary Offline
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Originally Posted By: SupaMonkey
I hope that is the case; otherwise, people will just load/reload until they get the result they want.


Oh no! Other people playing a single-player game how they want to! How will you ever live with yourself!?

Re: Charm arrows: Do they work? [Re: SupaMonkey] #592122
06/10/16 03:34 PM
06/10/16 03:34 PM
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Originally Posted By: SupaMonkey
I hope that is the case; otherwise, people will just load/reload until they get the result they want.


My care of that is zero. Most games made will allow one to do just that as well, although it is pretty cool that some games actually do that.

Last edited by Horrorscope; 06/10/16 03:37 PM.
Re: Charm arrows: Do they work? [Re: EinTroll] #592139
06/10/16 06:37 PM
06/10/16 06:37 PM
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EinTroll Offline OP
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I never tried doing the same thing over and over in D:OS 1, nor in 2 until I decided to try using the single charm arrow I had to test what charming a hostile Emmie would result in. If the system in place does guarantee the same result for the same roll, then I've been trying that for nought.

However, I find it hard to understand how a guaranteed 100% to apply effect can even result in a failure. Or how arrow recovery would randomly trigger between 0 and 2 times in the turn and all 3 tries resulting in fumbles.

So I ask, has anyone successfully used a charm arrow?


Unless otherwise specified, just an opinion or simple curiosity.
Re: Charm arrows: Do they work? [Re: EinTroll] #592278
07/10/16 05:52 PM
07/10/16 05:52 PM
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Seelenernter Offline

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I tried the same thing with a charm grenade, 100% chance for success... but only fumbles after several dozens of attempts.
Seems quite a bit of base content is still missing. For example coloring armor of any kind always produces a "crafting level to low"-message for me, without that skill even existing (afaik).

Last edited by Seelenernter; 07/10/16 05:53 PM.

Think for yourself! Or others will do it...
Re: Charm arrows: Do they work? [Re: EinTroll] #592297
07/10/16 08:41 PM
07/10/16 08:41 PM
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I've tried the charm arrows a few times myself, perhaps 4 times. I've never had a success.

Re: Charm arrows: Do they work? [Re: Bhazor] #592323
08/10/16 12:58 AM
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Originally Posted By: Bhazor
Remember you also need to take down her magic armour first.


This.

If the character has any magic armor, the charm will fail even though the arrow says 100% chance. That is the same with all effects (magic or physical, blocked by corresponding armor).

If she has no magic armor then ... maybe anti save scum feature baked in or you are just really unlucky?

Re: Charm arrows: Do they work? [Re: Darxim] #592341
08/10/16 03:17 AM
08/10/16 03:17 AM
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Sotomonte Offline

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Originally Posted By: Darxim
Who's Emmie?

Click to reveal..
She is the friend of Buddy! laugh


Fire and wind come from the sky, from the gods of the sky.
But Crom is your god, Crom and he lives in the earth.
Re: Charm arrows: Do they work? [Re: CharityDiary] #592406
08/10/16 10:58 AM
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Originally Posted By: CharityDiary
Originally Posted By: SupaMonkey
I hope that is the case; otherwise, people will just load/reload until they get the result they want.


Oh no! Other people playing a single-player game how they want to! How will you ever live with yourself!?


Your argument suggests that the devs intentionally leave in exploits and allow the players to choose whether or not to use them.

Terrible idea.

Re: Charm arrows: Do they work? [Re: EinTroll] #592408
08/10/16 11:15 AM
08/10/16 11:15 AM
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Kalrakh Offline

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They don't intentionally leave in exploits, but they offer mechanics wich can get easily exploited and whose exploits are hard to prevent, if you don't want to cripple the mechanic?

Re: Charm arrows: Do they work? [Re: SupaMonkey] #592411
08/10/16 12:44 PM
08/10/16 12:44 PM
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Seelenernter Offline

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Originally Posted By: SupaMonkey

Your argument suggests that the devs intentionally leave in exploits and allow the players to choose whether or not to use them.

Terrible idea.


And you try to force your opinion on others.

Terrible idea.


Think for yourself! Or others will do it...
Re: Charm arrows: Do they work? [Re: EinTroll] #592426
08/10/16 05:23 PM
08/10/16 05:23 PM
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Posts: 528
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EinTroll Offline OP
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I think the answer to the original point of the topic has been given:

Charm seems to not work.

Additionally: If something says it's resisted by magic armour, then it'll only work if the target has no magic armour. But most people already know that and it's pretty much a given that when we're talking about applying effects, we're implying that armour is no longer in the way.


Lastly, as a general rule, we're supposed to test the game while it's in alhpa/beta. This means everything from playing as intended to looking for edge cases that break the game. And everything in between.


Unless otherwise specified, just an opinion or simple curiosity.
Re: Charm arrows: Do they work? [Re: EinTroll] #592536
09/10/16 07:45 PM
09/10/16 07:45 PM
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Originally Posted By: EinTroll
I think the answer to the original point of the topic has been given:

Charm seems to not work.

Additionally: If something says it's resisted by magic armour, then it'll only work if the target has no magic armour. But most people already know that and it's pretty much a given that when we're talking about applying effects, we're implying that armour is no longer in the way.


Lastly, as a general rule, we're supposed to test the game while it's in alhpa/beta. This means everything from playing as intended to looking for edge cases that break the game. And everything in between.


The reason I raised magic armor issue is to try to narrow down whether there was a bug (charm arrow not working when it was supposed to) or a feature that went unnoticed (charm blocked by magic armor or a characters immunity to the effect). Because magic armor is new do DOS2, some people may not be up to speed on its gameplay mechanics, or forget about it. I know I did during some fights in my first play through.

Charm arrows worked in my game, though I did not try them against Emmie so I can not address that specific use. Just trying to get all the details so the Larian folks can determine what (if anything) caused the bug, or how to make the reasons for charm failing (where intentional in the game) clearer.

Last edited by BemusedBear; 09/10/16 07:47 PM.
Re: Charm arrows: Do they work? [Re: EinTroll] #592734
11/10/16 08:08 AM
11/10/16 08:08 AM
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Anyone tried charming other source hounds? Maybe the underlying process that makes them into source hounds is too powerful for the temporary charm to overcome.

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