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Could be a good original idea #326671
22/01/06 06:07 PM
22/01/06 06:07 PM
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TheDivine Offline OP
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While watching a quite boring program lately i came up with this idea:

Maybe mana replenishment could be different in certain areas. In the program I was watching, they explained mana is life energy thats in every human/plant/animal. Certain things had more 'mana' then others. Like some sacred rock and stuff. Well why not make that, when you're in a giant forest full of old trees standing there for centuries, theres more mana from the things around you that the better mage/intelligent/spiritual could absorb this energies. Or while being near an old ancient dragon, not a hostile 1 becouse they could block the absorbsion, you could gain more mana. At certain areas such as sewers full of thuggs you would get less mana or at a basic slow rate.



plz post a post too

greetings,

thadivine


Re: Could be a good original idea #326672
22/01/06 06:46 PM
22/01/06 06:46 PM
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Macbeth Offline

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I voted 'seems ok'. It could work, but it might not.
Btw, what kind of program was that ...


I am in blood
Stepp'd in so far, that, should I wade no more,
Returning were as tedious as go o'er.
Re: Could be a good original idea #326673
22/01/06 06:47 PM
22/01/06 06:47 PM
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TheDivine Offline OP
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some program my parents wanted to watch while i was eating.


Re: Could be a good original idea #326674
22/01/06 06:51 PM
22/01/06 06:51 PM
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Macbeth Offline

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I mean, was it about fantasy, or was this about people who actually believe there's mana in people and plants?


I am in blood
Stepp'd in so far, that, should I wade no more,
Returning were as tedious as go o'er.
Re: Could be a good original idea #326675
22/01/06 07:54 PM
22/01/06 07:54 PM
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Where time stands still
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Where time stands still
You forgot the 'potatoe'-option ...

‹bereil


Brain: an apparatus with which we think we think.

Ambrose Bierce
Re: Could be a good original idea #326676
22/01/06 10:20 PM
22/01/06 10:20 PM
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TheDivine Offline OP
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nooooooooo! im sorry....ill be...gone ...

program was about ppl who believed, not fantasy


Re: Could be a good original idea #326677
23/01/06 09:11 AM
23/01/06 09:11 AM
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hmmm, NOX had something a bit like this

anyway I didn't vote, because I can't.
I mean, you could figure out what I voted and then take that as 'this will be in the new game'

Think about what the *real* function of mana is in RPG games.

Re: Could be a good original idea #326678
23/01/06 12:15 PM
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Macbeth Offline

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Mana -> magic. Right?


I am in blood
Stepp'd in so far, that, should I wade no more,
Returning were as tedious as go o'er.
Re: Could be a good original idea #326679
23/01/06 02:13 PM
23/01/06 02:13 PM
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TheDivine Offline OP
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ye, magical energie


Re: Could be a good original idea #326680
23/01/06 04:59 PM
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I think its brilliant

Re: Could be a good original idea #326681
23/01/06 06:19 PM
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Could disturb the balance though.


I am in blood
Stepp'd in so far, that, should I wade no more,
Returning were as tedious as go o'er.
Re: Could be a good original idea #326682
24/01/06 08:25 AM
24/01/06 08:25 AM
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sigh

Re: Could be a good original idea #326683
24/01/06 12:44 PM
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Quote:

sigh



And what are we supposed to make of that? Don't tell me my brilliant 'mana -> magic' answer was incorrect!


I am in blood
Stepp'd in so far, that, should I wade no more,
Returning were as tedious as go o'er.
Re: Could be a good original idea #326684
24/01/06 01:41 PM
24/01/06 01:41 PM
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TheDivine Offline OP
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did i say something wrong?


Re: Could be a good original idea #326685
24/01/06 01:59 PM
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I think he means mana is the means to produce a form of magic.

Magic itself is performed when the player either reads a spell or perform one silently.

So how about this idea.

There are 3 levels of spells..one type reqiures you to make gestures for it to work...the second type requires you to say the incantaion aloud, the third will require you to point at the target and the fourth will happen automatically becuase your mind power is such you need not make any body movement or sound.

What i mean is this:

This is what your character will do to do when you cast the spell...you need not memorise the varying body movement or the incantation for the spell to work.





Re: Could be a good original idea #326686
24/01/06 08:40 PM
24/01/06 08:40 PM
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Als antwoord op:

There are 3 levels of spells..one type reqiures you to make gestures for it to work...the second type requires you to say the incantaion aloud, the third will require you to point at the target and the fourth will happen automatically becuase your mind power is such you need not make any body movement or sound.




uhh, you say 3 types of spells and you give 4 types, but thats not the point!
i got another type: you need to use objects and stuff, like candals pentagrams crosses all that kinda stuff

btw i voted nice idea


Re: Could be a good original idea #326687
26/01/06 09:15 PM
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isorun:

Yeah my maths are terrible.!!!!

But can you explain how your idea works?

I assume it would be for non-combat spells only..as you would waste time having to draw signs and the such before you can cast a spell.

But what if we take your idea to summon beings from another world..a skill which may give you hints in quests or may trade with you(sounds silly) but im drawing inspiration from .

Or they may open skill paths for you.

Re: Could be a good original idea #326688
28/01/06 08:46 AM
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like, you draw a pentagram, light the candles and say a spell and depending on wich spell you use, you summon a powerfull being(like a demon), a very powerfull object (like a I dont know uhh Demon Sword?) or a demon/undead merchant offering 150% of the original value of your stuff and selling things for 75% procent of their value.




Re: Could be a good original idea #326689
28/01/06 08:55 AM
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TheDivine Offline OP
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if you ask me it doesnt really matter, as long as you fully believe what you do should work


Re: Could be a good original idea #326690
01/12/07 10:45 PM
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In theory, it's a brilliant idea but when it comes to practical, unless the game employs a lot of strategy and stuff, this "idea" seems somewhat complicated to program. The game needs to "remember" the mana regeneration rate for the different walkpoints the player passes through. Plus, you've got to ask yourself: what benefits or disadvantages would implementing this bring forth?

Unless it's limited to only certain key areas, I think it's better laid off to rest.

Re: Could be a good original idea #326691
02/12/07 04:11 AM
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The game needs to "remember" the mana regeneration rate for the different walkpoints the player passes through.

The game would have to change music and environmental sounds (etc) when changing areas anyway, so changing regeneration rate should not be too hard, as long as it is constant within each major area. If there are going to be variations (a cursed building with a lower regeneration than the surrounding forest, or an oasis with higher rate than the desert) perhaps those areas could be designed as a mini-level.

Whether you would want to vary the regeneration rate (effecting specific character builds much more than others) or if this feature would be the best use of resources during development are other matters entirely.


Unless it's limited to only certain key areas, I think it's better laid off to rest.

It would probably be limited to key areas anyway. You could get really detailed and have the recovery rate differ if (for example) your character was walking on a stone pathway rather than the nearby grass, but practically only larger difference would be noticed by most people. Even then, potions could be the main source of mana (at least during battles, and depending on price / availability), with people not paying a lot of attention to their mana levels while walking around exploring.

This could be an interesting difference between classes or races, but in that case you would have to make sure there were areas that each character type would find easier or harder, or there would need to be a party, so individual strengths and weaknesses could be balanced. This could more easily be applied to opponents (ie provoke a magical swamp monster into leaving the water and it could be much easier to defeat), though it wouldn't necessarily be the best way to differentiate them or modify their behaviour.

Re: Could be a good original idea #326692
02/12/07 04:28 PM
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Quote:

The game needs to "remember" the mana regeneration rate for the different walkpoints the player passes through.

The game would have to change music and environmental sounds (etc) when changing areas anyway, so changing regeneration rate should not be too hard, as long as it is constant within each major area. If there are going to be variations (a cursed building with a lower regeneration than the surrounding forest, or an oasis with higher rate than the desert) perhaps those areas could be designed as a mini-level.




Oh, that's true. But that's a lot of extra programming, isn't it? After all, aren't there a lot of places in a 3d gameworld?

Quote:


Whether you would want to vary the regeneration rate (effecting specific character builds much more than others) or if this feature would be the best use of resources during development are other matters entirely.


Again, sounds like even more programming especially when you want to take into account the various character builds, classes, skills, etc. Geez...

Yeah, I was actually thinking more along the development resources. Unless this feature is part of a larger system which affects spells and other abilities, it does seem kinda unwarranted. But it could be a very special feature that's given to the player as a reward.

Or a temporary special feature like a mana booster: you click on a device and it'll reward with both vitality and mana regen speed-up. Or this could even be a skill that you can learn.


Quote:


Unless it's limited to only certain key areas, I think it's better laid off to rest.

It would probably be limited to key areas anyway. You could get really detailed and have the recovery rate differ if (for example) your character was walking on a stone pathway rather than the nearby grass, but practically only larger difference would be noticed by most people. Even then, potions could be the main source of mana (at least during battles, and depending on price / availability), with people not paying a lot of attention to their mana levels while walking around exploring.



Whoa... that sounds really detailed! But is it really necessary? It sounds like overkill, a trademark of some games where they spend so much $$$ on developing some "super-powerful system" but the plot is barely there or the rest of the game is just plain boring. I guess it's up to Larian to balance it out so the system is detailed yet doesn't collapse under all that intricate complexity.

I'd prefer having just potions or some skills that would help speed up mana-regen, that's all. And oh, while we're on the topic of regeneration, I wonder IF Larian could also have some basic vitality regeneration as well. I recall that vitality regen was also a skill under Survivors but perhaps, all characters could have a basic stat for this.

Quote:



This could be an interesting difference between classes or races, but in that case you would have to make sure there were areas that each character type would find easier or harder, or there would need to be a party, so individual strengths and weaknesses could be balanced. This could more easily be applied to opponents (ie provoke a magical swamp monster into leaving the water and it could be much easier to defeat), though it wouldn't necessarily be the best way to differentiate them or modify their behaviour.




Hmmm... I agree that could sound interesting. Although it sounds kinda complicated to me, if Larian manages to implement that, good luck! ^_^

Though I'd prefer Larian program abilities or skills which would have similar results but which could be applied to different situations and which would have many purposes.

Speaking of stuff to put in DD 2, I just thought of a mana-sucking trap which drains the opponent's mana and stores it so that you can use it: viola! Your insta-mana factory!

Re: Could be a good original idea #326693
02/12/07 11:54 PM
02/12/07 11:54 PM
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But that's a lot of extra programming, isn't it? After all, aren't there a lot of places in a 3d gameworld?

Just changing the regeneration rate would not depend on the number of regions. Once you have a variable in place to modify the base regeneration, it would just be a question of changing that variable at each transition.

However, balancing the game for mage characters with a variable regeneration rate would be much more work.

Also, conceptually this idea works well for nature based magic (wind, lightning, etc) but the spell system would have to be designed from the start with this in mind. Any magic that isn't manipulating natural forces (teleportation, summoning) at least implies that the mana required isn't necessarily coming from natural sources.


Yeah, I was actually thinking more along the development resources. Unless this feature is part of a larger system which affects spells and other abilities, it does seem kinda unwarranted.

Agreed. It is a good idea (balancing issues aside) and feasible, but not very practical.


Or a temporary special feature like a mana booster: you click on a device and it'll reward with both vitality and mana regen speed-up. Or this could even be a skill that you can learn.

In Beyond Divinity, regeneration was a secondary stat, which determined your health recovery rate and, to a lesser extent, your mana recovery rate (intelligence was the primary factor for that).

There could be temporary or permanent regeneration modifiers, but if we are going to evolve away from the original idea, I think other stats might be more appropriate and have less potential balancing issues. In DD, after I picked up the Halberd of the Rock in the cursed abbey, I assumed the lack of stamina regeneration was part of the abbey's curse, rather than the halberd. A lack of stamina could hurt melee character more than mages or archers in open areas, and vise versa in confined spaces, but I don't think this would be a big balancing problem. A swamp could be covered with a poisonous mist; mages might be more vulnerable to poison than high hit point warriors, but would presumably have healing or shield spells to compensate.
Similar large scale area effects could be good features in DD2, assuming they were designed well.

I vaguely remember an old console game (Ultima?) where certain areas were blocked off with 4 different types of traps. Some spots you could get to if your characters had enough hit points and you you made sure you took the shortest route, but with others you had to reach a certain shrine (or something) to get a protective ward (brand or maybe tattoo, IIRC) so you would no longer take damage from that type of trap.
Unlike that game I would not want this to be used as an artificial way to direct the player along a path, but it could make exploring more interesting, or allow certain areas to be easier or harder depending on your previous actions (help an innocent lizardman accused of a crime and the merchants in that town might double their prices for you, but on reaching the swamp town, you might be shown the herb to counter the poisonous mist).


Whoa... that sounds really detailed! But is it really necessary? It sounds like overkill

There are games where your walking speed or the sounds of your footsteps vary based on the surface you are on. My point was that something similar could be done for mana regeneration, but that it would not be very noticeable, and so not worth the effort.

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