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#660349 01/03/20 09:51 PM
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Even though I'm of opinion this is actually DOS3 named BG3 for marketing purposes, because I love the BG franchise I can list some minor improvements that could make the game more close to BG1 and BG2:

- darker colors and darker tone of environment (because the demo looks like a cartoon, all sunny with beautiful sand beaches),
- the blood is to light-red, the color of the blood needs to be darker,
- trying to get the visuals of dark fantasy (please devs just compare the colors used in BG1 and BG2, or see the colors used in Diablo 1 and 2),
- avoid environments that look like cartoony fantasy
- try to get more horror style of visuals
- please try to remove/alter/reduce all DOS elements in the game (like the path to striking the enemy, loot boxes)
- avoid sunny sunshine areas, it really looks ridiculous for a dark fantasy game
- avoid beautiful beaches with beautiful sand shores it looks stupid and goofy
- please implement body dismemberment animations when enemies are killed (like BG had)
- please avoid all DOS area effects and combinations (like setting oil on fire etc., its stupid and gimmicky, does not add to core gameplay)
- please have a streamlined strong dark fantasy story, please avoid attempts of being funny because DOS jokes were always lame and immersion breaking
- please remove the stupid jumping perk/skill you have in your "BG3" it looks rediculous
- GENERALLY PLEASE DO NOT MAKE A PARODY OF BG1 AND BG2, THOSE GAMES WERE NOT INTENDED TO BE FUNNY.

Thanks.

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Baldur's Gate Iand II were "dark fantasy" games? Enters Minsc...

If there's something that's goofy and silly it's gib animations. Critical hit with a dagger: explode!!! Beaches on the other hand are neither stupid nor goofy. Never been to one? You should try.

Being able to set oil on fire (like you could when playing D&D as a tabletop game) can't be stupid and gimmicky. It's more true to D&D than BG could be (due to technical limitations).

The teaser with the gruesome transformation from human to mindflayer seems to hint a pretty dark story. No fun was spotted there. It was pretty dark and gruesome. The new cinematics were partly sinister and all epic. Didn't you see?

Wait: BG I and II were not intended to be funny? Haven't you read any banter between companions? Haven't you gained Lilarcor? Haven't you met Noober?

I swear most of those self-proclaimed BG experts seem to have forgotten what BG I and II actually were like. They were full of silly moments and goofyness and Helm shall smite me if those weren't intended to be funny.


Last edited by Boeroer; 01/03/20 10:10 PM.
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Yes, Larian's game is truly just DOS3 done in D&D, and not a Baldur's Gate game.

The UI, mouse cursors, animations in Larian's D&D DOS2 clone are all strictly D:OS2 and have no place in a Baldur's Gate game that is trying to be a Baldur's Gate game and not a DOS2 clone.

The goofy DOS2 action animations for everything in Larian's D&D DOS2 clone really take away from the immersion and sense of integrity in the gameplay footage they showed. All those DOS2 animations are completely insincere and are designed to be such, meant to present the animations as comedic mockeries of their underlying actions to create a sense of light-heartedness and 'it's all play-pretending' to everything that happens.

That's the DOS light-hearted style. And I find it extremely distasteful in DOS and other games that do the same thing, but it is especially incongruous with Baldur's Gate's more serious atmosphere, where the comedy came from some oddball characters and not the primary layer of the game's environment.

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Originally Posted by Delicieuxz
The goofy DOS2 action animations for everything in Larian's D&D DOS2 clone really take away from the immersion and sense of integrity


But the stiff and wooden animations of the old games were full of vigor and personality?

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Originally Posted by Boeroer
Baldur's Gate Iand II were "dark fantasy" games? Enters Minsc...

If there's something that's goofy and silly it's gib animations. Critical hit with a dagger: explode!!! Beaches on the other hand are neither stupid nor goofy. Never been to one? You should try.

Being able to set oil on fire (like you could when playing D&D as a tabletop game) can't be stupid and gimmicky. It's more true to D&D than BG could be (due to technical limitations).

The teaser with the gruesome transformation from human to mindflayer seems to hint a pretty dark story. No fun was spotted there. It was pretty dark and gruesome. The new cinematics were partly sinister and all epic. Didn't you see?

Wait: BG I and II were not intended to be funny? Haven't you read any banter between companions? Haven't you gained Lilarcor? Haven't you met Noober?

I swear most of those self-proclaimed BG experts seem to have forgotten what BG I and II actually were like. They were full of silly moments and goofyness and Helm shall smite me if those weren't intended to be funny.



Ok mister fanboy I see that you absolutely love the BG3 demo and for you everything is obviously just great and there is no room for improvment.

Yes, BG1 and 2 had some humor in it, but it wasn't over the top and the overall game was dark fantasy.

The humor used in DOS games is all about parody of some old style crpg games. I don't like it and don't want to see it in BG3, neither do other people.

I mean, in DOS2 you have a talking lizard and a talking skeleton as companions. That's parody imo.

I'm just putting down some suggestions how the game could look better and have the BG vibe, which it obviously doesnt in its current state.

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Originally Posted by Nickolaidas
Originally Posted by Delicieuxz
The goofy DOS2 action animations for everything in Larian's D&D DOS2 clone really take away from the immersion and sense of integrity


But the stiff and wooden animations of the old games were full of vigor and personality?


No, but were better then DOS3 goofy animations.

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Originally Posted by kyrthorsen
I mean, in DOS2 you have a talking lizard and a talking skeleton as companions. That's parody imo.


You do realize both of those are a thing in D&D … right?

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Originally Posted by Nickolaidas
Originally Posted by Delicieuxz
The goofy DOS2 action animations for everything in Larian's D&D DOS2 clone really take away from the immersion and sense of integrity


But the stiff and wooden animations of the old games were full of vigor and personality?


Did I say that they were, or that that's even what I'm advocating for in a Baldur's Gate game? No. Baldur's Gate's animations are serviceable for the time they were made. It was possible for BioWare to create with that technology animations that convey goofiness and insincerity just like DOS animations do, but BioWare didn't do that.

What I said in my previous post is that the DOS animation histrionics are designed to appear insincere and like a comedic mockery of their underlying actions, and are not suitable for a Baldur's Gate game.

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Originally Posted by Nickolaidas
Originally Posted by kyrthorsen
I mean, in DOS2 you have a talking lizard and a talking skeleton as companions. That's parody imo.


You do realize both of those are a thing in D&D … right?


As well as the fact that DOS is not D&D... right?

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Originally Posted by Nickolaidas
Originally Posted by kyrthorsen
I mean, in DOS2 you have a talking lizard and a talking skeleton as companions. That's parody imo.


You do realize both of those are a thing in D&D … right?


Please name one crpg game in which you have lizards and skeletons as companions.

You are missing the point - the point is that DOS is made in a sort of parody style of visuals and story.

BG on the other hand, was very serious about its story and its characters, there was real depth in those.

I mean just compare a character like Minsc in BG2 to ANY character in DOS and DOS2. Characters in BG had weight, in DOS they are just clowns.

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I only sort of agree. I think the only things I'd like to see are:

Spell incantations and cool effects (where are they)
Drop the DOS animations and sounds and move to a more serious style. (i.e. jumping should not be like spiderman loaded down with a ton of bricks etc).
Update the UI to be unique
Update item assets so they are not pretty much an exact clone of DOS.

I recently played a demo of a turn-based fully D&D 5e faithful game (Solasta crown of the magister) and can say without a doubt it is the game to beat in this space. But they lack the multi-player.

One test for me was if my wife will play with me. She always enjoyed playing BG co-op and loved the game. She also played NWN with me too. If she can't get into this and enjoy it, then I likely won't be playing much of it. I tried to play co-op with her with DOS and she could not get into it, so we never made it past the first chapter. (I did play the game through but sorely missed the enjoyment of playing together). I'm afraid if its too similar to DOS she will likely not play this either.


Last edited by WizardPus; 01/03/20 11:01 PM.
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Oh, I got the impression the environment was pretty much all still DOS2 assets except for like the illithid area and Selune banners. Felt just like Fort Joy.

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Originally Posted by Saerain
Oh, I got the impression the environment was pretty much all still DOS2 assets except for like the illithid area and Selune banners. Felt just like Fort Joy.


Totally the same as Fort Joy. Sad.

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Originally Posted by Boeroer
Baldur's Gate Iand II were "dark fantasy" games? Enters Minsc...

If there's something that's goofy and silly it's gib animations. Critical hit with a dagger: explode!!! Beaches on the other hand are neither stupid nor goofy. Never been to one? You should try.

Being able to set oil on fire (like you could when playing D&D as a tabletop game) can't be stupid and gimmicky. It's more true to D&D than BG could be (due to technical limitations).

The teaser with the gruesome transformation from human to mindflayer seems to hint a pretty dark story. No fun was spotted there. It was pretty dark and gruesome. The new cinematics were partly sinister and all epic. Didn't you see?

Wait: BG I and II were not intended to be funny? Haven't you read any banter between companions? Haven't you gained Lilarcor? Haven't you met Noober?

I swear most of those self-proclaimed BG experts seem to have forgotten what BG I and II actually were like. They were full of silly moments and goofyness and Helm shall smite me if those weren't intended to be funny.



I wish I could like and support every one of your posts, lol.

Yes, there are plenty of ways in which the game can be improved. And there are similarities with DOS2, which is undeniable (That said, BG3 is a huge graphical upgrade from DOS2, which I'm playing right now) but saying that it is not a DND game is just entirely false.

I agree that some skills and animations look cartoonish (Jump and Dash specially) and I would like to see that reworked into something else. Incantations and runes for spellcasters would also be on the right track, but all of that aside, Larian is doing an excellent job and I can't wait to play the game!


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Nah they shouldn't cater to the edge lords, who still think everything has to be dark and gritty, I like my games colourful and pretty.
If you thin DND is dark fantasy than you really know nothing about it.

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I disagree... With pretty much all of this. Did you actually play the original ganes? This demo was so dark and so focused on the occalt that im tempted to not even bother with it. It feels like a goth teenager wrote all of the stories for each revealed character. There seems like no effort at all for anyone that likes to play good aligned characters. That is worrisome to me.

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Originally Posted by Pharaun159
I disagree... With pretty much all of this. Did you actually play the original ganes? This demo was so dark and so focused on the occalt that im tempted to not even bother with it. It feels like a goth teenager wrote all of the stories for each revealed character. There seems like no effort at all for anyone that likes to play good aligned characters. That is worrisome to me.


I feel you! Except the wizard everyone else is likely to be evil inclined. Perhaps there's some nuance to the warlock but we'll see.

Last edited by Goldberry; 02/03/20 03:01 AM.
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I think they are biding their time for when things will turn darker and grittier. The first trailer they showed, showed a bright view of the city of Baldur's Gate and the brightness of the city with the member of the flaming fist. Things turned grey and darker when he turned into a mind flayer, thus indicating that must have triggered a turn of events.

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I want this game to be like DOS2. Baldur's gate games sucked and DOS2 is selling a lot. It's so much better. Games should have both light and dark elements, grimdark is boring.

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Baldurs Gate was always to me (or forgotten realms in general) a very dirty, harsh nearby mediaeval world.
In Baldurs Gate 1 you start safely, but after Gorion was murdered, you're on your own, you discover a world full of maniacs and danger. One of the first companions is Xzar (take a look on his portrait and you know what iam talking about!).
In Baldurs Gate 2 youre directly in trouble, being tortured in an laboratory also full of maniacs, cruelties and after you come out you're again discovering a world you dont know anything about. In the first few hours you're going to the slums in the tavern, and there are a bunch of drunken, rude people, some grim dwarfs, slaves, prostitutes, dogfights - its just not a nice place!
You also have it in Neverwinter Nights for example, where a plague is going on, everything is dangerous and dirty.
On the other side you also have some rightgeous knights fighting for good, but still in a bad bad world.

Yes there was humor, but it was not always present and very optional.

Last edited by ThreeL; 02/03/20 07:52 AM.
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