STILL!!! Way to go Larian!!

Good news for sequels and expansions.

It deserves all the praise it gets

We all have our reasons keeping this a top as long as we can!

yay congrats

Hoping for more Divinity games, maybe a Divinity 3, but wouldn't mind if Larian got the chance to work on somthing else too. Maybe a sci-fi game.

on metacritics it is among the highest rated pc games of all time now. user ratings (the ones that matter!)

last time I checked it had 500 votes and an average score of 9.3

THIS is a statement from the fans guys!

http://www.metacritic.com/game/pc/divinity-original-sin

I'm a bit surprised to be honest, that even for my region it is the #1 selling game on Steam even 2 weeks later. DOS is a niche game but for it to garner excellent reviews and solid sales is unexpected, i'm extremely happy for Larian and the CRPG genre. I hope this will be the turn around for the future of better games and passionate developers. Looking forward to more magic from Larian.

When this game is working its magic. When I save and it crashes(still) no so much. However, I'm actually playing with a smile on my face for most of the time. Love it to bits.

Yay for #1!

Some unorganized comments:

-Try looking at the most helpful user reviews on Steam. Here's a fun game: drink a shot every time you load another page of reviews and do NOT see any red. Stop drinking once you see red--you win. If you can win the game without passing out... you've a far stronger gut than I.

-DOS is not the highest-rated (userscore) of all time on metacritic. Only the highest-rated new release (games released in last 90 days). It's still pretty high up there on the all-time list, but it's closer to being in the top 30 or 40.

-For kicks I checked out the handful of negative user reviews on metacritic. Most of them are people who literally only signed up to write a negative DOS review, and nothing else. The acts of spiteful competitors? Clearly, it's not the work of people who care about games.

-DOS' success seems to be coming purely from word-of-mouth. As far as I can tell, Larian has ZERO advertising budget. Hell, most of the big gaming sites haven't even reviewed the game (yet?), nor have most of the big youtube personalities. The big Wasteland, Torment and Eternity kickstarters may have demonstrated that countless gamers still want classic-style CRPGs.... but Original Sin has demonstrated that we still LOVE them.

If you exclude games that don't have many raters (ie less than 50 or so), D:OS has the highest user-rating of any PC game in the last 5-6 years. But yes, not all-time.

I have to say, i really understand it. Original Sin is really Awesome and definitively ONE of the best RPGs the Last Years... but even so, i hope we will get a prequel for Divinity 2, because that`s still my favorite of the Divinity Series. Maybe they can work on Divninity Series like Nintendo with The Legend of Zelda, which get frequently 3D and Isometric Zelda Games =)
Maybe we can get 3D Divinitys like Ego Draconis and then like Original Sin. I would love to see that!

Beside: I don`t care about Metacritic... even if it was really bad rated i would love Divinity Original Sin!

Didn't Swen, at some point, essentially say that the only reason Divinity 2 was a third-person action RPG is because they were forced into it by publishers? Maybe I'm wrong about that, and someone who follows things more closely will correct me if so.

Creating another game like Divinity 2 would probably require a AAA budget (many times D:OS's) which would require a console version, which would require a "next gen" (meaning Xbox One / PS4 compatible) engine, etc etc. Whole thing would probably require a publisher too, since you'd need the AAA budget upfront. From what Swen has said in various interviews, I get the feeling that's not a road they're particularly interested in going down again.

Congratulations developers

Well deserved imho.

Go, Larian! Go, D:OS! hopefully this is only the beginning!

Great news ! Congrats !!

When Larian talks about D2 they don't really seem to be happy with the game.

Which makes sense, because while it was still fun, it was nowhere near the game that DD and D:OS are - although I guess LightningYu disagrees.

I think by now it is obvious that Swen's strategy has been a tremendous success. Make a deep, funpacked, polished coop RPG and the money will roll in. Bravo! I'm glad to have been part of crowdfunding it and look forward to years of gaming with Larians lovechildren.

#1-selling game on Steam for 7 days straight (ever since release), even beating out this Left 4 Dead 2 for $5 sale atm.

It wasn't number 1 seller for a few hours when the PayDay 2 Shotgun DLC came out, but after 4hrs or so D:OS was back on top.

I didn`t say that. I only said, that`s my Favorite - not, thats the better Game. But also i wouldn`t say such Words like "it was nowhere near". I would say, that Divinity 2 wasn`t a almost perfect Game like Divinity OS, but you have to agree, for a 3D RPG it had MUCH Potential. And i think, if they give it a try and carry some of the Features from D:OS - this could be such a epic Game.

How do you sort by region?

And I think it's only been one week, but still impressive. Any news on sales figures, do you think they've broken even yet?

I think they have. Swen said they were almost there on Thursday, and since it is still #1 on Steam it must have broken even by now.

Gaming community

For your number 1, I'm tempted to give it a red review but the content would be otherwise. Just to stop having tipsy people.

I have suggested to Kripparrian to play D:OS and I'm hoping he would pick it up. He is playing Grim Dawn lately which is another indie game so he might pick this up.

It's been at 1 too during the sale, when it was 20% off for quite some time before release.

http://tools.garry.tv/steamchart/?show=230230&range=30

might be handy

More than 7 days (almost) straight on #1! Congrats, Larian!

I hope that means great sales numbers and at least one major expansion and maybe some smaller free DLC stuff for D:OS in the future...

incorporating the kickstarter stretch goals is the first thing I have in mind especially the schedules and companion personalities.

I was waiting this moment sooo long,and at last Larian becomes really famous studio!!
+1 to henryv, implmenting of Phantom`s Forest Dungeon ,personalities,companions and other small cut features should be done,but first let`s Latrian fix most annoying bugs,crashes and make lot optimisation and then they should have big rest undoubtely

Congrats to all the hard working people in Larian for getting the money and praise they deserve and congratulations to us all the fans that stood behind Swen,Kirill and all the developers giving our support and being honest with them as they have been honest with us.

D:OS is now also Top Seller #1 on GOG

Congrats Larian. While enjoying the game, i can't wait for you guys next project.

I hope you guys do well enough to split off teams with one team adding and improving content to D:OS (new editor features and content packs, expansions, patching and polishing, tweaking and improving) and one for an entirely new project surpassing D:OS in depth and content.

Still #1 wooo!!!!

Don't worry Larian.. when winter sales come you see big monies. Hope you have enough money for Divine Divinity 3. And most of all, polish your games more . You will be no doubt be like CD Projekt Red with your level of support.

Congrats!!

I hope with this they actually save up enough money to fully pay the next game in advance ( i.e. 4-5m or more). That would definitely take some of the pressure off the studio, though stay aware of complacency then

For me what I would really like to see is for Larian to work on a more serious RPG. The Divinity Series is great and I love the humor, but I really think a well written more serious game would do Larian well. Maybe work together with an author like Brent Weeks (lightbringer series) to create an add-on to D:OS, I think the different color principal in that serious could really lend itself well to the D:OS combat engine.

In the Eurogamer interview last week, Swen did say he has been trying to get a license for some RPG franchise, though he didn't say which.

After D:OS, they may have a decent chance.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2...larian-studios-fastest-selling-game-ever

I *love* D:OS. Please make an expansion, sequel or new IP with this engine. I will support it on kick starter. Take my money!

Over two weeks top of sales chart for Steam is very impressive, I hope they are raking in money to put towards their next project which I hope is a Sci-Fi isometric space-visiting multiple varied worlds orientated RPG.

A lot of the bigger RPG developers tend to split their teams between fantasy RPG series and Sci-Fi one whether that's ones like Dragon Age/Mass Effect from Bioware or Witcher/Cyberpunk CDPR ect. I am hoping Larian earn enough to do the same with Divinity filling the fantasy role and then also starting a Sci-Fi one but keeping with the isometric deep RPG experiences.

The success and popularity shown so far on Steam also bodes well for Torment, Pillers of Eternity and Wasteland 2.

Universal acclaim on metacritic as well, personally I feel it's well deserved.

Ironically this is my first Larian game I've ever played, but thanks to being highly impressed with the quality of the gameplay I'm downloading Dragon Commander as I type.

Steam is being slow though...

Larian should stick to what they do best (i.e. to complex, isometric RPG's). Although the new IP and especially the Sci-Fi setting are welcomed.

After what our Red Devils did and now seeing what a 40 people belgian developers team can do ... Proud to be Belgian

Imarion

Yup, definitely hoping they can now make a new RPG without Kickstarter, and thus all the related issues and entitlement-fringes that come with it.
Sometimes I'm ashamed to be a gamer if I see my fellow KS'ers being worse than producers. What point is KS is we're worse than the thing it's supposed to help against. Really?

There are 5 people I know who is waiting for a sale.

Regarding divinity 3, there is a suggestion thread before. Full of ideas. Might want to check on that:
(WARNING: SPOILER ALERT)
http://www.larian.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Main=27954&Number=450451#Post450451

You fight single people with generalizations? You are actually not better than them...

Most kickstarter backers are just happy with the game. Only VERY FEW of them complain about something.


I think Larian will do a kickstarter again. But maybe they will make less "fixed" stretch goals this time. And they should only make digital games like Swen said himself. I think Larian had the perfect "balance" in their funding for D:OS: their own money, kickstarter money and Early Access money. That way they had enough money at every time in the development circle. Early develpment and basic game designed funded with own money until you have a working prototpye you can present for a kickstarter. Kickstarter money to enable additional features and the second stage of development. Early Access for the final stage of polishing, bugfixing and implementing customer feedback. I think Larian would be well advised to stick to that "path to success".

No more Kickstarters. They need to fund their own development now and be free from fan expectation. KS always backfires to some degree.

I disagree. I think KS is a good fit, they just need to manage expectations/goals a little better.

I also agree with LC, if handled correctly KS can be a valuable tool for any developer.
Meeting the community expectation adds quite a bit of pressure, but it also brings out the best in folks. Another added benefit of the KS is that you already get quite a bit of PR and word of mouth as well as professional marketing without having to spend too much of a budget.
The KS will give a company a good idea if what they are working on is going to be a good game which will make money.
But as folks have been saying, stay away from physical goods. On the digital side only create things which are easily implementable and can be procedural y automated.
They do have to offer some benefits to KS'ers for the risk they are taking in investing at that early stage in the cycle.

If you can produce a playable demo, Steam Early Access seems to be the safest way to go for a developer. Once their build for SEA is approved and published, the developer is under zero obligation to deliver anything beyond that. Steam Early Access backers are expected to be satisfied with the game as it exists at the moment they purchase it; anything beyond that should be considered a bonus.

Now, obviously having the developer abandon their SEA product is not the result backers hope for (nor would it be a good move for the developer's future projects), but the point is the developers don't have to worry about explaining why they didn't get stretch-goal features in, or deal with complaints about someone's missing Kickstarter pony reward, or what text is on what box, etc. It's just a lot.. simpler.

Of course, losing 30% revenue off the top to Valve sucks. But I suppose it depends on how much money is being brought in by SEA versus Kickstarter.

There's also an argument that Kickstarter generates publicity which makes a game successful on Steam Early Access, but I suspect promising projects on Steam can generate their own momentum on Steam just fine without Kickstarter's help. In fact, too often lately projects are showing up on Steam Early Access with pricing that is shocking and angering would-be SEA backers, all in the name of keeping things "fair" for the Kickstarter backers and their pledge tiers. The result is a forum filled with bitter postings over prices, which is the first thing a potential buyer sees when looking for reviews and opinions. It turns the whole "word of mouth" benefit into a nightmare, and I'm really starting to think Kickstarter does more harm to titles on Steam Early Access than it helps.

Agree with you on the pricing issue Gyson, but that can honestly be managed as long as you set clear expectations. That's honestly what's been lacking from allot of KS's. People seem to expect that they pay less than the game at release for backing early. A developer can manage that expectation by clearly communicating this at the start of the KS and defining what price points they are offering the game at KS and what it will be at early access and release.
Honestly I think Larian has done a pretty good job of it and I've not seen many complaints on the pricing side for D:OS.

Kickstarter Pricing was from 20-28$ per copy which is way below what early access/released title was.
Considering KS takes 5% and Amazon takes another 3-5% so compared that's 10% compared to 30% from steam.

So if you compare:
Kickstarter 28$ -10% = 25$
Steam 40$ -30% = 28$

So if you take both Larian's benefit as well as the populations benefits into consideration KS is a good deal on all accounts.

I definitely think Larian should go with Kickstarter again. And I think they will. Swen has said so in several interviews. They like the community feedback. But Swen also said that they would probably not do physical tiers again - too much hassle.

Yes there has been some minor hick-ups in the D:OS campaign but nothing major. The game is cool and that is all that *really* matters.

Although I have pledged above the "Divinity fan" (giving access to all games for 10 years) I will pledge again if a new kickstarter is made. I think it is worth supporting cool games - games that otherwise probably would not have been made. Without Kickstarter D:OS would probably have been an ARPG - and not turn based. So I am really happy they they could make it happen.

I think the pricing problem mainly hits Kickstarter projects that have pricey points where alpha access becomes available. For example, if alpha access is only granted on the $70 tier and up, when the developers launch their alpha on Steam Early Access they'll set the price at $70 to avoid angering Kickstarter backers. Of course, that just ends up angering SEA backers, because they don't give two flips what Kickstarter backers paid and only see a developer asking $70 for an alpha demo that may or may not ever see another patch update.

When the developer allows Kickstarter backers to access alpha at much lower prices (~$25 tiers) it all transitions over to SEA with much less sticker shock. Of course, alpha access tiers tend to be the more popular ones, so developers seem to struggle to find a balance that will make the the funding they're looking for without causing a ton of backlash once they show up on Steam.

If Larian were to do another KS I would back it in a heartbeat, possibly for more than I did this time.

Sadly, no, it's not 'single people'... I followed enough Kickstarter's to know the major shitstorms over the tiniest things. It's not surprising most developers who were successfull on KS instead find other means of financing now rather than try again.

Most people on KS seem to grap even a basic understanding of design. Flames if they get little info, flames if games are delayed for good reason, threats they want money back, etc. etc.
I wish it were single people, I wouldn't make this point if they were single people... but no, there are just too many out there I notice acting like this to deem it single people rather than apparently the nature of the beast...

Can some dev, please, update us on sales numbers? I'm genuinely interested to know.

Really? Name an example. Double Fine already went back to Kickstarter again, inXile already went back again, Harebrained Schemes (Shadowrun Returns) already went back again, Swen already said he'll go back to Kickstarter again, Obsidian says they're going back to Kickstarter.

KS and steam early access have their downsides and problems, but the advantages to a mid-low-funds developer are way bigger than you can expect.

It means extra feedback, free beta testing, comunity/word-of-mouth free publicity, extra funds in a time that small developers are realy pressured with costs, etc.

Surely KS and Early access have their hassles as forum trolls tend to flock towards this kind of projects with terrible force and complaints, but all-in-all the good outweight the bads by a long shot.

With this remark i have to say that i hope larian launches another KS for the next game. If it's a well-known franchise that people know and like, it has all the potential to be a sucess.

If they launch a KS for a sequel of D:OS people might not react as well since they know K:OS made some profit and thus people might think larian is leeching for money (it might be false but people are mean by nature).

If larian does try to buy a well-known franchise as Sven already hinted and needs some extra cash, i realy believe then fans will flock towards the project and the KS will be an immense sucess because larian already proved with K:OS they can manage a KS very well, and deliver a high quality final product.

i would like larian to try and make a more serious RPG like... for example... a Vampire the masquerade cRPG... or perhaps a new Ultima ? hum, tasty... I'm realy curious what they want next, in the meantime i'll end my 2nd playthrough of D:OS

I honestly think that asking people to PAY for beta/alpha testing access is one of the core things wrong with today's games market. No one should pay to test a game, they should receive something for the effort they are willing to put into it. The more valid information (new bugs found) they submit the more they should get in return imho.

But yes this is exactly the point where KS's struggle, I think the best example of that was Planetary Annihilation. They completely ruined themselves and any credibility they have. Due to the high price of the KS they ended up having to ask 80$+ for early access and are now still at 45$ which is AAA price point. There is allot of vitriol going around with this game. For me this is the perfect example of how not to manage your KS/SEA.

I'm really torn on Steam Early Access and how it works today.

On one hand, certain companies "abuse" Steam Early access to basically sell their game free of criticism. They are able to profit off their game, but use Early Access as a shield to prevent people from criticizing their game. Meanwhile, they are charging a premium price for it, just like if it were an actually released game. In addition, it still shows up on important Steam pages/lists like Top Sellers, Featured, and New Releases. This ensures that the early access game gets exposure and sells. And I mean, with a deal like this...why would you ever release your game? You can just continue to sell it and use early access as an "excuse" for any problems.

But on the other hand, early access really does allow some companies to make their games better. D:OS is a perfect example, Larian has stated the SEA gave them the funding and feedback they needed to really make it what it is. And if SEA can contribute to a game as awesome as D:OS...then it really can't be all bad.


Anyway, I think there is a simple solution to the problems that currently surround SEA. SEA games should NOT appear on the main steam pages. They should have their own area, like Greenlight, so that people have to be SPECIFICALLY looking for SEA games to find them.

This would prevent people from abusing SEA to sell and even market games "as if" they were released, but be immune to criticism. It would also still allow the more legitimate use of SEA, like getting additional funding and feedback for games that need them.

I agree that "Early Access", or other forms of paid alpha/beta, have become far too common and prominent and developers have started to rely way too heavily on them. That's not really related to Kickstarter at all, though - nothing requires you to give alpha/beta access just because you sold your game through Kickstarter. You can do whatever you want.

Kickstarter is an amazing way to sell games - you get more than 90% of the revenue (compared to 70% with Steam), tons of people are willing to pay far more than normal purchase price, and you get all this money as basically a zero-interest advance loan on top of it. If you don't expect developers to continue using Kickstarter left and right, then you're kind of nuts.

I have no problem with Kickstarter, in fact, I still support it and will back games that I like and have faith in.

With Kickstarter, there should be no confusion about what you're doing when you invest money. You are not "pre-purchasing" a game, the game may fail and never even exist. You are putting your faith and money in a company/individual to create the product they are promising...and it is possible that they fail.

I know that some people are still confused about this, but that's on them.

Well, you actually don't pay for beta testing. You pay to be able to play an early version of a game with the promise to get the full version for free upon release. Something like a "serious" Early Access approach (which means that the game is in late development state with an ETA for the final release) is just a preorder with bonus. It's totally up to the customer whether they want to give feedback about their experience. They are not obliged to give any feedback.

In a "regular" free beta people are more or less obliged to deliver feedback. If you want to get paid for betatesting you should join a company which does exactly that. But in that case you have to do it professionally in a controlled environment and not in your spare time for fun.

I think many people miss the point that something like open beta testing isn't valuable other than for testing for example server capacities. It's of much more value to the developer and the game if the people who play a game early are personally and financially invested in the game. That makes the audience both more narrowed and more conscious for serious feedback instead of flamebaiting and internet-bullying (like you can regularly experience during/after short betas for big AAA games). Like I said, Early Access is a way better way to do betatesting for both the customers/fans and the developers. Fans can get the chance to play a game early and influence the direction of a game but only for a game they already like and a game they are ready to invest in early (which is in no way different than just a preorder). Developers can spread the final development stage to polish the game and implement valuable feedback from people who've played the game an people who are invested in making the game as good as possible since they've already paid for it. Without their investment in beta/early access the same game would probably just be released in a much less polished state with way less features. D:OS would probably have been released in February without early access tbh. Larian just couldn't afford to spread development over some additional months without any chance to earn money. With early access (=preorder with beta access) everything is better for everyone. The devs can make the game better and get paid for it. The fans can get an additional bonus for their preorder. The regular customers get a more polished game after release.

Believe me, any argument against a "serious" early access as a part of the development of a regular game are only theoretical and imo invalid. Of course that only applies to games which use early access in a reasonable way which means that it is used - like in the case of D:OS - in the last months and weeks of a game that is already quite finished and a game that a have a narrow ETA. This doesn't apply to these neverending early access games which are published in an incredibly early state (like pre-alpha) which never get any ETA from the devs. That is basically just a cheap way to cash in on a game that you probably don't ever want to "finish". But early access for a traditional game development cycle with the firm goal to deliver a release product at a date is a blessing and not a curse for everyone involved.


So I personally hope and expect that Larian will do early access again for their next game. I'm not so sure about kickstarter since that depends on their financials as well although a kickstarter is a great way to get some public attention and marketing and also a great way to get in contact and strengthen the connection with your fans (and make new ones). The way Larian communicated with us - the fans - so far is imo a clear indication that another kickstarter is highly possible even if they wouldn't really need it from a financial perspective. But only time will tell.

On the topic of KS, has anyone actually seen any interesting ones come by?
I've checked a couple of times over the last few months but really haven't seen anything comparable to D:OS, TTON, Wasteland, Shadowrun etc.

You know, just as all free things aren't good things, free work doesn't necessarily mean good work.

You playing the game once or twice, see something weird, rant about on the forums is not as valuable as a professional beta tester's feedback.

My friend who was a tester said that when he saw a bug, he had to play through it again and again to record the conditions that precipitated the bug, determine if it was reproducible, etc. and produce coherent QA reports under deadline reports for the programmers to read.

Don't flatter yourself and think you are doing them some kind of amazing favour by your "free beta-testing"

What effort? Beta testing isn't like it used to be where it was very structured and you had to apply for it like you would a job detailing your qualifications. Also you had to provide constant reports and keep a journal as well as required participation through board posting and interaction. It was really a lot of work and actually a good resume filler back in the day due to it.



Before companies started the paid early access/beta approach, beta had been degraded into nothing more than people using it as a means to test out a game before they bought it. You had numerous people who were technically illiterate making misleading comments, or unable to properly communicate a given issue. You had people farming for exploits (multi-player games mainly) to use to their advantage on release.

Lets be honest here though. All you are paying for is "early access". These days, for the most part... the bulk of bug finding is done by log programs they have running on peoples machines while playing in a beta. While is always helpful when someone finds and reports things, the idea that the "individual" is doing some major task is a bit of an exaggeration.

Question is how many "Serious" Early Access games are out there?
Have to admit my ignorance here since I've only really gone through this process with D:OS.

I did hear some other negative comments on games which went through KS/SEA and release which were negative. Does anyone have any positive examples?

If there are too few positive examples I'm afraid this is going to lose it's appeal to most people because it'll be too difficult distinguishing between those companies who do this seriously and others who are only using it as a cash cow and still deliver an unfinished product or bad product.

It may actually turn out detrimental to sales to have something as early access because of a negative perception linked to SEA eventually..

Again hope it doesn't go down that route but it's a possibility if too many games fail to deliver after SEA.

How is that important? We talk about Larian here and they've already proven with D:OS that Early Access can be used in a reasonable way. I think that "established" studios with some reputation and experience how to handle a game development process are much more reliable here of course.

You have to look at it like that: is it a game you would normally preorder? If no, don't buy into Early Access, just ignore it until release. If yes, there is no reason not to buy into Early Access.

LC, you and me know this to be a fact, but for those people who either don't know Larian that well or are first time early access users will be put off at that point and as I mentioned early access can have a negative impact on later sales if this process becomes abused too often. Steam may at that point pull the plug on that feature entirely as well. So in my opinion it's a relevant question for Larian as well

I think Valve needs to have a contractual system in place for SEA, whereby developers are required to finish the game in 'X' amount of time, or forfeit a huge chunk of their profits. Failing to deliver a final game (not just an incomplete game marked as final) would potentially also be grounds for blocking said developer/publisher from SEA in the future. That would resolve a number of issues with early access.

As a third party vendor I don't think Steam have the right to stipulate a SLA agreement like that.

Eg you order something from the Store, the Store says that they will have to order from the Manufacturer and that the Manufacturer expects delivery date to be 2 weeks. Your something doesn't arrive in time. The Store can refund you and cancel the order, but they can't force the Manufacturer to do anything.

As I said, Early Access is preorder with bonus. You don't usually preorder a game you don't at least trust 90% to be good. And if you just buy into an Early Access without sufficient information it's your own problem and your own responsibility. Game developers are not responsible for a reasonable behaviour of their customers.

If Steam "pulls the plug" anytime there will be different solutions. Nothing is set in stone.

I also don't agree on the negative effect on sales argument. Basically there is no difference between Early Access and preorder if you use the whole program like Larian did for D:OS. It might cause some people to actually preorder the game and use Early Access but this is no lost sale but just an earlier financial compensation. It's just a different time of paying not a question if people pay money for the game after all.

I think many people fall into the trap to generalize programs like Steam Early access. You have to assess the program on a game to game basic and evaluate in each case whether an early investment into a game is worth your money or not. I jst don't see any downsides to basically everyone if you handle it like Larian did for D:OS.

Under normal circumstances, I would agree with you, but early access is a far cry from a regular retail release. The rules are a little more vague. I don't see it as "pre-order with a bonus", developers get a huge benefit from early access systems, both in funds and in feedback. I think 1 year is more than generous for a game to be in early access (maybe 18 months on the outside), and any longer than that is just milking it. If the developer can't get it to the stage where a year is sufficient to finish development on their own, then they should look elsewhere for the funds they need.

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO




I hope D:OS will win the top spot again soon...

Dishonored? I bought it, but didn't find it THAT good. How long does that promotion last?

Was a good run, but it had to end sometime. It'll probably stay in the top 10 for a while longer and then get a decent spike in the autumn sale!

Dishonored ain't that great of a game either. Sad.

Actually I find it pretty good but anyway, will probably lose the top spot once the sale is over (it's the Quakecon sale until July 21st).

Just a single day. All hope is not lost. The Dishonered sale is 1 day - there will be new sales every day to the 21st.

Dishonored was OK but I lost interest pretty quickly. Now I hate it though. How dare it dethrone the king!! It had to sell itself for less than half its price. Pathetic. Has it no shame?

Half? It's actually sold for less than 1/5 of its original price

It's still been very successful for an indie and will probably be at the top, in the top 5/10, for the rest of the summer. I don't think this is any cause for alarm. This game has been a smashing success and the champagne should be popping for weeks to come over at Larian Studios.

Dishonored was a fun game of a different style. I probably liked it more because it challenged me not to be rambo and just whack everything in sight. For an action game it had some style and depth.

As an old school Thief (not the reboot) gamer, I really enjoyed Dishonored. It wasn't exactly the same type of gameplay, but it was close enough - with a few twists of its own - to be a really enjoyable experience.

At least it was a TON better than the new Thief...

its out of the #1 spot temporarily because some otehr games are on sale, but it will be back

Oh, absolutely. No argument here. It felt far more like classic Thief than Thief (2014) did.

It was also shortly dethroned by the Payday 2 Shotgun Pack (don't forget that), but regained it shortly there-after.

As for the Dishonered discussion, I personally found it rather dissapointing. Left it to get back in another time, never did... gathering Steam-dust as we speak...

Was disapointed with Dishonored as well... the preview made it show like this dark game of revenge and when I played it the story line promoted not killing anyone... so not that dark revenge game I was hoping for. Also found it really linear... would have expected it to be open world and not areas you need to stealth through.. so for me it could have been lots better.

its a good game, but point is its on a big sale so thats why it rose to #1, when sale is over then divinity will go back to #1

Please don't let this thread degenerate to some "bashing thread" just because another game achieves to win the top spot on Steam. We gamers shouldn't always be so negative and destructive and sometimes we should just accept that there are many good games and many people with different tastes. I for once am just sad that D:OS lost the top spot but I also hope that it will win it again after the Quakecon sale is over.

Were you playing a different game than me? The story constantly encouraged you to kill, although it did reward non-lethal styles with a calmer, more stable city (which is quite appropriate, in my opinion). After all, you were rescued to become an assassin for the loyalists. I'd say that's pretty encouraging toward the "kill all enemies" approach.

Mind you, I usually prefer playing non-lethal (as with most stealth games, when given the choice), though I did a recent lethal playthrough.

I am going to buy a copy of dishonored :P Can't beat the price really and I've been wanting it in my library for a while. It'll look nice next to Divinity:OS.

Since it is a buyers option, I don't have a problem with Kick or EA. They lay it out... we decide. If they didn't do this, the product people are playing would probably be lesser than it is, so just thank all those that supported happily and of their own choice making your experience better. They couldn't afford what you ideally ask for.

Don't want to see this degenerate into a discussion of another game but can't let this pass:

Did you play the expansion centered on Daud? Daud was the assassin who kills the empress at the beginning. In the expansion he is driven by guilt to right the wrongs he committed in the initial game. However if you play Daud very lethally it sets up an encounter with Corvo where you beg for forgiveness and his decision is based entirely on how you've played up to that point. I don't think that game encouraged a "kill all enemies" approach at all.

Sadly DOS has been dethroned. To be honest, Dishonored is an awesome game. Hope DOS will regain it's throne during sales again!

D:OS is back to #1.

And now Wolfenstein is on top

But Dishonered is #3.

D:OS is on #1 again, Dishonored on #7.

AS of this moment, it's number 2 XD. Wolfenstein toped it.

LOL, I guess it's different for me because Wolfenstein is censored in Germany. So the original version isn't shown on the Steam site for me, and the censored German version isn't even in the top 10...



So for me D:OS is still the #1...

Wolfenstein does have a big advertisement banner on the store page of Steam. Understandable that they are currently number 1 coupled with the sale discount.

And yes Wolfenstein took top position for now with D:OS 2nd place.
Shows what a disapointment ESO is that it's not getting the top spot. In my opinion it's still to expensive for something which is asking for such a high monthly subscription.

Agreed. I have played that game, and liked it for the first month and didn't like it the months thereafter. I was a ghost subscriber for 2-3 months to see if there are going to be any improvements in the game but it didn't have any significant improvement to the quality of life. Stopped my subscription then.

Wondering how many copies of DOS sold now. But i know when sales, i believe Larian will be more than happy. Remember Legend of Grimrock sold 600K copies.

a few days ago there was an article on a belgian site saying they had sold 250.000 copies. so best guess is 300.000 by now.

But this is still early days and the price is not even dropped yet. 600k shlould be easily achieveable.

I want that Divinity Original Sin will be top seller #1 until release Divinity 3 or next Larian project
You can do it Larian I know!!!!!!!!

Skyrim sale

Only one day...

WOOOH mindfuck..if they EVER do that ..I will lose half a year of my life i think.. Larian + Sci-Fi ^^

I love this game. Wish I had seen it sooner and got in on the KS deal. Such an amazing game for an old school RPG fan. Larian has restored my faith in PC gaming by not only launching an amazing game by a editor to go with it. Bravo!!

Larian should make a Star Wars isometric tactical CRPG... :P

Star Wars:Knights of the Old Republic 3!!!!!!

It's third now... behind Elder scrolls online and Skyrim... Well, both of them are on sale right now so it's understandable.

Back on on second place again after Skyrim. Not to bad given that DOS is still full price and the Skyrim package is a really good deal.

+1 please to get an update on sales numbers. I've seen that the game is on top on Steam and GOG as well, and am really happy to see that!

I think that Divinity has been top 3 for several days on Steam now.

Very impressive, rather surprising, but well deserved, I think!

Actually it has been in top 3 every since release on the 30th June. Most of the time as #1 until the quake con sales started.

skyrim is on sale now and its #1


but divinity is still second and will go back to #1 once sale ends

Skyrim and Elder Scrolls Online, two of the worst games ever made, are now #1 and #2 on Steam.

I agree that TESO is pure mediocrity but Skyrim is ok for what it does. There are far worse games than Skyrim...

All of Bethesda's in-house games are broken and overrated mediocrity. Including Fallout 3.

Don't mind me though, just my opinion.

According to other top titles, I'm assuming sales to reach million copies soon, if isn't already. Dayz make 2.1 m after 4 weeks of top selling title. Good news, rangers and hamsters rejoice everywhere!

Last I heard D:OS had already sold 250K copies. Well deserved!

Hopefully they sell at least one million copies, just imagine what kind of game Larian could develop with a very large budget.

That is at least a week ago. I guess 3-400.000 by now.

Would love to see a sven blog about sales and his view on the critics and players reception of dos.

Sven go go go make it so

I think it's better to update us with the sales numbers when the time is right. Time is right is when the steam/popularity of the game is dwindling or no further publicity is in place. I'd be honest, sale figures (or box office earnings) are one of my factors in buying the game coupled with various gaming (movie) review ratings and marketing effort.

The time is right probably a week after the huge update in august.

Swen have already stated 3 weeks ago that the sales were 250k or something. We don't know how much it was currently in today.

It's back in its rightful place as #1 :P

I'm guessing Swen is waiting for the sale rate to drop to 'long tail' level before making any formal 'hooray' announcement. Also they're probably shooting a video of Farhang swimming in a pool of gold, Scrooge-style.

Dark Souls II Season pass took #1 again.

4th place?!?! Forget it. The world is ending.

Yeah, bu Larian seems to be happy with the sales.

And two of the games before D:OS are on sale, with Planet Explorers being the daily deal and the other one was just released today (and already on sale)...

Yes, I think we can be certain we will get at least one more RPG from Larian.

And there was much rejoicing!

I would love to see a full expansion for D:OS instead (or on top of that)...

Expansion we need expansion from LALALALArian Teeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeam!
But first Larian must have big holiday-)!

3 1/2 days. Maximum.

They actually won't be back until the second week of August.

Oh yeah of course they deserve it after putting out a completely broken game

stupid developers no wonder nobody knows this company

I actually broke my keyboard and punched it because of how stupid stealth is in this game...i want to hit enemies without them seeing me but no they automatically know where i am

good programming you stupid belgian bastards

I obviously missed a post, where have they said they've now gone on holiday (I know they had planned to after release)

So one topic is claiming stealth is completely overpowered, and another poster is crying stealth is broken and so is the game.

*sigh*

If your rage issues are so bad that you break your keyboards, perhaps you need anger management.

Last monday, 21st of july, was our independance day.
This + holiday season = lots of belgian are on holiday. (Yes I'm on holiday this week :)).

Imarion

I thought they are going to give a major update this august for the companions?

Sounds more like someone in need of lobotomy.

Shouldn't interfere with that, if that's the plan. They should be back after the 4th. It's only a two week break.

Halpmepls probably misclicked trying to buy Dishonered... and then wondered "this is the spiritual sequel to Thief?"

Anyway, that Skyrim stuff reminded me I bought it during the Winter Sale... and still have to play it. Oh well, D:OS had priority...

D:OS is back on #2. Maybe it will win #1 again soon?!

For now it`s #3,There are Dead Island Franchise Pack #1 and Planet Explorers #2 with huge discounts
But at GOG Divinity is still TOP SELLER #1,I`m so glad!!

LOL, Dead Island again is not available in my freakin country. So it's #2 for me...

I hope Larian can make enough money for their next game. Can't wait and hope it doesn't disappoint!

And the king is back! D:OS is #1 on Steam again.

Although it's still #1 but i doubt the sales are anything high. When winter sales come, i think Larian will be astonished with the profits.

Anyhow i'm really interested to know what's the current sales figure now. Really hope they do well. And thing is on steam, the profits come during sales.

I'd really like to know that too. I suppose it must be around 400 to 500K by now.

I think it is higher. It has been almost a month since release and 250k news was after a week. My guess is 600-700K by now.

Well, I guess this finally proves that there is a market for old-school style games and that it is very profitable.

I can't see this game not selling a over one million copies, which is damn good for a 4 to 5 milllion dollar budget.

I wish we could all stop guessing and know a little more
guesses are all just fine and dandy but we may be very far off..

I'm just happy to see that even after 1 month we are still a) top of the ranking and b) still full place with full price.

Would be great if they had sold 1m copies or close to that by now, would mean that they have made about 20mil income from it (50% of price etc after all said and done)...


well I hope the guys don't retire from the gaming industry if this goes on

Yes agree,and let`s hope that they won`t become another greedy EA,who promoting gays relationship and 1000 DLCs for 10$ each...

I guess you haven't meet the gays in Hunter's Edge yet, have you?

To be honest I played and totally completed only Mass Effec Series and also I played Dragon Age for a little
If you`re talking about D:OS then I didn`t play yet at all because I`m waiting for Russian language

Not sure what your beef is with companies including gay relationships in games?
I had a massive laugh at having Zavren in the party. Was the most hilarious character in the entire game.
Not sure how many gay people you've met, but they are mostly a blast to be around. So taking that into games is great.
From a relationship perspective, it's not my cup of tea either, but I think it's good that they include it. No one ever forces you to go down a route you don't want *shrug*, so if you have an issue with it, don't play it that way.

Nothing wrong with gays... BioWare just sucks with relationships wheter they are gay, straight or something other which the term escapes me (the female you could 'date' in ME1 suddenly being a guy in ME3 "How can you not have noticed that during sex?" idiocy comes to mind).
And them putting those horrid relations on top instead of actual gameplay or a PLOT (ME2 I look at you!).

Probably talking about that... I hope.

Gameplay hasn't been anywhere near the top of BioWare's list of priorities in many many years, sadly.

Annnnd D:OS dropped to 4th place behind DayZ, AOE Bundle and Lengend of Heroes..
Would have thought D:OS would stay on top with that competition.
30 days basically almost non stop at the top is pretty good so expected it would drop a little.
Not sure if it'll manage to get top for any extended time anymore, but can always hope.

No problem with including, large problem with shoehorning. For example, everything in Dragon Age 2 and Mass Effect 3 was insulting, and so far, from pre-release material, it looks like the new Dragon Age is going to be even more of a disgusting pandering, agenda platform than those two other games. Dragon Age Origins did it fine, Fallout New Vegas did it expertly, Arcade Ganon is probably the single best handled homosexual character of the last generation, much better than agenda pushing drivel like Gone Home and modern BioWare games.

Oh, stop. Go start your beef with the quality of homosexual relationships in another thread. This is about being #1 in sales and its currently in 6th!!

Obviously we are having a bit of an epidemic. The lack have patches lately has seen a steady downturn in sales. GET ON IT LARIAN!

I do think that sometimes the top sellers list in Steam is a bit of a fix. I mean come on. They sometimes release something in a sale thats a load of poop and it mysteriously becomes a better top seller than some of the AAA titles. Funny how it quickly disappears after the sale finishes. Right now is a perfect example. At least 3 of those out perfoming DOS are old re-releases in a sale. I rest my case.

If you are going to judge steam games by top sellers then do it by how long they have ranked. DOS might even move back up after some of the other fluff has disappeared.

They're on vacation until the 4th. That's why there have been no patches for a while.

didn't see it as 6th but it's 3rd now again

Whatever its rank, it is one of the only games released in a long time that's actually worth buying at full price. Being an old geezer who loves games, the last 10 or so years have been rough. Finally a proper game comes out. I hope more developers take note.

I just replay DA:O. While it's overall a nice game combat is so much stronger in D:OS...

D:OS deserves all the praise. I hope it stays in the Steam top 10 for a long time.

So true. Most other turn-based fighting is feeling a bit dumb'd down in comparison to D:OS. I'm having a difficult time convincing my GF to try D:OS because she was such a fan of DA:A haha. Not that its a bad game by any stretch. I quite enjoy it. But there is a bigger sense of satisfaction from D:OS.

Which is why it should be #1 ON STEAM AGAIN!!!

I do hope this game stays in the Top 10 for a good long while. 6 months would be great! If they can net around $10 million that would be a huge step in favor of old-school games rules rather than the predigested swill that most RPGs are these days. Oops, my bias is showing.

However, I am one of those people that is waiting for a bit of a price drop. I have a good friend and we are itching to get into another good co-op game for our weekly gaming sessions, but $80 USD is a bit much. That's the price of Steam Digital Collectors Edition + another Source Hunter DLC (so both of us have access to the DLC). I personally dislike DLC. It almost never gets the same level of reviews and critics that the core game gets and that to me just feels wrong that the developer is 'gaming' the system to get more money. To be fair, I'll do a bit more research before I make a final determination. Yes I know I can buy the normal game sans DLC, but if I get 2 copies then I am losing out on a $20 savings, the DLC, and the soundtrack (I'd enjoy that bit).

That and waiting a bit for the devs to patch the game so saving is not so problematic. I have a 64-bit machine but my friend is running a 32 bit version of windows (where the problem tends to show up).

concurrent players on D:OS:
http://steamgraph.net/index.php?action=graph&appid=230230

Its probably estimated though. Highest I saw was 22k of players as compared to the highest on the graph which is 21k.

Even better stats: http://steamcharts.com/app/230230

Almost 20k people play D:OS at the same time at the weekends. That't pretty stable since release, although overall player numbers are slowly going down which is quite natural.

Interesting fact, but Larian only added the DLC by user request. It was originally intended as CE only items. It's not really essential, though. The Golden Grail simply makes clothing/armor a bit more valuable (most of the time, I forget to even use it), and the Trunks just mock you while you play. That only leaves the design documents/art and the soundtrack, and Kirill has the soundtrack available on his website for free. None of it is game changing.

Back at number 1, at least for the moment.

I blame Sacred 3 - bringing in RPG fans and then scaring them off with lousy reviews.

yay we took over the nr 1 spot again !

its back to being #1

Is it for real? DOS #1 again on Steam. Sacred 3 is a real shame and insult to the original fans.

That's a good graph if you're only checking on one game though. I checked the active users of skyrim and this game the month after D:OS' release with my previous graph. It's the same trend although the numbers are smaller in comparison for D:OS. At least this means that the game have hit the mainstream. The question now is how will Larian take advantage of this or to avoid the down sloping of the trend. I'm thinking more updates, but the silence because of their holiday is a worry.

EDIT:
http://steamgraph.net/index.php?act...;from=1404104400000&to=1406955600000

Skyrim is still going strong due to mods and the community. Hopefully, Larian will take care of the community. I know they will but the silence is just making me anxious.

See told you so. All the fluff gone and now DOS is back at no 1. Right where it should be.

I reckon there has been a surge in sales due to all the sacred 3 refunders switching to DOS.

Awesome!

Happy to see D:OS is number one again!

Lol I've talked to some really angry people regarding Sacred 3

Larian already (inofficially) announced that the second big patch with additional companions will arrive this month. As far as I know most Larian staff should be back to work tomorrow so I guess we'll hear from them very soon...

I think Larian don't have to do much as long as D:OS is in the top 5 or even top 10 on Steam. If it loses a top 10 rank they should probably do a Weekend sale or something.

And in the long run a fully fleshed out expansion would be great of course!

Yep, no DLC bullcrap, we want a fully fleshed out expansion!

Let these guys enjoy their (well deserved) holliday!

Grats on the 1st place, together with DS 2 by far the best game relesed this year and probably the best rpg in years. Funny thing: i played Baldurs Gate 2 before and rpg-wise D:OS doesnt feel like a backstep in comparison xD

I totally missed the Sacred 3 incident, lost interest at this game after reading some of the design choices... wtf happened there, but a nice comparison to D:OS where nearly everything was done right ;-)

The problem with Sacred 3 is clearly a consolized mess. Although DOS has been consistently staying on Steam #1, i think the numbers now wouldn't be that great but i'm hopeful. This will be a different story when on sales.

Legend of Grimrock sold 600K units the last i heard. But that game cost is much lesser of course.

We know that DayZ sold about a million in the 3 months after its release (that is, excluding the first month which had the 'release spike' effect). It had a similar (though still better) profile of steam sales ranking over time. That should set the expectations - about 300k a month or 10k a day is probably an upper bound that is not too far off. So I'd guess about 400k steam sales (inc. EA) and another 150k from retail and GOG.

So after all the discount campaigns and new releases, Divinity fell out of the top 10, which usually means there's a massive drop-off in sales...

...usually, anyway, because today it's back on the front page at number 10.

Has there been any official numbers released yet? This must be a crazy success for Larian, surely? Hopefully it will enable them to patch it to perfection and also lots of lovely expansions!


EDIT: I didn't want to submit just in case it was there temporarily, but it climbed to number 9 now...

So, I geeked out and made the following estimates...

According to Steam Charts, in the last 30 days DOS has been played about 5.3 million hours on steam.

Assuming the ratio of peak players and hours played is constant, I extrapolated this backwards:
1. The area under the 'peak players' graph was 340k players x days for the last 30 days.
2. Thus, the ratio of hours played over that area is 5.3 Mil hours / 340 players*days = 15.6 kHrs / player-days
3. Applying this backward to the previous 30 days, we have another 496k player-days, so if we take the above ratio, that's another 496*15.8kHrs or 7.7 Mil hours.
4. Total hours played then would then be about 13 Million hours so far. Let's say this is with ï½±15% error because (a) the above method is rather crude (b) Steam sometimes under-reports hours played.

Now, I've also estimated the average number played per player to be between 15-20 hours. The estimate is based on:
1. Ars Technica's Steam Gauge data (has a rough pie-chart breakdown of average playtime on Steam)
2. Steam achievement percentages coupled with my estimates on how long it takes to reach each one. In particular:
- 44.6% have not found the Pyramids teleporters - this usually occurs in the first few hours of play, so these players are probably disinterested. Assumed 1.5 hrs played on average in this bracket.
- 26.1% found the pyramids, but haven't killed Evelyn yet. That means they've at least played a few hours, but probably not over 25. I assumed an average of 10 hrs for this bracket.
- 15.6% killed Evelyn, but haven't met the conduit yet. Probably played more than 8 hours and no more than 60. I assumed an average of 30 hours on this bracket.
- 5.3% have met the conduit, but haven't reached hunter's edge yet. That's at least 20 hours in, but no more than 120. I assumed 45 hours on average.
- 3.9% have arrived at Hunter's edge, but not at the Source Temple. Yadda yadda assumed 60 hours.
- 1.1% have reached Source Temple, but haven't beat the game. Assumed 75 hours. This piece of data is also backed by Larian saying it's an 80 hour game and also reports on this site.
- The rest (3.4%) have beat the game, at least once. Assumed 120 hours on average.

This adds up to 17.6 hours on average. I've thus used the range 15-20 hrs per player (i.e. about 17.5 ?ï½± 15%), which is roughly what you'd get if you slapped a 40% error margin on each individual bracket estimate and assumed they are independent error factors.

Assuming the two error factors are uncorrelated, all this roughly translates to about 750k ?ï½± 20%, or between 600-900k. Which is not far off from my previous post too, if you account for the month that has passed since

So, was I close Larian?

It's also a good time to announce since the sales rate must be dropping by now...

Yup, they dropped like a stone to 22 now. Whoops.

I guess the previous break back into the top 10 was temporary, and here's where the massive drop off starts.

(Although they're still in top 10 at GoG.com, but that site has a fraction of the customers that Steam has.)

Comparing Divinity made by a small studio with behemoth like Skyrim is already a success for Larian IMO.
Game they made is really enjoyable. Atleast i have only enjoyed as much when i was playing Fallout 2, Fallout new vegas and X-com (yes, i consider Skyrim a bit inferior to D:os, because it was oversimplified).
And i think D:os will be still bought for a long time like any other good game.
They just need to finish expansion in time to get more attentoion on steam once more.

A kickstarter game from a small studio with a small budget stays in the top ten for two full months, much of the time at #1, is pretty amazing imo. Many AAA titles with a much higher budget would be happy to stay up that long. Boxed Version seems to be sold out in many online shops. Also, depending on the modding tools and community, and maybe official DLC&expansions, it might even get back up...

There are lot of sales on in steam at the moment which have pushed our beloved D:OS off the first page. You can tell you have to take the steam positions with a pinch of salt as I do laugh when pre-orders appear as a top seller. yeah right, like I'm convinced its nothing to do with them pushing a new product. Besides D:OS has been at the top long enough to blow all those AAA titles right out of the water. Bring on the expansions.

It's normal as the game has aged the sales will drop. Perhaps will see a surge when winter sales. But i'm really surprised Dayz is still best selling after so long? Perhaps the game is constantly evolving and contents are progressively added.

Divinity Original Sins could be a one hit wonder. If Larian can reproduce the same quality and the same attention from journalists/press on their "next" game, then Larian will change. It's no doubt they will be contacted by giant corporates who want to partner with them.

Just noticed, if you remove preorders and sales, Divinity:Original Sin is still at #5 right now (#7 if you allow preorders).

All going as planned imo, once they patch it to a level they feel it's super sweet, then you'll get the sale and then those coming in in droves will have even a better experience and word of mouth kicks in again, almost like a second release. You have to think more than 1/2 of Steam buyers today only buy a game once it hits a fairly heavy sales point. This game has many key price points in it's future, the big one's being $20 (version 2.0) and $10 (version 3.0). Falling out of the top 10 at this point is imo understandable, the big deal now is the sale, which should be sometime this fall.

Back in the top 10!

Also according to my calculations it has sold about 14k copies on Steam since the previous calculation.

DOS has the potential to be one of those permanent top 20 Steam games, having a long and substantial 'tail' of sales.