Larian Studios Forums Baldur's Gate III Baldur's Gate III - General Transmogrification

Fair enough. I can understand how the inconsistency would bother someone. I'm just the type of gamer that cares far more about story and character than I do about items, so if it makes the characters look cool/fits their characters then I don't really care about what they initially look like.

Another example of companion equipment working in a way I like is in Pillars of Eternity 2. The upgrade/enchantment system in that game meant you could keep the companion's starting armor competetive throughout the game. If transmoging were a thing in BG3, I'd most likely use it to keep characters in their signature starting outfits.

Most of us would.

Even tho i must admit that i would totally steal Astarion's starting gear for my Noble Wizard ... >:]

Interesting take. I would also vote for this option based on this reasoning.

--- --- ---
TRANSMOGRIFY!

Just seeing this suggestion but I would definitely be in favor of such a transmog feature.

Now I would not wish to see a complete free-for-all where a morningstar changes to a Holy Avenger or something but I think it would be nice if we were allowed to swap the skin of a type of armor or weapon and apply it to something of the same type. For example applying Shadowhearts armor skin to other armor that can be worn by the character. That way if you find a set of armor that Shadowheart can wear; I could transmog her original skin onto the armor so that she will still look as iconic as when I first met her.

Currently with patch 9 my Paladin is sporting some very nice looking armor and I would hate to lose the look just because I'm forced to equip better generic armor that offers more AC or has an enchantment.

We already have some minor things like being able to hide our helmets but it would be nice if our characters could also retain their iconic looks (if we choose to; it should never be mandatory ofcourse).

I simply love Shadowheart's armor but you almost immediately replace it with generic scale mail shortly after you've met her on the beach.

Such a shame to see all that work get replaced by generic armors down the line. Larian did a great job to make each of these characters look special so it would be nice if they could retain their original appearance for those who wish to keep their characters looking like they do now.

Considering how dead this is and only 3 weeks until launch it would be fair to assume we're all going to be running around looking like clowns, I hope modders can do something about it sooner rather than later

I believe moder could teoreticaly use our camp armor slot ...
Actually even Larian could, if they would want to.

From what we were told, we will be able to dye our equipment ... wich is great.
And use looks of our camp equipment even in adventure world ... wich is fine.

Now all it would take would be small QoL feature, where we would be able to place our regular armor to Camp Armor slot ... and take its looks, no stats, no nothing, just visage.

If you can actually use ANY gear as your camp equipment (including weapons) and use that while adventuring that's pretty much all I need but I don't think we actually know how all that stuff works exactly, right?

Well ... no.
All we know is that camp gear contains only Chest and Boots ...

So even if anyone would make it work, there would be no gloves and certainly no weapons.

Then it's up to the modders I guess, I hope it's just as easy as adding a few lines of code to include the rest of the gear slots as usable camp gear xD

I do something like that in PnP already. If they loot a belt of giants strength it's huge, but as they attune to it it gets smaller. If the party finds a vorpal greatsword, if someone attune to it that weapon turns into the weapon that character use.

Another game I play is Lord of the Rings Online - it might interest folks to know that they were actually one of the pioneers of cosmetic outfit systems, long before WoW or other MMOs picked up that option in their own ways (WoW introduced their transmog system in late 2011 - LotROs cosmetic wardrobe was presented in 2008). The way it works is that you simply have a second 'tab' (and a 3rd, 4th, 5th.... 11th, 12th if you want them), that hides behind your gear panel, and you can choose with a click or keybind which visual appearance to display, from the outfits you've set up. When you put a piece of equipment into a cosmetic slot, it doesn't actually put the gear there - just takes a blank visual clone of the weapon or armour to sit in the cosmetic slot and drops the original back in your inventory, so you can use the same pair of boots in multiple outfits if you want, and so on. It's a pretty flexible system, and doesn't require you to give up one look for another, or consume/destroy gear just to keep a look you really like.

If we're going to have a cosmetic system at all, I'd really like something inspired along those lines.

Sure a well done transmog system would be ideal, but if Larian or the modders have to put something together in 3 weeks I would rather have a clunky transmog system (or a workaround/mod) than not being able to change my character appearance at all.

The whole concept of transmog is poor especially in the context of bg3.

Let me expand.
A. it is always an inferior solution to modding. Permutation of in game items will always be lower than permutation of in game assets and creator contents.

B. It removes the uniqueness of items. Even if you don't use the system it lower the appeal of finding an awesome item. Since your random base item can now be changed to that same item that item appearance is de facto no longer unique

C. It disturb the graphic balance the game maker intended and carefully and painfully constructed. A game is an art form, and why not respecting the artists? If you listen a song you wouldn't think of asking an artist to change a specific line would you?

D. We have dyes and clothes to buy for the ones caring deeply on how they look

E. It damages character progression having your paladin look identical in full licorn coloured plates from level 1 to 12 doesn't really translate the journey of an adventurer, does it.

F. What is even the rational? Do we have an enchantor to pay for transmog in the city. Is it a disguise self variant? Does the environment react to it?

A. Sure the modders can strip the game assets as much as you want but building a system from scratch I'm guessing it's a lot harder, but if they can expand on the camp clothes systen and add all the assets to be available to all gear slots it may be easier, wich is what I'm expecting.

B. It does not, if you find an amazing powerful item you can use it and you can also use it aesthetically wich even enhances the uniqueness of items. You may find one item you love aesthetically but be ''forced'' to change it because you got an upgrade that look terrible (to you at least) that's what happened with cyberpunk 2077 in a nutshell. The only thing I want from transmog is the aesthetic, I don't want to change stats or skills into another weapon wich is what you seem to imply.

C. Music is not intended to be interactive, a game is, and its the whole point. Nobody would buy a game if you couldn't interact with it, that's called a movie.

D. Having dyes is good, having transmog and dyes is just better.

E. It doesn't for me, if you don't want to you don't need to use it, but if I don't want to look silly because I'm wearing linen gloves with full plate armor and sandals I would like to be able to change how I look. That's one of the reasons why ''hide helm'' exists.

F. What's the rational for full character respect or having revivify scrolls when resurrecting on D&D is much harder? gaming reasons. But if you want another more ''lore friendly'' reason, you can change how you look in terms of clothing way more freely on tabletop and wear a cloak over your full plate for example, or having an armor smith make you a customized armor but you can't do those thing on the game, having transmog helps alleviate that.

This sentence makes no sense to me ...

Yes, modders will be able to create additional items and models ... so?
How is that relevant, or at very least RELATED to this topic? O_o

No it dont ...
On the contrary, it helps your unique item to remain relevant.

Take Shadowheart armor for example ...
It looks quite well ... at least in my opinion ... but lets be honest, its stats are shit, as every starting gear usualy is.
So you find better quite fast.
In dark crypt to be precise, maybe even while you are still on Nautiloid!

Now you have to make a choice.
Either look good ... or have good stats.

Transmog solves this problem, now you can do both!

Therefore you are on the contrary ore compelled to find awesome item, bcs you wouldnt be forced to throw it away, once you find another stronger but not so awesome looking item.

There is also difference in taste ... wear whatever you want ofc.
But my Dwarf Vengeance Paladin would rather kill himself than wear this:

Uniqueness be damned.

This is sadly same false point as abowe ...

Yes, it can disturb it ... but it can also save it ... that depends on user. :P

Lets say you have Paladin, or Cleric ... and you wear this metalic armor, yes? Then you get to the Underdark, and you buy this gloves that allows you to negate any poison on creature you heal ... but whopsie, they have leather skin ... that dont fit your armor at all.
Luckily, there is transmog system, that allows you to change them into metalic gloves ... and voila!
Your "graphic balance" (whatever that is) was saved!

As for songs ... yes, i would if i could ... sadly im cursed with thing that is called "musical hearing" ... so if there is any tone off, i can recognize it.
And believe me or not, some popular music theese days is litteraly torture for me.

And it is good ...
Just not good enough. :P

Well, if you demand to become this pink/golden ... thing ... i posted abowe, its nothing easier than just dont use it.
Personaly i dont ...

No it dont "translate the journey of an adventurer" ... but its also not supposed to.
Would you blame a hammer for not measuring temperature?
Me neither.

And in the end ... who is anyone to tell me that my personal character cant look like a beggar this whole time? :P
Especialy since he is Rogue and this is his disguise? :P
And double Especialy, since even my Paladin can now run to combat just in his tousers, when i turn my Camp Clothing on for adventure?

How should envireoment react to it ...
From game perspective you are wearing what you see ... it doesnt matter what game mechanics were used for that.

As JandK said in other threat ... does game anyhow react on world being brighter, when you raise your gama? This is same thing.

A. Because why spending time and energy implementing when modding offers an even better solution for custom content.

B. You miss the point. Let me spell it out in a simpler way. Item A is unique and was hard to obtain. You value that item for both its stats and aesthetic. Then consider I give you the ability to make any item look like item A. It means any aesthetic value carried by item A is now worthless. Essentially transmog remove any value from the item design: to simple fact transmog exist makes an item value equal to its stats removing it's look from the equation. Said otherwise transmog makes the visual value of item worthless.

C. It is called "perfect pitch" in English. Well except you are not the artist you are the user. If you don't like the game look or don't like a song so don't have to listen to it or play it.

D. It is your opinion. But why simply not getting a mod of a specific look if it is so essential to your enjoyment?

E. The example was purposely absurd. Well when you do a compaign and your character is progressing you will not only gain level but find items / pieces of clothing. It is part of the RPG concept. You start in rags and end up in full plates. Again you might dislike the concept entirely and want to play a game with fixed looks and level. Then maybe that game is not for you.

F. It does: consider your enemies, you would consider their size, armour and items. It would be frustrating if that dagger is in fact a battleaxe? Why that logic be any different for companions or your main character?

1) Bcs you realize that not everyone is downloading mods (there are for example consoles, that dont even have any as far as i know)

2) Bcs you NEED to have models in your game, otherwise your whole game would look like this:


3) Bcs you want to please your customers ... and you know that human, if nothing else, is being lazy ... and therefore anything you serve right under their nose will please them much more, than things they have to do thsemselves

4) Bcs mod models are usualy shit, not allways that much is true ... but usualy.

5) Bcs it dont hurt anyone ... whoever dont want to use it, will not use it ...

Not necesarily ...
See? There is error in your thoughts.

Do you really "value for its aesthetic" that gold/pink nonsence i posted abowe?
Be honest.

I presume you mean Item B ...
Bcs when look of Item A is the one that is used, then on the contrary, exactly this skin have its value not just preserved, its worth even more, since its being used while it was supposed to be thrown away, never to be looket uppon again.

Its Item B skin wich value dissapeared, since it will never be shown again.

And the reason is simple ... Item B was ugly.

So two things:
1) NO "aesthetic value" ... wich by itself sounds like very odd concept, but lets say ... is lost in the process, bcs the amount Item B just lost was just added to Item A ... therefore total amount remains perfectly unchanged.
2) Aesthetic is thing very subjective ... so while million people will transmog Item A, another million will transmog Item B, and yet another million will transmog Item C ... therefore no model was wasted.

There is also another argument that made this point kinda void ...
We allready have option to HIDE our helmets and musical instruments ... aswell as newly our whole armor being just swaped for regular civilian shirt, pants and boots ... if you really want to argue about some fabricated "aestetic value of items" ... tell me how much "aestetic value" have helmets that are completely hidden and will never se seen by anyone?

And since that is official implementation ... i think its safe to clam that Larian, you know the people who made decisions around here ... dont give a damn about some "aesthetic value".

And where exactly do you presume transmog those looks take from?
See this is the error in your thought ...

Lets say there is something called "look value" (or aesthetic one as you called it previously, but this is simpler word) ... and "stat value" ... ok?

What you say is that one of them is removed ... but that is not true.
The only thing transmog do is separate them.

We both want to wear Medium armor that gives us 15AC ... rather than 13 ... so stat value is no brainer.

Now look value ...
You like armor to look as it should, lets call it default, no matter what it really is.
I like that armor to look as Shadowheart armor.
My brother like that armor to look as Githyanki armor.
His friend will like that armor to look like Cleric starter armor.
His friend will like that armor to look like Paladin starter armor.
His friend will like that armor to look like Fighter starter armor.
His friend will like that armor to look like Sharan Warrior armor. (The one we find in Grymforge.)
His friend will like that armor to look like Adamantine armor.
His friend will like that armor to look like Lightning Charge armor.
And so on and so on and so on ...

See?
Nothing was lost.
Everyone in the world will find this or that armor to be prettier, or more fitting to his personal fantasy ... and that is why every model will be used, just not at the same time.

I dont force you to play game with transmogrification.
Feel free to "dont". :P

Its not so pleasant when your own rules are applied on you, is it?

I dont know ... why dont you?

There was nothing absurd about it ... that is armor that was datamined as one of final game things, you WILL be wearing.

Im not sure if this game is for you either ...
First of all, we dont start in rugs, if you didnt notice.
Second of all, full plates is armor that anyone who starts in clothing will most likely not wear.
Have you even played *THIS* game?

Well ...
First of all, this game is not a PvP ... so your enemies dont really consider any look you have on yourself, what is your NPC enemies actually concidering is your stats, bcs that is what they "see" for lact of better therm, clear as day.

Second ... im not aware that anyone was talking about transmoging battleaxe into dagger ... quite honestly, since it was your invention, i would like to know how exactly would you do that ...
Again, have you even played *THIS* game?
Bcs if so ... maybe you noticed that weapons have special moves ... moves that were mo-captured and animated ... wich needs to corespond with model, in order to work properly? Does it ring a bell?

So ... if you ask why this logic you represented is any different ... its bcs it lacks any.

My counter question is:
Do you really need your 12 (wich will be maximum in BG-3, btw) lvl enemy to wield something like ... i dunno this:

In order for you to realize that they may be dangerous?

Or will you gather as much even if they would wield ... i dunno ... this:


And by the way ...
If you really wouldnt ... some unpleasant surprise awaits you, when you meet angry druids. :P >:]

A. You didn't answer my point. You answered statement I did not make e.g. I never made the argument to not have visuals.

B. Yes in that case value could be 0 or negative (if you don't like the look of it). If you didn't assign value to item look you wouldn't want transmog in the first place as you d be indifferent to it.

It is a well proven fact in economy that rarity drives value.

C. Except as far I can see you are requesting time to be dedicated to this. I request nothing on that front.

D. I don't need to, I simply go with what the artist vision is. However if I wanted to change appearance yes I would clearly look at modding post launch for more variety.

E. I am unaware of this as I don't look at datamined content. Attacking the credibility of a contradictor is not a good way to counter his argument. But, I have a few 100s of hours in EA and usually play with spell casters (sorcerer mostly, planning a sorlock for launch). Argument is valid for weapons too. I ll go for that epic dagger or staff over my starting staff.

F. You never said transmog would be constrained. Why would you be unhappy of someone fantasing about wearing a battleaxe or full plate even if he cannot equip them?