Larian Studios Forums Baldur's Gate III Baldur's Gate III - Suggestions & Feedback Fireball damage

I notice that Fireball damage is applied across the the targets in the area (similar to how a Sleep spell is handled). This is not rules as written. Per RAW, the whole damage should be applied to each character in the area (half for the ones who save).

Currently - 8D6 damage (presumably) is rolled. Then the first N0 points are applied to the lowest HP target; then the next N1 points go to the next target; etc.

RAW - 8D6 damage is rolled. The whole damage is applied to each target. If a target saves, only half damage is applied to that target.

Are you sure? Unless the spell has been patched since I played the build.

Yeah, that's not been my experience at all. Do you have combat logs and screen grabs? I assume you are not modded.

I'm curious as to why, for a given fireball, different gnolls/hyenas take diferent damage - surely they either take full/half? The flind Ican understand, but other are not exceptional so I can't see them having any kind of fire resistance/reduction. Is the game rolling a differnet 8d6 for each target? I would hope not: its a single spell delivering the damage, and I have never seen that interpretation of fireball before.

EDIT:
Double checked rules: definitely one roll for fireball:

"If a spell or other effect deals damage to more than one target at the same time, roll the damage once for all of them. For example, when a wizard casts fireball or a cleric casts flame strike, the spell's damage is rolled once for all creatures caught in the blast."

I don't see a problem here but I also don't play DnD. Of course the saving throw has to be made for each target affected as each target has it's own premises to pass the throw. And why should there be a unified damage roll for all entities affected? The game should roll for damage for each target as each target can be affected (burned) in a different way. I don't get it why it is important that it is a single spell or several spells which hit different targets.

It's the same when you cleave at several targets with a sword. It's the same sword but it can hit targets for different damage. If you refer to reality (ok, often a bad idea ...), the explosion of one grenade can affect targets quite differently even if they are close together, one dies, another has much less injuries for example, depending where they are hit in what manner.

Its the 5E rules, and this is a 5E game - and a pretty arbitrary move if this is what is happening. It's not about what is 'believeable' (it's a fantasy game) - this is such a fundamental core spell, to change it arbitraily (if that is what is happening) is pretty bad, imho. But perhaps those rolls are different for a valid reasons (from a 5e perspective). That was what I was wanting clarity on. D

There are quite a few dumb DnD/5e rules from my perspective as a non-DnD player, so it being a rule in 5e is no argument for me. It's also very believable for me that a big area of effect spell applies different damage to the targets, as the caster might not be able to guarantee the same intensity of magic everywhere, or some targets duck and cover or have different clothes or what else which randomly effects the damage. It is a flying spell which explodes, so it effects the targets from the outer side, it is not as if their substance was magically damaged from inside in always the same amount.

If it is a core spell (my party has it on Gale and Wyll), it especially has to be balanced and comprehensible. Of course they can make what they want of it, anything is explicable, and maybe it is a bug in the current state. But I find the current state quite logical and ok.

The issue here is that those seemingly small changes can have unintended effects on other features.
There are abilities, that increase the damage of a single roll. So if you roll once and apply the damage to all targets, the bonus damage affects all targets. If you roll individually, the bonus damage only affects one target, making those abilities noticably weaker.
Of course larian can do whatever they want, but I highly doubt their rule variations have a positive impact on class balance.

I see. The game seems to roll separate damage for each creature.


I don't see it as a problem. I think it is more interesting and makes average damage spread more equal. In table top rolling one damage makes sense, as rolling takes time. In an automated pc game - rolling damage for each sounds more interesting.

Yeah that sounds like a time saving thing for slow humans. Don't worry, the singularity will solve this problem :p

Wouldn't the bonus damage be taken into account for each separate damage roll and calculated per target? It should be.

Fortunately, other people who are more experienced and more knowledgeable on this particular topic do. Regardless, I'd implore you to either do some reading into it, or, if you don't wish to do so, then accept what's said by the people who understand better.

Here's a rough, specifics-light description of one of the issues.

If a feature affects a single damage roll, and you arbitrarily and unevenly decide to make it apply to many rolls in some cases and only one roll in others, you're throwing a lot of things out of whack immediately....

You want an AoE damage spell to make individual rolls per target at casting - okay, but you've just weakened several class features substantially by doing so. You want to apply that feature to all rolls in that specific case; how do you convey that you are doing that simply but clearly to the player, so they know and can act accordingly? Do you change the feature in question to say the damage of 'one spell or ability', instead of one damage roll? Do you clarify what counts as an ability, class feature, feat, perk or other feature? What ones of those are in and what ones are out for this? How do you convey that simply and clearly to the player?

Suppose you can, and do... Okay, but now you're throwing balance under the bus in an entirely different way because you're making that feature apply multiple times to individual targets by way of it applying to each individual roll of other spells and abilities, such as scorching ray, which can all target one creature; maybe that's fine, but it's also incidentally making the rough power grade and equity of some class features hugely out of line and more overbearing than others; what do you do about that? Do you change the other features that are now underwhelming by comparison to bring them up? How do you do that? Do you manage it without throwing further elements out of line?



If the solution was as simple and trite as some folks make out, such that it could be suggested by anyone with a base-line degree of human intelligence, it's safe to presume that the folks responsible for making the system, and who have a very real vested interest in making a system that is fun to play and will be successful, and who are employed to do so over others because they have at least a certain amount of qualification or aptitude for doing so above the average person, would have hit upon it already? Of course they would have; it's just not that simple.


Rather than being so dismissive as to suppose that a banal one-line answer is magically a good solution but is also something that has not been thought of by the very people designing the system as their day job.... you could implement the spell as written, and realise that the majority of spells and class features are the way they are for a reason, and that reason is generally not, in fact, arbitrary, but ties in with the balance of the system which has spent the past many, many years being refined and tweaked. It's not perfect, but it's a damn sight better than a group of game developers' impromptu hacks that lack in any kind of foresight or understanding of a system that they very genuinely do not really seem to understand very well at all.

Yes, different creatures may do better getting out of the way of the fire than others, or take better advantage of the options they have in the moment - That's what the saving throw is for representing; whether they take less damage than their compatriot because they managed to avoid the brunt of the attack more effectively, for any and whatever reason...

Sorry, I've had a rough week. If I come across as harsh or angry, I don't mean to...

If fireball is now rolling separately for each creature, are they going to change dragon sorcerer's elemental affinity so that it doesn't just affect one single damage roll for one creature? Because the way that feature works in RAW, it would only affect one individual damage roll set out of potentially many (depending on how many creatures you hit with fireball). Similar issue with empowered spell.

@Niara Thanks for an explanation as always.