Larian Studios Forums Baldur's Gate III Baldur's Gate III - Suggestions & Feedback [Need] Regular Ammunition, Gear Durability

BG3 need regular ammunitions. I don't care 5e or whatever e, in BG1 and 2 there was regular ammunitions for the range weapons. Now they are gone. Why many old players hate Diablo 3? Because Diablo 3 ditched a lot of interesting detail that Diablo 2 used to have, including the good old regular ammunitions.

BG3 need Gear Durability. BG3 so far has a big problem, which is the player's equipment progression and loot balance. Player party get decent magical gears pretty early on and loot tons of blank gears early on and hoard tons of gold piece early on. There are no interesting way to deal with these magical gears, blank gears, and gold pieces. Giving gears a durability value will help resolve this crisis.

I wouldn't cry if they implemented ammunitions, but I'm not exactly missing it either.

Absolute thumb down for item durability, though.
I don't even hate the mechanic in general on systems where it can fit (even if I can't think of many cases where its addition made the game better) but it's decidedly a NOT-D&D mechanic that has no business whatsoever showing its face in BG3.
And the "item problem" you are talking about doesn't really exist.

Also, as from D&D tradition better gear later in the game will increase in cost EXPONENTIALLY, so I wouldn't worry about having chances to spend tens of thousands of coins. Even on a single purchase.
Some of the "end game" items available to vendors in BG2 climbed up to almost 100K gold each. And that's before Throne of Bhaal.

DnD mechanics were designed for tabletop and keep tracking a gear's durability in a long run with pen and paper is a dull job, but here with the help of computer these data will be easily stored, updated and clearly displayed.

Absolutely disagree on durability. In every game, it is busywork that tries to fix some issue but always end up as the most hated part of the game. See Zelda BotW. The only games where durability make sense are games where the goal is already to gather as much ressources as possible like Minecraft.

-1 to durability

In the latest Zelda, the durability system was served for limiting the usage of any "unbalanced" weapon. But its casual inventory system backfired its amateur durability system, combined together turning the experience of weapon usage similar to card playing in Stonehearth or Slay the Spire, instead of weapon swinging in an action game.

There are actually good examples of weapon durability implantation among those action games, such as Sifu. In Sifu, the weapon or makeshift weapon player acquired were only good for delivering very few strikes, but the whole game's pacing was not disrupted but instead enhanced, just like those many arcade games back in the old days.

Diablo 2 also had pretty decent durability system that help control the inflation. So does WOW back then when players' level was capped at lvl60. For these two games, the item durability system helped balancing the economy of the game and did a solid good job.

In post apocalyptic games like Underrail, or Fallout News Vegas, the durability system also did an okish job at pacing the equipment progression which I feel BG3 somehow lacks: player party get overwhelmed by magical gears very early on once clearing the goblin camp.

But, well, on second thought, maybe we don't need item durability system at all in BG3. After all, we have Gale, that pain in the a** will help getting rid of anything that actually worth keeping.

I’ve generally found durability a minor irritant in any game I’ve come across it, so wouldn’t be in favour of homebrewing it into BG3. With respect to the availability of magical items, I’m guessing that will change on full release as Larian will have been testing out reception and what is actually used in Early Access.

Like Tuco, I wouldn’t object if regular ammunition were introduced, but it’s not something I’m gagging for. Unless some means of introducing scarcity, such as cost or reduced availability/carrying capacity, were involved then making sure we always had enough ammunition would feel like mildly tedious busy-work to me. But if there were scarcity, then I’d probably also want some sort of ammunition recovery system which would further introduce development and balancing complexity. My sense is that it wouldn’t add enough enjoyment to the game to be worth the faff, but as a general rule I don’t and wouldn’t object to adding any 5e RAW elements, which ammunition is, unless there’s a very good reason why they wouldn’t work well in the game.

Fair enough.

Quivers and Ammunition for me is a must for a Baldur's gate game. Don't care if its busy work...thats why I like and play RPGs.
Durability mechanic on the other hand is what made me stop playing Zelda BotW.
Loot progression and balance is Larian style. I hated it in DOS1, despised it in DOS2 and am not liking it that much in BG3.

I hope that WOW multi-color coding system that EVERYONE uses now will someday burn in hell for eternity. It forces common green magical items to be bad, pointless and everywhere in the world. It overloads the world with magic junk, making <magic> a bore.

I don't believe there's really a crisis. Some people think the current setup even is too restrictive. I don't disapprove of making your own life hard on higher difficulties. But, I'd prefer that be over strategic limitations rather than a repair gear -- rob merchant loop.

I've been playing witcher 3 recently. It works somewhat because it makes the world feel more hostile. I don't think that's the tone I'd really want for BG3 personally.

I'm all for getting quivers, for all that matters. It's counting ammo that is whatever.
As I said you wouldn't hear me complain if they added it, but I'm not exactly longing for it either.

People keep mentioning BOTW, but that's a rather extreme case where weapons are treated as consumables.
That said, I can't think of many other games where a durability system wasn't either a gratuitous annoyance or a completely vestigial system that hardly played a meaningful role.
Maybe Battle Brothers where it was a significant part of your resource management, but that's about it.


No, it isn't?
As someone who always listed the itemization as his LEAST favorite/most disliked aspect of DOS 1 and 2, I have no idea how you can not recognize that BG3 works in an entirely different way.
Most items are unique, they are hand-placed in the game world and their scaling system is pure D&D, without that layer of massive stat bloat that defined the itemization in DOS.

Personaly i wouldnt be against either ...
In game where it would serve some purpose. :-/

Say ... IF BG-3 would have much more restrictive resting system, then yeah, it makes sense to give every class some resource to work with ... Casters can loose their spellslots, Shooters can run out of amunition, and Meele weapon can break ... all good i would say.

But what would be the purpose here?
No matter where you are, no matter what is happening (except for combat) ... you can allways simply teleport to nearest vendor and buy/repair whatever you want.

So, what exactly it would bring, or improve?
Nothing, thats what.
You would simply buy 5000 arrows, and never remembered them ever again.

True. The current system provides casual experience only. Guess it's the cost of being multi-platform.

Yes you are completely right, it is WAY better than the previous DOS games. I still feel that so many magical items are quite meeeh (not very interesting) and way too common. They also lack a strong <LORE> binding to the world.
It can be done with short (or long!) interesting descriptions ala BG1/BG2:

Edventar's Gift, Ring of Free action(BG1):
"This ring was given to the reef scavenger and hunter known only as Edventar by a group of aquatic elves long his friends. His help in routing the "Pirate Queen" Yenandra of Dambrath was instrumental in their survival, though Yenandra continues to be feared anywhere the water meets land. "

Kiel's Morning Star(BG1):
"This is the morning star of Kiel the Legion Killer, firstborn son of Durlag Trollkiller and Clan-prince of his father's ill-fated tower. He was wielding it in his final hour as he rushed to warn his father of the doppelgangers' infiltration of their Clan-home. It is said that the intensity of his rage in these final moments permanently imprinted itself upon the weapon. All who wield it are overcome with this battle anger whenever an enemy is sighted."

The Root of the Problem(club)(BG2) :
This enchanted club is said to have existed since the time of the fall of Netheril and the birth of the great Anauroch Desert. While the toll on civilization was great, the true victims of this age were nature's creatures, condemned to stand and watch as their homes decayed and died. As habitats receded, those that remained were invaded by displaced hordes of creatures, the more impatient of which marched on unspoiled land taking whatever they wished. This particular weapon is said to have come from a dryad's tree, a final gift to nature's cause from a woodland spirit that could not hold back the invaders of her land. Hers was a bittersweet pain, as her wood might not have suffered so if it had not been so strong and lush. Less respecting scholars have since bestowed the item's ironic name, though the humor is not appreciated among nature's more devout followers.

The Vampire's Revenge (Sword)(BG2)
It would seem that the very speculation of this weapon's existence has conspired to pull it from the realm of fantasy and into the everyday- though, as with all things that come from dreams, it is not as it truly seems. The blade is indeed vampiric, as the name would suggest, though not in the manner the finder might have hoped. It is rumored that the blade, instead of performing as one might think a vampiric blade would, was actually constructed by vampires as a trap for those that could eventually oppose them. These incredibly clever fiends have apparently fashioned numerous versions of these unfortunate blades over time, and they are the bane of all right-thinking adventurers. Each swing actually inflicts damage upon the wielder, as his life energies are drained in order to heal his intended victim. Were this not enough, the weapon is cursed so as to prevent it's removal, and the user is smitten with a wasting of the mind, that he might not even think of trying to rid herself of it. This may be among the few magical treasures that are simply not worth the trouble of seeking, and one might better spend ones time having a lovely beverage, rather than gallivanting about the wilderness with a pack full of rubbish chasing phantoms.


BG3 magic items descriptions...basically just tells you how the item looks like for most, and repeated for many items, no matter how rare:
Rings for example.

A radiant and remarkably preserved ring, forged from arandur metal.

This ring is forged from a smooth, alien metal, capped with eyes of emerald that watch the world unblinking.

Though carefully stowed away in a bedside chest, this ring is covered in dust and cobwebs.

The stone in this metal ring glows a faint, deathly ochre
etc...

Zero lore= Boring and forgetable itemization. For me at least this is a huge part in playing a Baldur's Gate game. I read the descriptions before even checking out the stats

I would say no.

I don’t miss ammunition, and while I would welcome the mechanic for flavour reasons, I wouldn’t want it in BG3. The last thing I want is also having to manage arrows and bullets in this overcrowded inventory.

I will also say no to durability. That is just fundamentally not a fun mechanic unless it feeds into a greater system.

No to durability, +1000 for ammunition !

Back in the day I really liked playing a game and finding those little details like armour getting damaged and requiring to get amunition to shoot stuff. But fast foward in time and those things are not interesting anymore, we all have seen them, done them, and now for, I believe, most people they just feel like annoying mechanical things to do.

I would like that the things that we do are meaningful, it was pointed that the current system points towards a "casual" gameplay, but why going back to town to get some arrows would make you a non-casual or more commited player? You are just wasting time in something that has no merit.

If we talk about resource management there are way more important DnD 5e stuff left out like spell components, for example, "Revivify" should consume a 300g diamond along with the spell slot. Of course, money isn't really an issue on the game so far, nor is death with our zombie friend it seems.

Now, this things doesn't really matter to me, this game is based on strategy, there's not a huge merit on winning it because you can always approach the fight to your strengths and come on top. The gaming landscape is full of survival-resource management games, I prefer this one to be about choice and narrative, I prefer my time being spent in doing cool builds, checking different possibilities in the story and all that.


I would 100% be on board with adding systems that reward creativity of course, like some tool proficencies. Smith's tools to repair equipement? Meh.. Smith's Tools to enhance it and reflavor it? Yay!

Durability and ammunition?
Would it make it a more enjoyable 5e based game to me? No

Tightening up the rules to be closer to 5e? Yes

I like ammunition and durability, but only if it affects the gameplay considerably. In Fallout 4 for example I always played with harsh loot overhauls and durability mods (f.e. armor breaks if hit) and without fast travel, and you had to access the world in quite a different way than in vanilla. I cannot however see the impact of ammo and durability in BG3. Would the world approach and the fights look differently with it? Hardly so, for the reasons already mentioned in the thread. A harsh rest and weight carrying mechanic, and a very restricted travel system had to be introduced, for which the world is not made in my opinion.

I hope (I fear in vain however) for visual quivers but actual ammo I don't need. A kind of item durability could perhaps be simulated for magical gadgets (which for my taste are around in a terrible overabundance) if they would lose magical charge over time which had to be restored. But is it worth it? I doubt it.

There were easier changes to make the world a bit more demanding in the given frame (f.e. make shove an action, restrict stealth more to Rogues, diminish availability of scrolls and potions, introduce crossbow loading, make weapon set change cost something, remove shield AC when ranged weapons are out).



(PS: And of course the most important change I'd wish: remove torso hair from the half elves! )

Ammunition is great (and required) for special ammo; however, I don't see the point for common ammo. Arrows are cheap and light enough that I can buy/find/hold way more than I'll ever need -> why should I need to bother with the UI?

Durability is mainly just tedious unless the game mechanics support it. As you can rest and fast-travel from wherever in BG3, a durability system wouldn't make anything about the game more interesting. At worst, it'd just mean you felt obligated to rest/travel to the blacksmith more often.

The only way I'd accept durability is if there was a way to significantly damage equipment in combat (e.g, Sunder actions), but this would mean adding relevant actions, item HP & hardness, etc into BG3. And at the very least, Larian needs to implement all the base 5e mechanics before I'd want them to tackle that. Plus, this might just work better if it only lasted for that combat: e.g., "On a successful Sunder, target has -2 to AC for the next X rounds."