Larian Studios Forums Baldur's Gate III Baldur's Gate III - Story & Character Discussion Endgame Nonsense

So can anyone explain to me the logic behind the last interaction in the Astral prism before the elder-brain fight? You are pulled into the Astral Prism by the Emperor after he realizes you can't use the nether stones to defeat the brain. He then claims "only an Illithid can use the stones". Firstly that seems to be a rather big design flaw by the Human Netherease Wizard that created them but lets go with it. The Emperor than say either he can use the stones or you can (but you'll need to change into a mind-flayer) but even then only if you/he eats Orpheus' brain. The two big issues I have are:

A) if you object and say you will release Orpheus, the Emperor just gives up any attempt to remain an individual and immediately goes off to be a slave to the Elder-brain. This makes no sense! Even if your chances of success are very small he could just go hide somewhere and, if you succeed he gets to remain free and if you fail....well he's no worse off. The idea that he just gives up in a fit of peak is ridiculous.

B) once the Emperor has left and you release Orpheus it turns out that he, despite being able to hold back the power of the Elder-brain, he can't use the netherstones either. He tells you that you or he will need to become a mind flayer (it's also a bummer of an ending if he changes as the gith race is now screwed). If you refuse, he becomes a mind-flayer, but how? There is no explanation. He doesn't have a tadpole so what happens and why can't he just change back whenever he wants? If you undergo the change apparently you don't need to eat Orpheus' brains after all, so you could have released him and had the Emperor use the stones and everyone would have been happy but the Emperor won't entertain that fairly simple idea and goes off in a sulk!

The result is that you have to make a difficult choice for really no other reason that Larian think it's dramatic. Am I missing something or is this all as silly as it seems?

the hero who was searching for cure for her condition sacrifices her soul to save the city - but the MC who has been resisting the seductions of the Emperor is left with nothing but a sense of failure. Sacrifice your soul, Karlach's soul or the Orpheus. Both you and Karlach get a fate worse than death and/or all the time you invested in starting a Gith civil war is undone.

One of only two endings has you stab the Emperor/Orpheus/Karlach to death while they're "focusing their entire being on keeping the Netherbrain in check", leaving you with no mindflayer to .. focus their entire being to keep it in check, and yet you somehow get to control the Netherstones and the Netherbrain after all.

Does making Gale go full ISIS against the Elder Brain in Act 2 cause all the people infected with tadpoles to turn into mindflayers, but if you do it in Act 3 it doesn't? And like shouldn't destroying the Elder Brain do that regardless of how you destroy it do that also? What changes between Act 2 and 3 that causes destroying the Elder Brain to not turn people into mindflayers? I'm confused.

The Emperor rushing off to the Elder Brain when you decide to free Orpheus was quite unexpected and out of character, it is not something that I ran into but watched it on Youtube out of curiosity.
And Omeluum would indeed have been amazing to recruit in the fight to spare anyone from turning into Mindflayers. Omeluum is looking for an alternate source of nourishment for Mindflayers, if the world falls to the Absolute, then that would potentially pause/put a stop to his research. So convincing him to join so he could continue the research should fit into his best interest.

I do not see the Emperor as a bad guy or a good guy. Just someone who is doing what benefits them the most in preserving their freedom and survival.

Balduran while he kills a Mindflayer in the street, which does not make sense to me as I do not know why he did not disguise himself in a more humanoid form instead of using Duke Stelmane as his puppet. (I decided to just use YT vids I found for quicker examples 4:58 and 6:10 But I guess this does not really mean anything, just makes me confused on the whole Stelmane situation.

That's Balduran. And then nothing came of it, and I was just confused and realized they probably just used the same face for some random dude? But did they? I don't know. It sure looks just like Balduran from the flashbacks we got earlier.

Balduran - in squid form - is lying on the bed behind the two figures. The person in front seems to be a healer of some sort whom Ansur called in for help.

There has to be an option to be the hero without becoming an illithid. Period.

And that the emperor sides with the netherbrain if you want to free Orpheus is just illogical beyond reason. The emperor did everything to get rid of the elder brain. Why should he have any reason to side with the elder brain and be a slave again? Is Tav a bigger threat to him then the brain? From a logical point of view its nonsense.

said healer then seems to return at the end for some reason, or perhaps just his face. Still find it odd considering it didn't really seem like that scene with Ansur was so recent that a human healer would still look the same by the end of this game. But why would they so blatantly reuse this face if it's not important somehow?

[...] I personally don't understand why we're so railroaded with some of the characters. Like... the Emperor and Astarion(at the beggining of the game) are mirrors to each other, survivors!(and mind you there are other situations like that in game...) If you understood Astarion's character and gave him a chance and the Emperor cleary saw this... if You've met Omeluum and was friendly with him, and yet again the Emperor must have know about this... Why would he not give you at least a chance to explain yourself, appeal to his reasoning? Especially if You somewhat bonded with him! Why not promise You that he will let Orpheus go after all of this(and indeed make him the evil one if he would eat the prince behind Your back, that would at least give us a real and serious reason for wanting to kill him and a cool plot twist for scheming character)? I see him going to the Netherbrain as a desperate attempt to preserve himself, but only when all other choices would have been outed and how is it handled now shows he doesn't even believe in Tav's and companions abilities to preserve themselves which contradicts precisely all of his mighty plan to build up trust with them and use them for it. Why using things that You know wouldn't work?

And Omeluum... I greatly dissapprove how he was used in the story. Cleary his only purpose was for us to see that there can be somewhat good aligned mindflayer and to give us some boon(which have a lot worse meaning storywise and mechanicaly in full realese of the game). That just it. Meeting him don't have any meaning for the Tav and companions, they don't even have a serious talk about this; there is not even "oh, the Emperor is mindflayer, we know another one we could ask for advice in this matter" talk. The narration unreasonably takes from player a choice for Omeluum to be an ally in the end of game in which one of most vital points is freedom from Elder Brain for a mindflayer! You give player a character that have a power to get himself out of control of Elder Brain, capable of self sacrifice and think nobody would think about asking him for help in the matter when he cleary also is in danger along with all the Sword Coast if the Netherbrain plan comes to life? It's a huge overlook in various ways for me.

True, i also do not understand how the prince could turn into a mindflayer. Is there a missing animation where he put a worm into his eye? It is quite confusing.

Onto the subject of Omeluum and the emperor, it is odd how people are ignoring how different Omeluum is.

Omeluum's natural arcane talent "preserved" who he is, while Balduran is completed erased the moment the mindflayer took over his body. It is quite telling in the clothing they chose.
Omelumm wore the society uniform while the emperor had mindflayer clothing.

People seem to intentionally ignore or did not understand the fact the emperor is a mindflayer, and not Balduran. The imprint of Balduran is so strong, it kept thinking it is Balduran.
We are literally looking at a mindflayer with personality disorder. This explain why some of his actions, especially towards the end, feel so heroic. The imprint was acting upon itself.


Listen not to its words but its action. This could be read up in a book written by a mindflayer hunter in act 3.
The emperor action is true to a mindflayer.

1. It killed Ansur because Ansur start to realized it wasn Balduran anymore.

2. It turned Stelmane into a thrall. Given the fact she is evil literally, herself as a devil cultist - does not mask the action of a mindflayer.

3. His not so subtle lies about the only way to defeat an elderbrain is to become a mindflayer. The prince is evidence that this isnt true.

4. His unreasonable fear of the gith, drove him to side with the netherbrain.

5. Believing itself as a far superior being.

6. The most telling behavior - his constant lying and fear mongering and his endgoal.

He lied about Ansur, he lied about Stelmane, he lied about the prince will kill you immediately if you release him.

He fear monger you about the gith and your trip to hell, calling it foolish and fruitless.

Its endgoal is no different from a mindflayer. Its design for baldur gate was to control it in a more "humane" way.

7. His inability to blame itself is exactly how a mindflayer would behave. It blame you for the failure of stopping the netherbrain, claiming you can only think one step at a time while the brain can think from all angle. The group has been following the emperor guide, instruction and commands throughout the game.