Larian Banner: Baldur's Gate Patch 9
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I'm playing through act 2 as a Four Elements Monk, and while I like that in BG3 it's possible to do Flurry of Blows (and sometimes the unarmed strike) after elemental disciplines, and the disciplines in general are a lot better than in 5th edition. However it still feels a bit lacklustre for a few reasons:

  • Everything it does still costs Ki points, but Harmony of Fire and Water only lets you recover half once per long rest. There is still nothing in this sub-class that works passively, or bolsters something you're already spending Ki on (like Flurry of Blows).
  • While gaining new, higher level, elemental disciplines is nice, it never has the same kind of level of flexibility as a proper third-caster (like Arcane Trickster/Eldritch Knight). This is made worse by the elemental disciplines not having any ability to upcast them like in 5th edition.
  • By the time you hit act 2 you're already swimming in spell scrolls and magic items that let you cast spells, so being able to cast using Ki really needs to do more to justify itself compared to going Open Hand and just using scrolls for the stuff you need.
  • By a similar token, magic items that bolster melee attacks (either weapon attacks or unarmed attacks, or both) are pretty abundant, this means that choosing to not just use your free regular attack(s) + unarmed strike needs to be really tempting.


I feel like I've got a decent mix of abilities on my build with fangs of the fire snack, fist of unbroken air, water whip, and gong of the mountain, but I find this all fairly situational; fangs of the fire snake is the only one I use semi regularly, and even then a lot of the time I feel like it's better to just save the Ki for one or two Flurry of Blows over the course of most fights. Water whip for example is very situational because your speed means you can usually reach things to begin with, so as with fist of unbroken air you're very much at the mercy of BG3's finicky angling for pushes/pulls into obstacles which makes them a lot harder to use often in practice.

Part of the problem is that with an Open Hand Monk you get boosted Flurry of Blows (which you'll be using somewhat regularly anyway), plus Manifestation of Mind, Body and Soul adds passive damage to unarmed strikes, so again further boosting something you're already doing at no extra cost. And for those situations where you do need a bit of extra utility, some area damage etc., you can just use a scroll or magic item spell. Plus Open Hand gets the significantly improved Wholeness of Body ability (healing, extra bonus action, and Ki recovery!), and resonating punch gives you a really solid area damage option as it's fairly easy to stack it to cover groups, so on top of push/prone flurry of blows it's not like Open Hand is lacking for utility in combat.

My opinion is that Four Elements really needs either some additional sweeteners; some of the things I'd like to see are:

  • Harmony of Fire and Water should be a bonus action so it can be used more easily during combat for longer sustained Ki use.
  • Should gain an ability similar to Manifestation of Mind, Body and Soul but not as strong, e.g- a choice of cold, fire, lightning, or thunder as an extra 1d4 damage on unarmed strikes.
  • The ability to upcast elemental disciplines that are simply renamed spells (with upcasting) at a cost of 1 Ki per additional level, limited by the character's Monk level.
  • Some other way to get Ki points back, such as using all four elements (air, fire, water, thunder) during the combat.

Last edited by Haravikk; 06/04/24 10:23 PM.
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Improving? Not really ...
Complete rework from Wizards of the coast? Yup, definietly.

//Edit:
Im sory if this isnt the way this topic is ment ...
But i just love Monks, and quite honestly this particular subclass seems like something that is completely missing the point.

Eldrich Knight is great concept ... a Fighter with some magical sparkles ...
Arcane Trickster is great concept ... a Rogue with some magical sparkles ...
You know what theese two have, that Four Elements Monk is missing? Their class identity.
Even if you spend all your spellslots, you are still effective Fighter/Rogue ... if you spend all your casting points on Monk, what do you have? Need for rest.
And thats the problem here.

Even worse, if Monk would also get Spellslots to cast their spells, just as Arcane Trickster and Eldrich Knight do ...
They wouldnt get from it what the others do ... bcs they would just become weaker Wizard with some extra movement speed ...

Thats why i think that The Way of Four Elements should get reworked completely in order to inproove your regular Monk abilities in meaningfull way, rather than stray from it.

I have seen lots of Homebrews that were trying to do this ...
But personaly i preffer that one where you were atuning to certain element and gaining bonuses based on that ...
Basicaly Fire meaned more damage / Earth meaned more toughness / Air meaned more reach / and Water meaned even more fluid movement.
So your Monk still felt like a Monk ... but better. :3

Last edited by RagnarokCzD; 06/04/24 08:46 AM.

I still dont understand why cant we change Race for our hirelings. frown
Lets us play Githyanki as racist as they trully are! frown
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I don't feel like Four Elements Monk is that bad.

The main issue is that Open Hand is so unbelievably strong that both other Monk subclasses are complete garbage in comparison.

Like, Open Hand gets the manifestations and Tavern Brawler to make their unarmed attacks hit like trucks with high Str and Wis (With also extra utility because of synergy with things like Radiant Orb procs).

While both other subclasses just have worse unarmed attacks due to lacking manifestations and often weapons are just inferior to fully buffed unarmed.

I feel that Four Elements is better than Shadow though. Fire Snake is a nice boost to damage output when dual wielding weapons (Or when using a 2 handed weapon with weaponized bonus actions). This is on top of a few extra spells like Hold Person, Fireball and Thunderwave which will scale with your attack stat (Str/Dex) unlike normal spells and such spells are also still decent even without upcasts.

One of the main things that Four Elements is missing... Is their Fourth Element. They only get Fire, Water and Air skills... Other than that, maybe some extra scaling on Fire Snake's buff might make it more comparable to Open Hand (Like if it was 1d4 + Wis mod damage to your attacks like a manifestation)

Shadow is the Monk subclass that needs the most help though. All it gets over Gloomstalker and/or Rogue is Shadow Step (With Shadow Strike being just complete garbage compared to simply using Flurry and the excess speed a Monk has) and considering most Monks multiclass Thief for the extra bonus action it's not really standing out on its own...


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