Larian Studios Forums Divinity 2 - Ego Draconis (English) Divinity 2 - Ego Draconis beyond popularity

listening to the cult following in developing beyond divinity ruined the game for the average person-in my opinion-i had to resort to getting "help" just to play the game. I hope that the new rpg will be more like divine divinty and not all geeked up like beyond divinty. after all the motive in making games is to produce a product most of us will enjoy, and to pay our bills.

You might want to elaborate on why Beyond Divinity ruined the game for the average person... I don't quite know what you mean actually.

He precisely meant that the Larians listening to suggestions from players in the forums ruined the gameplay of <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/beyond.gif" alt="" /> - at least as far as casual gamers go.

I for one - not being member of the `cult following´ that time ( unlike with <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/div.gif" alt="" /> ) and such getting a rather fresh look on it after purchase - found the various new ways Larian dared to explore quite intriguing.

The story was nice (as far as i have played, Act3 or something last time i left), the settings were in for some pretty NPCs and surprises, the skill system had a fresh approach and appeared astonishingly balanced (Though i wished for slightly more skill points at times. You have to quite specialize if you wanna get s.th. effective.), the inventory interesting and combat entertaining.


Ragon

If by 'geeked up' you mean the additional primary stats, that wasn't due to the cult following. Actually, I preferred the additional stats, as you actually had to think about how you were going to distribute stat points. Also, you could have a little variety in character builds and customize them to your own playing style, weapon choice, etc; in DD pretty much every warrior had a 2/2/1 stat point distribution for strength/agility/constitution.

I liked some of the changes with the skill system, though would have designed some of the skills differently. Again, though, this wasn't changed due to forum feedback or suggestions, AFAIR.

Actually, I think the only 'cult following' negative influence in BD was with the voices. A group of people didn't like the voice acting in the demo, and complained often and loudly, so Larian had them redone. When the game was released a different group (most of whom were previously silent on the subject) complained loudly that the original voices were better.

The original voices were better and I said as much when people complained the first time.

well when the game came out for english language i was ill, and when trying to make all the connections to solve the quests in the university i got confused...it seemed kind-of tricky. But thankyou for the feedback on this topic. I believe that the main theme of being connected with a "death knight " was kind-of inspired and that was cool.

I understood that, too... but ruined in which way? That's what I wonderered about... and still do actually... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/think.gif" alt="" />

I wouldn't regard myself as being part of the core group here, but the problems I had with Beyond Divinity had nothing to do with any 'geeking up' - whatever that might be.

I felt the skill system was over-elaborate - I much prefer the clean simplicity of the original DD; the fact that some skills (Lock picking!) were broken was annoying; and the accidental declaration of war on entire neutral animal species when you were just trying to move drove me spare.

The University section was a pest, but by no means an unbeatable one. I finished the game without too much trouble, and certainly didn't feel I missed anything due to not being part of some clique.

The only nods to this forum I recall were some of the in-game characters being named after forum members. I doubt very much that affected the playability for anyone.

This is ruining the game ? Have I understood that correctly ?

What is ruining a game with having riddles to selve ? <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/beyond.gif" alt="" /> was no hack & slash game, although gaming magazines and website often say so (and the game actually feels like that in the battlefields, imho).

Was is ruining that a game advertised as a pure hacvk & slash game actually had tricky riddles in it ? Was this unexpected for the casual gasmer, who expected a hacking game ?

These are questions that come to mmy mind what I read your post.

I dislike BD greatly, mainly because you attack like you're some sort of fat ogre who's high (specifically the speed at which you attack). But I understand why he didn't like it. Those who have played DD, it's sort of like Devil May Cry 1 & 2, the first is original, but the sequel takes a new look, and you lose that essence which carried the first game high.

Questing / storyline:
The ability to feel like you are achieving something. BD was too linear, and if there were any side quests, which were optional, then I certainly didn't find many at all. The storyline gave me little pleasure, and it wasn't intense enough. In DD it was very loose, but this was ok because of all the side quests and places to explore.

Simplicity:
BD had one too many stats, I for one had no idea how to distribute them, and it still boggles me. It's nice saying experiment, but you get too dragged into the dull running around, and you start not to care.

Player freedom / space :
BD felt too small, to put it simply. The battlelands were good, but that was overdone in my opinion. This is where DD falls slightly, but it still dominates BD easily. The sewers themselves were the big blow, upon replaying a few times, it got incredibly tedious.

Keep it to what the screenshots show in the next game, simplicity and a range of spacious areas to explore, with plenty of side quests. Add good puzzles, which aren't hard, some which require initiative and some skill. i.e. pyramid traps such moving blocks and hidden traps doors and spikes /gg

yeah that's right...divine divinity rullz!!! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wave.gif" alt="" />

yup <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/XmasJump.gif" alt="" />

It seems to me that when games cater too much to casual gamers, the games get "dumbed-down". The strongest example would be the Elder Scrolls series. Morrowind was a fantastic game for hard-core gamers and casual gamers alike... without compromising gameplay. However, with Oblivion, they catered to casual RPG gamers a lot more, and the result was an over-simplified game world.

One of the reasons I adore Divine Divinity was that it gave so much to hard-core gamers. Silly balance issues like overpowered spells are not a problem for people not obsessed with "beating the game".

I just found a copy of Beyond Divinity, and have not had a chance to play it; however, it looks like another game which caters to hard-core players. I love this. This is what makes Larian Studios great. There is an endless myriad of companies that make cheesy RPG's which do nothing more than cater to people who have no idea how to play.

Furthermore, I have never seen a 2D game with as much playability and role-playing value as Divine Divinity. The combat felt wonderful. There was nothing cooler than taking out an entire orc army by myself. They need to expand on this concept. Most of all, the world felt real. You could feel the struggle of the poor in Divinity. You coud feel the hopelessness of the human armies as the orcs sent waves after waves of berserkers at the lines. The danger and isolation of the forest was real.

A huge worry is that the next game will move further to the Fable gamestyle: short, simple, and shallow. As a dedicated player of Divinity, with easily over 200 hours of gameplay... I want the game to be complex. I want it to have almost endless replay value as Divinity does. There are enough RPGs to cater to every 6-year old who gets his hands on a keyboard.

According to the marketing whizzos at great publishers, this is the perfect mix to generate a lot of profits !

Or so I believe.

Absolutely. Until this game is released, I will lay awake at night and pray that it does not become another victim of this horrible disease.

Bethesda has fallen victim to this slow and painful decay. Now, Larian Studios is my final refuge in the world of the RPG.

Gothic 3 fortunatly didnt had the "disease", thats why half of the people praise it and half of them hates it..

From what I've heard Gothic 3's biggest problems was that it's beta in the box, and that they still havn't fixed that...

Oh, and I agree on the dumbing down <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />. Dumbing down is bad...

Übereil

Gamers always want better, better and better... better graphics, better ai, more realism, more cool effects.
This comes at a great cost, making games takes more work, more artists but gamers don't want to pay more, they assume its the devolepers duty. Developer's dumb down gameplay, story, playtime just to get their games make profit.

So don't point your fingers just at developers and publishers, look at yourselves and fellow gamers and decide what you really want spending your money on games. As many of you, the larian fanbase allready think this way. A lot more don't. So it's only sane business logic to make what gamers don't really want.

You haven't noticed that they had already poroduced some patches ?

But they also say that they'll still have a *lot* of work to do.

A kind of poll here in Germany had the result of Gothic being elected by German readers as the best and the worst game of 2006 at the same time.

Yeah, I know they've released patches. But from what I've heard it's still buggy, and that's what I mean.

When they get it done, I think it will be a good game though (havn't played it so I'm not really fit to talk about it, other than rumorwise <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />).

Übereil