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Joined: Jan 2014
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Hello,

So, as the topic suggests, the point of this thread is that I would like to suggest an alternative to the current bonuses granted by choosing certain types of answers in conversation.

Currently, one is only assigned a bonus for having a trait like "Altruistic" etc. What this does is force anyone with an interest in doing any sort of min-maxing to be forced into constantly being "Independent" etc. in order to continue getting more bonus points instead of reducing said bonus.

My suggestion, to not dissuade people from being moderate if they so choose, is to assign both a bonus and a malus for each point.

This way, no one is punished ultimately for the conversational choices they make, and for those unconcerned with the roleplaying aspect can still figure out a way to respond to questions to cherry pick the bonuses and maluses they like.

An example would be "Altruistic" would increase Charisma by 1 and decrease Reason by 1.

This is clearly not an exact science in my formulation of it, and I do not claim to know if exact opposite counter-balances would be proper (+5% damage and -5% healing isn't really a malus unless one invests in healing, for example, which is likely not needed on both heroes).

Any other formulations of the same type of thing or other thoughts on the matter are surely welcome. Thanks for reading.

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That's the intended point of Traits, actually. Traits are SUPPOSED to have both a bonus and malus attached, but right now the malus is not implmented. I do not know if it actually will get implemented, but I will be disappointed if it does not.

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Someone correct me if I'm misunderstanding traits, but from what I can tell they seem to be a sliding scale. For example, "Pragmatic" increases your Reason score by 1 point, where as "Romantic" (on the opposite side of that scale) increases your Luck score by 1 point.

Now, the trick here is that you can never receive a bonus from Pragmatic and Romantic at the same time. Also, even if you (for example) make a dozen Pragmatic choices and never choose a Romantic choice, you will only have a +1 in Reason gained from being Pragmatic a dozen times (and not +12 as you might expect). In order to ever be considered Romantic (and earn a +1 in Luck), you'd have to make 13 Romantic choices (and no further Pragmatic choices). Of course, at that point you lose your Pragmatic standing as well as the +1 bonus to your Reason score.

The original post mentions Traits pushing min-maxers into making choices they may not necessarily want to make, but instead feel they have to make in order to receive their preferred bonus. I can attest that I often feel that way while playing as well. However, I'm realizing that this sliding scale setup allows players to have at least a little wiggle room in this area. For example, if you want to have that +1 bonus to luck, you really only need to make sure you've made X+1 Romantic choices, where X (in this case) equals Pragmatic choices. And that's it. If you've made 6 Pragmatic choices, you need to make 7 Romantic choices to maintain that +1 bonus to Luck. It's not like you can't ever make a Pragmatic choice.

Now, that's going to be easier for players whose opinions sit closer to the center.. that is, you're both a bit practical and a bit of a romantic at heart. But for players who have strong opinions in one direction, they're going to be the ones that are going to find it more difficult (and unnatural) to gun for certain bonuses. And I'm not really sure what can ever be done to resolve that other than for Traits to influence stats at all (and then what's the point in even tracking Traits?). Even if Traits provide a positive and negative effect (as suggested in the posts above), I think people would still have a preference.. or worse, feel pressured into staying squarely in the middle (i.e. neither Pragmatic nor Romantic).

Honestly, I can't figure out if I like the Trait system, can only tolerate it, or just outright hate it. Which.. may be a sign of a problem with the concept, or the implementation, or even with me. :P

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The next patch is supposed to change Traits up a bit:

(Trait) Bonuses for Conversation are Ambiguous
Originally Posted by "Lar"
We'll be going through the traits system shortly and you can expect changes. The assignment [of] boni so far was rather arbitrary and served more as a test of the dev pipeline. Your points are very valid btw & reflect the original vision more than the system as is.



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