Larian Studios Forums Divinity - Original Sin Divinity Original Sin - Beta My thoughts on 1.0.59 (nitpicks and fix requests)

Argh, argh, argh. I did consider going back to talk to her again after witnessing her haranguing Aureus, but it didn't seem like an obvious thing to do, the impression I got was that Roberts could give you money to pass on to Bertia, and she would be mollified. If you told her who did it without paying her, THEN she would tell Aureus. It didn't seem to make sense another way.


30. [Balance] Poison and Fire do way too much damage
I don't mind a challenge, but the damage that poison and fire do is well beyond reasonable and into absurd ranges. Example: Madora was standing behind an undead zombie boar I made the mistake of attacking, and it spewed poison onto the ground. She took 10 + 36 + 42 = 88 damage in one round without moving. Her max health was 108.

It's nearly impossible to deal with these kind of effects. No healing spell or potion can keep up. Maybe keep this kind of damage rate for Hard difficulty, but I'm on Normal, so maybe tone it back somewhat.


31. [Dialogue] Missing "Fine, we'll do it your way"
Quest-related Dual Dialogues should have Fine, we ll do it your way in all cases where there is a charm/intimidate/reason dialogue check. This is so prevalent in the beta that I fear this issue is in almost everything in the entire game.


32. [Persistent Bug] Loremaster does not show enemy information
Maybe I am missing something. Maybe the mechanics have changed and Larian hasn't told us about it. I don't know what's going on here, but ever since unidentified items and the ability of Loremaster to ID them was put into the game, you can no longer use CTRL + mouseover to see enemy Stats. I think Syvion took a look at it a couple patches ago and discovered that Loremaster 1 and 2 no longer gave bonuses, Loremaster 3 gives you enemy armour, and Loremaster 4 gives you about 4 different bonuses when mousing over.

So what's going on with Loremaster? Did the key change or has Larian not gotten around to fixing the Loremaster 4 has a load of stuff bug?



33. [Equipment] What are garments and why do I not find them?
One of our equipment slots is for a Garment. I'm not sure what the purpose of those is, because I do not recall ever seeing any of that type drop or appear in stores. So what is it with those? Do they serve a purpose?



EDIT: Okay.


34. [Design] Buffs do not re-stack
Re-applying a second buff on top of an existing buff uses the AP, but it does $&*&ing NOTHING. This is very poor design. If I am trying to heal someone who is under Healing, I want my buff to overwrite the one already on it. What should never happen is that I am allowed to spend the AP and nothing happens. If you do not want players to be able to overwrite buffs, then they should not be allowed to apply them to a target under that effect in the first place. Fix this.


35. [Naming] Mobile Kitchen is not actually mobile
Maybe add a right-click context menu so you can take it back. If you think taking it back is too easy, maybe require three branches to create a mobile kitchen framework before you can place the pot?

Or, you know, maybe just rename it.

Yea, I agree. Rock-paper-scissors game is stupid when you're playing singleplayer - it's like arguing with yourself. I already know what outcome I want, so not getting it only leads to frequent reloading everytime protagonists argue amongst themselves.


I actually did find one of those consistently by digging one of the graves near Church location in previous version. It had no bonuses save for purely cosmetic ones.

Garments start appearing in vendors inventories once you reach level ... 8 or 9.
And most of those have bonuses.

Same as the belts start appearing only then. With bonuses too.


Currently, several equipment items are very underrepresented. Belts, garments, helmets and boots.
There are only cloth and those winged metal helmets in the game now, until you get to very high levels. The effects they give seem very limited.
Only basic leather boots (with different effects) until you get to level 8 or 9.


Rings appear more rarely then before too. While their effects seem to be less varied. But that might be just my experience...

Ah, okay.



36. [TERRIBLE][Design] Puzzle ruined by hand-holding
Yes, it's me complaining about the burial mounds again. Because it's LAME.

I went into the NW mound with my entire party, read the tombstone, and left to go to the SE mound. My entire party was in the SE mound. I entered the combination from the NW tombstone on the SE buttons. With each button I pressed in sequence, my character said "I have a particularly good feeling about this".

THIS IS TERRIBLE.

This is terrible terrible handholding. Larian dismisses Skyrim's quest markers as hand-holding, but giving those hints to the puzzle is even worse! It's a puzzle!! It's supposed to be a challenge to solve!!! It's something that (according to Wulfram) has stymied people for hundreds of years. My entire party was there, so there isn't even the weak justification of "we're giving this hint in case you didn't switch views to the other party member in time to see".

I recognize that it may be hard, and that even the current version of the puzzle taxes the noggins of some modern gamers too much, but personally, I think that the best version of the puzzle was earlier when the hint that it gave you was the order of what surfaces the game wanted you to create. You see, the elements which appear, don't match the element of the button you press in the other mound.

When you press a button in the NW something appears in the SE.


It took me a while to figure out how to solve it, but when I did, it was a fantastic feeling. But there is no fantastic feeling anymore.

It literally does not matter at all that the buttons produce different elements in the current version of the puzzle, because the gravestone gives you the order you're supposed to press the buttons, not what they're supposed to produce. I recognize though, that going back to that challenging, fun puzzle is probably not going to happen because people would complain that they have to think.

Between the inscription on the gravestone, the flames on the pillars, and the rat-hints, the hints to solving it are more than generous enough. Get rid of the comments which are literally walking you through the puzzle. It's cheap and completely ruins it. Why even have a puzzle at all.

In the words of Angry Joe, "You've done fucked it up!" That was such a great puzzle and solving it felt really good. *sigh* This is just depressing.



37. [Graphics] Freshly sunk ship has moss growing on it.
The shipless sailors are complaining about their ship getting sunk in an orc attack, but the moss makes it look like it has been there for ages. I guess that is a placeholder and will be fixed.


38. [Nitpick][Immersion] Can still see unbroken window
This may be most anal of nitpicks, but Jake's killer escaped from his room by breaking the window, but you can still see from the outside that it is intact. Really nitpicky and low priority, I know, but maybe toss some more extra boards on the outside to completely cover the window.


39. [Dialogue] Harbour gate warnings do not match Cyseal gate warnings
Larian's heard this before, I'm sure, but the harbour gate warnings were in first, but now it should be made to match the 'no companion/low level' warnings you get when trying to leave Cyseal from up top.


40. [Graphics] Mysterious Opponents do not resemble player characters
I'm not sure if this is intentional to save time and effort, but the mysterious opponents in the Burial Mounds resemble the old fixed Scarlett and Roderick characters, back when you couldn't change appearance and portrait. Now either one or both mysterious opponents look like your character, or they don't, which doesn't seem to make sense. If it's not supposed to be a mirror match, then maybe change the Mysterious Opponent portraits. That would definitely be easier than trying to get the new guys to match what you created.

i completely agree about that puzzle.

I didnt know the previous version was like that. Thats great.

Having to split the party so you have two people (or just one hunter if youre "soloing") in each dungeon - so you can check the effects pressing those switches is causing? Thats great.
Then even the "mysterious opponent" would make sense.
Now i just rofl-stomp both of them with my four characters party. Whats the point of that?


Larians... atleast do these things for the "hard" difficulty?
Otherwise youll make the whole game incredibly easy because some "players" started complaining about most normal things in a game like this.

I have just finished my first playthrough after the 1.0.59.0 update, and thought I would throw my two cents a.k.a. feedback in this thread as well (hope you don't mind me adding my thoughts Stabbey):

Bugs found:
- Resurrection scrolls do no longer work when targeting the portrait of the player you're trying to resurrect. Since it is often difficult to target the character model due to element effects, this should be changed back as it did no harm to allow easy targeting like that (besides all other spells work when targeting portraits)
- When exposing traps or encountering an unfortunately combo of element effects, you get an explosion effect, which lasts forever. E.g. I dug up a grave which added a permanent poison cloud, Next grave over added a fire trap. The fire lit the poison = fire on the ground, poison cloud gone. Only poison cloud came back before any rain spell could remove the fire, Thus resulting in a forever shaking screen. My attempt to save and then reload resulted in a game crash and a corrupted save
- Several item types still do not stack. It has become better after the update, but I had a huge problem with minor healing potions, and it is not a stat issue. They weigh the same, cost the same, and heal the same amount, and Thus they should stack

Crafting/repairing:
- The extremely small tutorial in the beginning should be amended to explain how blacksmithing and crafting Work together with the latest change. I could not figure out precisely how many skill points was needed in each to work a sword and armor, sometimes I could other times I couldn't
- There need to be a repair all equipped items button in all vendors. As of now you have to spend 2 minutes unequipping all items and then talking to the vendor, and then equipping them Again. Yes it is "realistic", but the usability of this is really bad. It gets even worse if you want one of your characters to do the repairing and transfering items become an issue
- Regarding recipes. I really like the crafting system overall, but again from a usability point of view, the developers should really take a page of the standard MMO page; Once a recipe is learnt, then make it so I can access it from the Recipe tab and directly see how many of the ingredients I have & need, and make it so I can press craft directly in the Recipe tab
- Again for usability purposes I highly recommend adding a feature which shows what books you've already read. There's a reason it's one of the most downloaded mods for Skyrim


Inventory:
- Kudos for adding the sort drop Down, but honestly I used it once and found it never ever sorted the items how I liked it. I lacked two possible sorting options: 1) Compress all items but order unchanged, 2) by type (same type as the tabs, just in the main screen). Also the inventory while trading should represent your actual sorted inventory and not a randomized order
- While I really like the right-click options in the inventory screen, it has unfortunately made identifying magic items a drag. Just add a Identify all possible items an option (and preferably across characters inventories)

Leveling and skill mechanics:
- Several abilities in the character screen still lack description on what they do, e.g. Charm does say how it affects NPCs (and it's not points in the mini game rock-paper-scissors nor is it their attitude)
- I like the idea behind the reworked "Way of.." abilities and thus the requirements for skills, however I do think several of the requirements themselves need huge rework. However the way it is now did make me go way more dual class with my characters where as I before specialized them, so that is good in my opinion

Combat difficulty:
I played entirely on Hard and for the first time ever I felt it was hard, a couple of things though:
- I have read somewhere that developers think enemies now use too much CC. Personally I like they use it a lot, as I as a player use it a lot. I recommend reworking CC instead; now a CC is a simple RNG save against a difficulty plus some effect from Willpower and Bodybuilding. Why not make the save into brackets? (e.g. burning could have no success, full effect success, middle success resulting in either less rounds or lower damage)
- Fights with enemies were exiting with the new AI and abilities they use, however that joy was overshadowed by immense irritation of the traps; every single trap in the game either one-shotted all characters even a decked out Madora, or it took 90% of all hit points within 2 seconds and setting a debuff giving more damage. It is unhealable and not enjoyable, yes traps should hurt bigtime, but they should not outright kill the character unless it is for story purposes.

Other suggestion:
I have had another post regarding pick pocketing, but I say it here again: The way this Works needs to change. More specifically you should not be prohibited from pickpocketing the same NPC twice.
I usually choose the Get Englander arrested option for the Orc/Elf blood-feud quest, and by now I know I need a skill level of 2 in order to pickpocket Englander. But seriously if I as a new player try to pickpocket him, take something e.g. his key, then I am locked out from ever even trying to get the medallion later when I have enough skill level. I just don't understanding the reasoning behind this.
I like the weight+value determined by skill level system determining what you can pickpocket. Why not instead of only allowing a single pickpocket try in the entire game for that person, you add a modifier after the first try representing the NPC become more aware, so suddenly it's not weight+value but weight+value+#pickpocket_attempts

Some thoughts on topics in this thread.

11. [Feature] More formation options needed
I'd probably use this if existed:
o...o
..o..
..o..

While Walking I think they should all go into a straight line and only when stopped, go back into a set formation. This allows your followers a safer passage through. I played with the straight line for a while, it is safe traveling, but in battle they were too spread out to start.

My current fav formation one with 2 fighters and 2 mages is:

o..o
o..o



13. [Design] Item-based Health Bonuses worthless
Agreed. One thing I like overall is Larian actually gives out meaningful stat bonuses in general, making me actually want them. This one however is way under-scaled to have real meaning. 50-100 is more like it with what HP we do have and what enemies dish out. Currently HP based items have zero weight with me being too low.


14. [Annoyance] Immediate rotation of formations - should not move the whole team the second you choose one or select a character.
Agreed. I'd go as far to say is they don't move at all into the new formation unless the new controlled character moves. AND after fights no one moves until into the set formation until you move the controlled character. And/Or going one step further a 5 second "Damage immunity" is given to the team after combat ends so they can safely re-align. We lose more characters this way. I can take down notable villans, but after a long battle I don't have the senses to stay out of fire or poison. Then I needlessly have to fiddle with the mechanics of resting/reviving. (Repeated Bonus - An option to pause when you take DOT damage in Real-Time navigation mode. Feels out of place getting real-time DOT damage in a TB game.)


15. [Design] Resurrection just gets you insta-killed again.
After rez. character needs a 5 second damage immunity timer if out of combat.


16. [Balance] Archers get Poison Cloud arrows in West Cyseal?
The game has a lot of OP powers, I don't think Larian should listen too much too feedback about it being too hard. First almost always they are not playing on easy. So Clint Eastwood would say "You should play on easy". Second many are determining that at level 3. Once you understand the game more, you become a lot stronger just with that knowledge if nothing else changes. But there are a lot of OP powers, I've been thinking of listing all the powers I've used with a review of each, not sure, that will take some time.


17. [Design] Status effects get double hits/saves in the first round
Yeah I've noticed across the board which seems like double-tripple dipping of damages in the same round, hero and villan alike. This also contributes to some OP skills.


25. [Balancing] More Talents Needed
At first sight when I started playing it looked like tons. Perhaps some have to be rebalanced after changes to the game. There are definitely some good one's but there are several that I just don't see their purpose.


32. [Persistent Bug] Loremaster does not show enemy information
Yep. The Ctrl thingy no worky.


33. [Equipment] What are garments and why do I not find them?
There are two questions I want to ask The Weaver of Time, when the option of "There are many questions I have for you" appears.
1. Where can I get garments? (Answered here: Garments start appearing in vendors inventories once you reach level ... 8 or 9.)
2. Who killed Councillor Jake? (That would be a funny option, your are a bit into the case when you go to the End of Time for the first time and when "There are many questions I have for you" appears, I couldn't help but think is there a "Who killed Councillor Jake?" selection.


Other Items in this thread:
- I have read somewhere that developers think enemies now use too much CC. Personally I like they use it a lot, as I as a player use it a lot.
Agreed. If I can use it, show should they. It's meant to be a challenge, you get all the goodies and their a bunch of dim wits?

Generally, that's a reasonable point, and it's something to consider... but I've been alpha/beta testing this game for over 300 hours. I am one of the voices who generally wants the game to be HARDER. I've got enough experience to know how to handle a lot of situations. So, I'm not some total newbie playing for the first time. I like a challenge and having to think carefully.


I think though, that if my full-health level 3 fighter (the tankiest character in my group), facing off against a level 3 enemy archer can be killed before their first turn (on Normal difficulty) because of the combination of initial hit + poison status damage, that there's a little issue there. If the archer gets that shot off, there's no mitigating that damage, someone is flat-out dead, no chance to heal. Knowledge doesn't help.

Not to mention that because of the formations, the poison cloud is guaranteed to hit additional party members at the same time, meaning that if the archer gets that arrow off on their first turn, it could be a death sentence for at least half your party.

West Cyseal is the "starter zone" for combat. It doesn't have to be easy, and I'm glad that it is challenging, but speaking as someone who wants difficulty and challenge: there is such a thing as too much.

I did eventually figure out a way to try and manage archers without deaths, but it was not easy. To avoid losing anyone, you have to shut them down before the poison-cloud one can shoot his arrow.

***

41. [Balance] Farseer skill does nothing
This skill does nothing useful at all. Your default sight radius is enough to see in most cases, the shroud's edge is rarely a factor, and this skill has no combat benefit. I tested it by letting my Rogue take aim with a bow at a zombie. He had a 65 percent chance to hit. I delayed his turn and then had Jahan cast Farseer on him. His sight increased, but the chance to hit did not. It also does not increase the range of Mage spells either.


42. [Design] Traits should not grant immunity with 1 point
That is quite overpowered. Plus, it gives no reason at all to increase those Traits past 1 point. Status effects like Cursed and Charmed should not be completely taken off the board with just a single point in a trait like Forgiving and Blunt, that's poor design. Instead, each point into Forgiving/Blunt should increase the saving throw by 20%. That is still useful.


43. [Design][Worldbuilding] Hint at secret tunnel for new players
This isn't a critical thing, maybe a little nitpicky, but it's an interesting option. The secret tunnel isn'tcompletely hidden, but it's also not particularly notable to spot. In story terms it's an explanation for how Evelyn smuggled Jake's body out into the undead-infested wilds, but this isn't actually stated anywhere.

One notion I have is to have Robert's journal (and possibly Roberts confession) mention that when he arrived at the graveyard early to bury the sheep, he noticed the gaping tunnel entrance, and he quickly covered it up to avoid inconvenient questions.

This would hint at the existence of the tunnel to an exploring player and allude to that as being the corpse's smuggling route without it being explicitly stated. This is just a minor thing, though.


44. [Request] A general merchant for crafting supplies
Crafting can be very useful. Something to help would be more crafting ingredients available for sale, or a merchant who specializes in such things, so you can buy some ingredients in bulk (not just "oh look this merchant randomly has a single ingredient". This will give the player a decision whether to spend gold to get specific things they want, or to save their money and take their chances with random loot.

I agree pretty much across the board. But that is also a part of the difficulty choice as well. So if you are playing Hard in most games it's just the basic #'s changing to be more unfavorable to you. If I read the notes correctly the higher the difficulty option, the more wicked tactics the AI will use on you, which is good thinking on the designers part.

When I mentioned skills are over powered that totally goes both ways and what you describe is one of several we could lay out. I think on harder difficulties they should use advanced tactics but there still is a right and wrong about how it plays out. One shoting should be bordering on not possible less a major boss. Let alone possibly wiping a team so easily.

There are many skills I can really devastate the enemies, I assume those tables can turn pretty easily to. High-end damage #'s need to be brought down for both sides.

#41-#44, pretty much a yep.

While I like the current difficulty level of hard mode, I do agree with this. All element effects needs to be toned down a bit, and this goes both for enemies and players. As a player I can obliterate most enemies using fire before they are even close to hitting me. Elemental effects will still be worth it even if they are toned down 10-15%

Great thread, i more or less agree with most things said here, however this change wouldn't improve the game for me. Imo, traps should remain lethal: Anything else is just cosmetic, since healing is free & fast in D:OS. Reducing the damage to say 50% - and nobody cares anymore. Why look for traps if you can just cast heal from time to time instead?

Yes, I heard you can pick up a stool or chair, deploy it, and sit on it for free total healing. Lol, what a joke if it is true ^^.

Here is my personal feedback on the last beta patch :

Context:
Post transfered from a wrong version thread
I've made 3 different games since the patch, one of which achieved the beta at level 10. Most of my observations come from that game.
I mostly play mages with one tank (personal taste) so can't comment rogue and ranger much as I haven't tested them

Bugs:
- Changing character inventory with the arrows of the character's sheet doesn't change the selected character : all the prerequistes shown on items mouveover (in your inventory or seller's inventory) are the one of the current selected character.
- Changing character Skills & Spells with the arrows, selects the character as intended but the number of spells allowed for each school (ie the school level) is still the one of the initial selected character.
- Shield are still not reequip after the use of a shovel
- It seems that visiting the church before Evelyn's lair still prevents Jake from appearing in evelyn's lair and then you're stuck in the murder's main questline
- Trying to freeze a wet monster and failing at it removes the wet status (observed with bitter cold)
- The show/hide helmet preference is not saved through save/load if you didn't select the character before changing the preference for him
- Summons position is inaccurate through save/load, especially when close to foe during fight
- Many items still not stack well
- The two Arhu's form (human & cat) can coexist
- Button dialog with a lone wolf char during the introduction video is not clickeable
- Frozen surfaces built by Ice Elemental summons last forever, it shouldn't be. And I think that knockback on ice is way overtuned
- Some smoke clouds never desappear (for example in the graveyard before the church) and we have no way to get rid of them (before the patch, the late tornado skill could manage that)
- I still have to see Piercing Ice Shard pierce something, never happened yet
- Rogue Trip skillbook says nothing about a dagger requirement, but you can't use it if you don't have one equiped (maybe other skills involved)

QoL and other improvements:
- Keys in backpacks are not detected !!
- Add a button to split all/join all party members + a configurable hotkey for that
- Never reorganize formation if we don't move (ie selecting a different character or at the end of a fight). It will prevent many desasters
- There's no scroll for warrior skills, which is unfair. Just a few for rogue/ranger. Just create them and add a weapon type requirement when necessary.
This way, crafting a spellbook will be possible for them just as it is for mage's spells
- The list of spellbooks sold by the sellers is completly broken. You often have 4 of the same and some spells can never be found. I know it's random, but it's quite the only way for ranger/rogue/warr to get new spells (did not found a single usefull skillbook for my warr until the end of the beta at lvl10). What Aureus is selling doesn't seem to update and I checked at each new level. I had to invest one point in scoundrel to have 3 new skills (which by the way was very nice, gave very good synergie with warrior).
- Crafting a skill spellbook requires a certain level in the school of that skill, seems to be related to the power of the spell, ie the old level spell before the patch.
It doesn't make sense anymore. The only requirement should be related to crafting (even 5 if needed), just like we need 5 crafting to create a blank spellbook
- Drag & drop an item over a backpack should put it in it
- Afterall, I find crafting not so usefull. Blacksmitting is nice to upgrade a weapon though. There should be ways to improve items to magical/rare/legendary with rare components to make it more attractive.
- I have the feeling that I always find the same items with the same stats, it's boring, think there's a real pb with itemization and random generation, a lack of diversity in the stats each kind of object can have.
- Would love a wardrobe tab for armour aside from the equipment tab in the character sheet, not sure for weapons though
- There's still no way in the option menu to configure the camera rotation, when it's just a little parameter to change in the config.lsx. Once you've change it to 360, you never come back! Most people don't know it and complain about the low rotation!
- Some skills like Divine light, Cure Wounds have a trait requirement (spiritual, righteous) which means your companions will never be able to get them. Well, it's not as if Divine light was usefull, it's much to weak and maybe bugged
- We need to find a pickaxe for mining much earlier!
- We were able to use Space for "Take All" and "End turn", we can't anymore (we have to choose)
- Garments should not have int requirement
- Esc key should select the "I'll take my leave" option dialog

Not sure:
- My char detects something when entering town next to the warehouse, I've spend some time to find out what it was, never been able to discover it
- If you go to the chest at the left of the bridge before entering town, the timer for the fire!fire!fire! quest starts, newcomers will probably miss it
- The obedient trait did not gave any bonus in my first game after release, whatever I did. It worked perfectly fine for my second party/game, so I dunno
- I still had unknown effects for early crafting, for example, using 2 branchs gave a progression bar, but no staff and branchs were not consumed. Worked fine for my third party
- In my first game, each craft resulted in 2 successive progression bars, crafting was ok though. Didn't happen in my second game
- Whereas before the patch, it was too easy to lock control boss, I find that there's too many immunity now. It's not that the game is too difficult, none of my char ever died since this patch, it just look like the easy way. Maybe an immunity and high resistances to other control would suit better.
- Past level 3/4 the game still becomes much easier, past lvl 7-8, mobs aren't able to cast many things before death
- I don't understand how the gear's color works : for example, a red cloth cap on my main char will be black on Jahan, we can't really make our team looks like we want

Overall
Even if i understand that the mac compatibility was an enormous work for you, i must say that I didn't find much improvement in the last patch. Whereas the patch note was quite huge, the only fix I really noticed was the second ring bug.
I wouldn't worry much if it wasn't for the release in one month now. What will it be for the new content?
Atm, people should solve the quests in the right order or they'll miss many things (and it's easy to mess up)

Eat more apples, people.

Fruits and Vegetables are good for you. And your Source Hunters.


Traps should be left as lethal otherwise im just going to walk all over them, chugging down a heal potion from time to time, without worrying about anything at all.





- No, they should not.
The recipes are meant to give you very clear hints and often rather clear instructions.
This should NOT show what items exactly you need.

But once you make the first item, use some combination correctly - then the necessary items should be noted in the journal, for future use. Not Before.

this really is just a nit pick but. empty cup appears in the ingredients tab along with flour and water barrel. i mix cup with barrel to get cup of water to use with the flour to make dough. but the cup of water is only tagged as consummable so disappears from the ingredients tab altogether making me have to go to all tab to use the flour and the cup of water to make the dough. i think the cup of water should appear in both the ingredients tab and the consummable tab for better invenmtory management as the all tab can be very cluttered. who agrees?

Have been doing some thinking on a potential character setup come release, and started looking more closely at gear and skills. One thing struck me as odd: My mage is wearing a magical robe with item level 9, which requires him to have an Intelligence attribute of 9. However Madora is wearing a mail chest armor with item level 7, which requires Strength attribute of 10. The same situation with roguelike and mage weapon requiring less than warrior weapons.

Now this doesn't matter for someone like Madora, whom you most likely will keep as a two handed warrior only. However if heavy armor and one-handed and two-handed weapons for warriors will constantly require a higher attribute level than their counterpart for mages and rogues, then warriors will be very hard to dualclass into anything else (effectively).

I Wonder if this is a bug, oversight, or design decision to avoid rebalancing warrior damage and thus this was just seen as an easy way out of high warrior dps compared to other classes.

I havent seen something like that myself, except as a sort of a bug - where items display requirements according to which character is actually selected - while you look over other character inventories - which does not change the selected character, - so all items and equipment show requirements relating to selected character, not the one whose inventory you are looking at.

If its not that then i have no idea what youre talking about.

All equipment and items should not have exactly same requirements? maybe?

The requirement of e.g. Strength attribute of 10 is the same no matter which character you have selected, the number is just red if the selected character doesn't meet the requirement.

However more and more this seems like an attempt to tone down warrior dps. I just finished my look at skill books, and saw some odd requirements: Helping Hand, a character level 4 required skill requires 7 in Strength attribute, which seems like a lot for such a rarely useable skill. Meanwhile Ranger skill Barrage requires character level 6, but "only" Dexterity attribute of 8.

I don't know if this thread is read by the developers, but they really should make all class skills, weapons, and armor have the same level of requirements. If warrior damage is too high, then it can and should be toned down through weapon dps levels.

As an example from my latest playthrough: Madora and my Ranger has the same level of gear, but Madora has damage of 67-169 from her weapon while my Ranger has damage of 46-80 from her weapon. And they both have a base action point cost of 4 to use.
Now naturally these shouldn't be exactly the same, but it is possible to lower warrior dps a bit (or increase ranger/rogue dps).

God no, that would be the worst thing ever. These requirements just need to be adjusted, not removed or made all the same... what purpose would that serve?

Why the hell would a pure fighter have exact same damage like a Ranger? Or a rogue or a wizard?
Her high damage is the result of her weapon and her stats - she being a specialized fighting build.
While ranger is not a specialized fighting build.


There is no dps mechanic in the game either.
Thats a completely wrong name to use in the game like this, regardless of what someone is used to.

I think you misunderstand the point I am trying to make in my post, or I haven't been clear enough in which case I apologize.

My concern goes toward being able to multiclass characters. I am not arguing for all classes and skills to do exact same damage, in fact I specifically write that in my post.

Let me run some examples; At the end of the current beta you have +10 attribute points (+5 starting the game, and +1 every second level starting at level 2).

Example 1: Ranger combined with 2 element spell schools:
At the end of the beta a typical weapon requires a Dexterity of 8 due to the item level of the magical weapon, so I spend 3 of my 10 points in Dex leaving 7 points.
Spell books giving the same level of spells typically requires 8 in Intelligence, so I spend another 3 points in Int.
This leaves me with 4 points, which I can spend to increase Constitution, Speed, and Perception.
All in all this is a viable multiclass character. A specialized Ranger would be better for that specific job, but specialized should be better than multiclass.

Example 2: Warrior combined with 2 element spell schools:
At the end of the beta a typical weapon requires a Strength of 10 even though the item level of the magical weapon is the same as for the Ranger, so I spend 5 of my 10 points in Str leaving 5 points.
Spell books giving the same level of spells typically requires 8 in Intelligence, so I spend another 3 points in Int.
This leaves me with 2 points, which I can spend to increase Constitution, Speed, and Perception.
All in all this is not a viable multiclass character.

My personal opinion/conclusion:
It is clear to me, that in order to min/max characters, you can multiclass ranger and wizard, but not warrior as multiclassing a warrior will decrease their damage output to be less than that of say a Ranger.

We can't say for sure how requirements scale after the beta content, but I am assuming it is proportionately with character level and item levels, meaning the gap will increase.

Now regarding your comment on me talking about damage, I mention damage because before the latest beta it was a generel opinion that warrior damage was too high and something should be done.

The argument I am making is this: Currently it seems to me that Larian has decided to try and lower Warrior damage output by setting attribute requirements on same item level weapons higher for Warriors than they have for Wizards or Rogue characters.

However I think this will lead to people playing Warriors go full Warrior specialization, which keeps the too high damage output. I suspect most people will want to use the big beautiful shining all powerful axe that dropped more than thinking "I have multiclassed my warrior, so naturally I should have to use drops I got 2-3 character levels ago and not the drops I get at my current level even though my multiclass Ranger/Witch/Fire character can use all her dropped weapons at the current level".

The changes to the skill system (Way of... abilities) speak to Larian wanting to make multiclassing more viable as fewer points are required in those abilities. In my opinion this change is in conflict with the current attribute requirement for strength based weapons, which "forces" you on a more specialized path.

So if this is a design decision in order to lower Warrior damage output and avoid them being overpowered, then in my opinion high attribute requirements are not the way to go.
A magical item of the same item level should cost the same whether it is Strength based or Dexterity based (if a bow of item level 8 requires 8 Dex, then an axe of item level 8 should cost 8 Str). Yes, this is my personal opinion and attribute requirement has nothing to do with damage here, it is a matter of equality between classes.
Now if Larian do want to lower Warrior damage output compared to now or before the latest update, this can easily be done by lowering the base damage of the dropped weapon.
So if you take my previous example of a Bow with 46-80 base damage, and a sword with 67-169 in base damage. Again; NOT saying they should have the exact same damage, but it is possible to lower the swords base damage by e.g. 10% instead of setting the attribute requirement to 10 and hope this will mean warriors deal less damage.