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Well, politics (and I had hoped I could stop this discussion ! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/delight.gif" alt="" /> ) has also a *lot* to do with culture.
Just cionsider that the Europeans tend to consider things different than Americans do - or at least the U.S. Governernt. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />
That's also to be seen in games : Games from the U.S. - at least this is my higly subjective view <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" /> - are rather brutal and feature violence - as a "way to solve problems" , for example , than European games - well, as I said before, my point of view is subjective. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />
Another thing is that a) Mr. Rumsfeld called all those countries who didn't want to follow Mr. Bush into War as "The Old Europe" . He - and most U.S. citizens I fear - didn't realize how strong the offence was ! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/exclamation.gif" alt="" /> Personally, I feel highly degeraded by this saying - to be old, lame, under developed, ancient, not modern, and so on. It was higly offensive for anyone I know of.
My worst fears were confirmed when I heard that the current U.S. Government will give jobs in Iraq ONLY to those countries who had been pro for them - no objective considerations at all. It's now just pro and contra - for Bush and Contra Bush.
I don't trust a Government that gives jobs only to its friends.
At least there should be some kind of respect for the critics of war - once, for criticising the whole thing, and thus explaining how (from one's point of view) everything might go wrong or is wrong in itself (the law of nations didn't say anything about a country invading another country just because it's an "evil country"). Second, respect that they dare to criticize such a "grand nation" at all. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/badsmile2.gif" alt="" />
There are countries out there where the need for invasion by the U.S. is far more needed, than just Iraq. Mr. Mugabe in Africa, for example, is driving a whole, once wealthy and rich country nuts. He needs to be thrown out ! Or that the writer and artist Ken Saro Wiwa was executed because he criticised the way companies and the government dealt with the poele in the country (heavy pollution by producing Oil, money of the selling of the Oil wandering into the pockets of the Givernment there), is another point where Bush or the president before him should have intervented. I can only shake my head : An artist is executed for criticising its Government ! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/exclamation.gif" alt="" />
From my point of View, Mr. Bush just wanted to "secure" Iraq's Oil sources - and Mr. Peter scholl-Latour, a renowed journalist here in Germany, sais the same. The U.S. is dependend ( I had almost said "addicted <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/delight.gif" alt="" /> ) to the flux of Oil. They just consume too much. As a result, the USA needs some reliable sources of Oil - Iraq, as it turns out now. Especially since the Governments - at least from my personal point of view - does nothing to minimize the use of Oil and Gas there - I mean sparing , building cars that only need a minimum of gas, for example. The Car Companies (CC) don't want to build them, just because gas is inexpensive there. As the institution which can actually make laws, the congress and the government should make laws for not using so much oil and gas - or we'll end up like in Fallout in the next few centuries.
Vision of the Future - Our worldwide resources of Oil andGas are limited. That's a fact. From a Geological point of view, Oil is a*very* special thing, because *several* factors must come together so that Oil can actually be produced. Oil is the Exception, not normality. As I envision the future, or rubbish dumps might well be places of resources - in later generations, wehen our oil has run out. The people nowadays act as if there was plenty ahead - and "after us the Flood". We - and especially politicians - don't care about our precessors, about our children. Politicians tend to think only until the next election campaign - hardly ever further. Take the point of view of a woodman : He has to think in *much* greater terms. Trees need several decades or even hundreds of years to grow, and a whole wood also needs hundresds of years, maybe. These are the terms we need to deal with ! When I hear that companies are cutting down the greatest trees that are there in the U.S. , then I can only shake my head. Why do they destroy trees that are hundreds of year old ? For fat money ? Yeah, some economists - and there are far too many of them out there ! - only thing in terms of money, of income, of profit. They don't wastze a thought on how long such a tree needs to grow. They just want to see cash cash cash.
And so act many governments : They just think in too short terms, at least until the next election campaign. The precessor can then try to repair all those mistakes made by the former government.
Going back to the current U.S. Government : There was an incident of so highly symbolical meaning that I couldn't stand it.
Shortly after the Fall of Iraq's capital city, the Museum there was plundered, scavenged. Items which are :thousandfs of years old are now lost, to reappear on someone's black market. The symbolical meaning in this was, that meanwhile this Museum with so many treasures was plundered, the only builting in ton that was guarded, was the Ministry of Oil.
I will hate Bush and his Government erternally for this.
The symbolical meaning in this is, that Culture is less worth than Oil - and therefore Economics. Oil - meant as a supply for the U.S. - was much more worth than Treasures that are thousands of years old.
I will hate Bush and his Government eternally for this.
When you find a big kettle of crazy, it's best not to stir it. --Dilbert cartoon
"Interplay.some zombiefied unlife thing going on there" - skavenhorde at RPGWatch
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old hand
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Joined: Mar 2003
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Great points Alrik. Who is the Vice President in the U.S.? Haliberton,Haliberton,Haliberton! Who is the President in the U.S.? Texas Oil,Texas Oil,Texas Oil!
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Joined: Mar 2003
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You have some good points there alrik <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />
I still find it hard to imagine how a country like america can rule the world.. When it was discovered, we "dumped" a buch of lowlifes in there, even criminals and stuff. We let them, and helped them, to murder out an entire civilisation (indians).. And now the same people are the rulers of the world, en decide to attack other countries because they are in need of oil <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" />
This is no offence to america, but just a small boy wondering whats going on in this world..
Why do we all let this happen, what has happened to our judgement? If there's one country which really really really has lots of chemical weapons, it must me America.
And if there's one country of which you don't here it on the news, it's still America.
Who are we fooling? <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/alien.gif" alt="" />
In 100 years, america will be the only country left with chemical weapons, and then it will have the world for the taking may it decide to want to..
Bad bad world we are living in <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/ouch.gif" alt="" />
jvb, royal dragon prince
Cheers!
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If you don't vote then you have no right to complain about who was elected. If you don't like who is in there, then maybe you should have voted and let your voice be heard when it actually mattered, not when it's too late to do anything about it.
i voted. most certianly not for bush. and i feel he has done a terrible job on issues that are very very important to me. that is why i don't like him.
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Excellent point, Mickey. That's what I'll do. *bows* Now please excuse me...
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old hand
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Joined: Mar 2003
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Our govt.is trying to rule the world because they can. Regular Americans like me, finance everything the govt. does from the taxes we pay. I hate it that they do all this killing in my name, with false reasons. They would impeach a President because he was having consensual sex with another adult, but would not impeach a President for lying to the American people and possibly starting WW3 in the Middle East. If the govt. really wanted Saddam out of the way, they could have sent in a special team to remove him. The American govt. (I.E. C.I.A.) are the ones that put the Bathist Party in power in Irac by helping them with weapons and money to overthrow the old party. Rumsfield (sp?)actually had a pic taken hugging Saddam soon after. Look at history. It seems that once a elected official is in office, they can do whatever they want. Money talks here. Whoever is with the money, is also in alignment with our govt..That is why France, among other counties are no longer on the "A" list of the U.S.Govt.. Hillary Clinton stated soon after the attacks of 911, that she would not be suprised if G.W.Bush allowed it to happen. Or even set it up. They didn't waste a second gettin Bin Ladins family out of this country...I wonder why? Is it because maybe the Bush's have had extensive buisness deals in the past with that family? Uhhu,yep... It may sound crazy, but, look at all the gain everyone involved is getting...What is a few thousand lives compaired to a life of luxury for them? Gog and Magog... Have any of you ever seen the movie "Conspiracy Theory"? (sp?) I do not belive that the regular Joe here is oil hungry. I personally drive a car that does not use much. I would buy one that doesn't use any oil products or natural gas if I could afford it. I bet hundreds of thousands of others would too. That is part of the game. Give the people enough to subsist and think they are getting ahead monentarily, but do not give them enough to have true power. Otherwise govt. would no longer be usefull. They would never allow that! Regular people like me gain absolutly nothing from all of this mess in the Middle east. Just more graves in the cemitary... How is that for something to chew on?
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Well, I can understand the point if you say I don't like what they do in myname (because it is my government ) . I would feel the same way - and I still do, because of the Nazis. What they had done should never be possible again. (Well, actually the Nazis wre before my birth, <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" /> but , well, that's Germany. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" /> )
(By the way, I'm curious what Michael Moore might do with his forthcoming book. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" /> )
Last edited by AlrikFassbauer; 29/02/04 09:54 PM.
When you find a big kettle of crazy, it's best not to stir it. --Dilbert cartoon
"Interplay.some zombiefied unlife thing going on there" - skavenhorde at RPGWatch
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old hand
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Joined: Mar 2003
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What seems to be happening here IMHO is the same, but with a much more underhanded, and sinister twist. The same ends are being accomplished, but in a different way...A good speaker has always been able to twist peoples minds to their wills. As they say, "Money talks. Bullsh#t walks." Alrik, when the president of the United States speaks and says it is in the interest of the American people. He speaks in my name.
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It may sound crazy, but, look at all the gain everyone involved is getting...What is a few thousand lives compaired to a life of luxury for them? Actually Mslynx it doesnt sound Crazy at all... We have discussed that extact thing me and my friends.. And what accured to us is that despite what we all may think of the world today, we dont controll it.. And we have absolutly nothing we can say in the way its controlled.. And THAT my friends are a sceary thought... The fact is that in any way you look at it, if some powerful people desides that enough is enough, and want to start a nuclear war.. They can do it..Why has it comed to this and how, is my question.. I dont want it to be this way, and I think that most of the worlds "comon" people has the same opinion about it than me.. So IMHO I really dont think any of us can do anything about it.. And I dont wanna sound like a pessimist by stating this.. But whoever we elect to sit in the gouverment, in whatever country it is, will act the in the same way.. It is the "powerrush" that gets the politicians were they are and it is the same thing that will be the end of all.. When that happens.. And I really hope that it wil take many many years before that comes.. But to be honest, it doesnt look so good..With the direction the world is headed.. And just to say it again here at the end of my post.. I am not an pessimistic person. I just face reality..
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i'd like to think we can change the future for the better for our children & everyone else. so we cannot change what has already happened today or yesterday. we can cry over those but we cannot change them back anymore.
best thing to do is buck up & do what we can to improve. maybe our mindset should change. maybe we should think of others befoer thinking of ourselves. & if others do the same & all of us take care of one another, well ..... . ok so it's just an impossible dream. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/disagree.gif" alt="" />
![[Linked Image from i3.photobucket.com]](https://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y72/tingtongtiaw/jang_sig.png) ......a gift from LaFille......
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Well, that's why I'm pro to social activities. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />
When you find a big kettle of crazy, it's best not to stir it. --Dilbert cartoon
"Interplay.some zombiefied unlife thing going on there" - skavenhorde at RPGWatch
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Joined: Mar 2003
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OK I was a little busy this weekend and holy crap....anyways to go back a ways Luc knows me better than that and if she truly was insulted I apologize but she should know better it was a flippin joke.....good lord i even wrote *snickers* or *giggles* at the end of it, and truthfully....I am not much of a giggler. At least some people were tactful enough to ask my intention before publicly berating me and trying to guilt me. Sorry my mom was a guilt queen and my guilt gland is all worn out it just doesnt work anymore.
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No need to apologise Nero. Many of us have made worse jokes. Shame Luc was so sensitive. Who can figure out the mind of a woman? <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />
" Road rage, air rage. Why should I be forced to divide my rage into seperate categories? To me, it's just one big, all-around, everyday rage. I don't have time for distinctions. I'm too busy screaming at people. " -George Carlin
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Many of us have made worse jokes. As a matter of fact, I just made one here. I didn't even write "snicker" or "giggle". Go me! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shame.gif" alt="" />
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OK that was pretty funny cause i saw it here first lol <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/delight.gif" alt="" />
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Many of us have made worse jokes. As a matter of fact, I just made one here. I didn't even write "snicker" or "giggle". Go me! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shame.gif" alt="" /> Hi Deathatthedoor And it is not the only one <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shhh.gif" alt="" /> For your revenge you can quote one of mine <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shame.gif" alt="" />
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Many of us have made worse jokes. As a matter of fact, I just made one here. I didn't even write "snicker" or "giggle". Go me! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shame.gif" alt="" /> Hi Deathatthedoor And it is not the only one <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shhh.gif" alt="" /> For your revenge you can quote one of mine <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shame.gif" alt="" /> There, I allready did it for him <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" /> Just kidding <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wave.gif" alt="" />
jvb, royal dragon prince
Cheers!
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Joined: Jun 2003
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For your revenge you can quote one of mine That was a joke !
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Joined: Jun 2003
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@ jvb It was a joke too ! If you don't understand, don't mind. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/ouch.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/kissyou.gif" alt="" />
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