Larian Banner: Baldur's Gate Patch 9
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Joined: Oct 2020
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journeyman
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The map is functionally a network of tunnels and nodes, many of which are blocked.

Because the map is a system of tunnels instead of broadly traversable terrain, you may be trying to head to an objective to the west, but there's just as much of a chance that you actually need to head south and east from your location to find the right tunnel. This maze-like construction means that points on the map don't have much actual geographical relevance to one another.

There is no clear method for the player to move, explore, gain information and re-orient. This is a big deal. This is a big hole where exploration should be, and a missed opportunity to predict the players sequence of movement. The player never knows whether they're actually getting closer to their objectives. The impetus is then on the player to just run through as many 'encounter tunnels' as quickly as possible. This really devalues all of the encounters.

Wounded Tiefling with a crossbow? No time. Dragon killing some guards? No idea what any of that's about, not getting tangled up in it. Dead guy with a dog? Hope it shows up later.

I don't think the map is going to be changed significantly at this point, but having broadly traversable terrain with fixed camping spots would be the primary solution. This would allow devs to mostly predict where the player is going to go and when. Assuming that's not going to happen, here are several changes that could be made to make the gameplay loop viable.

First, the camera needs to be able zoom much further out so that you can orient yourself. Secondly, stop hiding the maze on the map. Just clearly show the little tracks you can actually traverse in the places we've been. We also REALLY need the ability to put notes on the map for all the obstacles. A figurative/drawn map would be less confusing that what looks like satellite imagery (of a 3 dimensional maze). If we're going to have this node and tunnel system, make it less of spaghetti maze and more of a block/grid system. I think it's reasonable to throw some obstacles on the road, but the player needs some way to observe, orient and make an informed decision on getting around it. Not just back tracking to the last intersection and taking tunnels at random. A more reasonable grid-like system would give this opportunity.

Less important;

Anecdotally, as I randomly moved across the map, I constantly seemed to be hitting events without context and out of sequence. I can only imagine this also throws a huge amount of variable into scripting and narrative. I also constantly tried to navigate around obvious ambushes/enemy positions just to be forced to run through them because the track-like nature of the tunnels. I also constantly took the track that *seemed* to head towards my objective only to run into a dead end with the objective just out of sight and was forced to back track all the way to the ambush I purposely skirted. So it doesn't do any favors for player agency.

I know 'verticality' is the new buzzword in the gaming world, but I just don't see the utility here. Abilities to travel up or down (3x jump, feather fall) are way too costly, and even then you often can't get the whole party across so... I'm not sure what the point is. You're just rendering more stuff for no reason. This is doubly true of all the pointless jumps. The NPCs don't automatically jump across, so I have to do them one at a time. There's no chance the jump will fail and someone will fall. So I'm not sure what the purpose of these little jumps is.


Last edited by Stray952; 13/10/20 04:12 AM.
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apprentice
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My feelings on the topic are different.

I felt like all the possible routes had a intention behind them.
I picture the example you used ("I also constantly took the track that *seemed* to head towards my objective only to run into a dead end with the objective just out of sight and was forced to back track all the way to the ambush I purposely skirted.") is the way you can enter the goblin camp from the mountain pass - if you do a large jump and then get down the cliffs via means of feather fall or misty step.
I do not think it demands too many ressources to go this route. Think of it: The alternative is passing (several) Goblin encounters, Big fights (unless you role well or use your tadpole). If you feel like the fight is too risky, you might just as well invest your spell slots in a route that comes at a calculatable cost. Really two spell slots are nothing compared to what you would likely use in the battles.
I'm not sure if that's the idea behind it, but once you got your one travel-spell-buffed character to the Goblin camp waypoint, you can just teleport the rest of your party there.

I felt a little lost when I thought I headed to my destination but ultimately didn't. But I feel like that's just what t is in real life, too. Somebody tells you there is a camp to the west? Does't mean heading straight west will be the direct route there. It also makes me discover so much more I would probably never check out if I knew where exactly a quest takes me. To me, that's exploration. I come across different quests, giving me the choice which one to follow first. If I realize there are encounters or other obstacles too difficult for me to face now, I can always search for another route - but the choice is mine, I may just as well try to break through the most direct route I find.

As for marking your map: I agree. But given prior Larian games made you able to do that, I assume this feature is simply not implemented in early access yet and is therefore still to come.

Joined: Oct 2020
journeyman
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I don't like this path-area-path-area setup. I hope future maps are much more open.


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