Larian Studios Forums Baldur's Gate III Baldur's Gate III - Suggestions & Feedback The intransigent minority will end up ruining this game

Please Larian, don't take into consideration everything the community asks for. Not even me. Some feedback is necessary, but many times the community has no idea what they are requesting, and demand things without understanding what design decisions have led to them. No locking party or losing companions after Act I, parties composed of six members, level 20, main character's voice, Halsin as companion ... the noise that can be made by an intransigent minority doesn't represent the opinion of a reasonable majority.

If I say that Halsin won't be a companion because Larian won't remake Act I, I get buried in negative votes. You can't argue with a spoiled kids, they will get angry if you tell them their fantasy is unreasonable. They don't matter the budget, narrative reasons or whatever. They don't matter if we already have 8 other partners, they want Halsin. These kids don't understand that this character already has a role to fulfill. Don't get me wrong, we'd all be happy with one more companion, but sometimes a fanservice sex scene is enough to make that minority satisfied. Memes spread faster than arguments.

This has been just one example of hundreds I could list here.

There are too many posts like "LARIAN I DEMAND THIS", this post is "Larian, do what you have to do". Don't be afraid of disappointing narcissistic kids with low frustration tolerance.

This is EA where people send the suggestions they would like to see.

My top wish is for Halsin to be a companion (not just one sex scene)! It would not require remaking Act 1 if they made him a nonorigin companion. He is already in your camp (if you take the good path). They would just need to add banter and companion reactions and scenes. It would likely be a lot less work than adding a new origin companion.

Let take it one by one ...

No locking party
> Even if i agree with you that this can actualy be a good thing ... i would still like to hear your reasons for supporting the idea.

6 members party
> I presume you think this is a bad idea, i would like to know why?
Especialy since Swen himself, said in one interview, that they are aware of people wanting it and they are expecting this will be one of first features presented as mod, so they allready decided to create UI as welcoming to this change as possible.
Also, as GM4Him told us ... its fully supported in Tutorial, when you have 4 custom characters ... so, it really dont seem like it would take hunderts, actualy nor even dozens of hours for Larian to implement this option, to make people happy. O_o
And if your concerns is about ballance, all they need to do is add warning sign in options that game is meaned for 4 companions, and with incerasing the number people will make game unballanced and possibly too easy to enjoy.

level 20
> Well ... i dont think i even need coment on this, bcs that indeed is ridiculous request.

Main character's voice
> Again, i agree ... this should certainly not be even take to concideration.
Still i would like to know your reason.

And finaly Halsin ...
Here we finaly have something to work with.
I wonder tho why should Larian remake Act 1, i mean what exactly interferes there? O_o

I would say on the contrary, it would make much more sence from "narrative reasons", "concidering his role to fulfill", or "concidering Act 1 as is" ... it would make much more sence for Halsin to actualy follow you ...
After all, acording to what he said himself ... "his role" is to investigate Underdark, and find the way to moonrise towers ... not stay in your camp, watching scratch running around, while YOU investigate Underdark, and find the way to moonrise towers.

How have you quantified the feedback in your examples as being from an intransigent minority instead of the reasonable majority?

Changed some wording and inserted others.
I do probably get a warning for this
But hey, theres more elder people playing this game then you think its otherwise.
So we dont want to do the blamingtrain.
People are just fans and excited about so many things. But thers not allways more behind it.
Often just not realizing how much work has to be done to fullfill extra wishes.
Trust in Larian.
They will deliver a game which will not satisfy everyone,
but enough to make this game a blockbuster.

I could not agree more. Being an old guy who started playing video games on an Atari 2600 back in the days when you could not contact developers let alone insist they do things the way you want them to I find it incredibly annoying that the people that bitch the most get listened to the most. Nobody ever complained that there were not enough barrels being thrown in Donkey Kong.

If all these whining people actually think that they know better then the people that make games for a living. People that make great games for a living. If you think you should be a developer then maybe you should learn how to develop games and make your own instead of trying to tell other people how to make theirs.

In the before times, the days before the internet, if you didn't like a game you didn't play it. You didn't write letter after letter after letter expecting them to change it to make it the way you want it. To me this reeks of selfishness.

Larian, make the game you want to make not the game a bunch of kids with nothing better to do are trying to push you into making. Feedback is fine but don't let it guide you in directions that stray from where you were originally going.

Except the Party Lock has no redeeming qualities, contributes nothing to the narrative, makes there company look bad by repeating a gimmick from Divinity Original Sin 2, and is over all just an incredibly bad idea by every possible metric... your only defense of it here seems to be "there is clearly some design logic" which is borderline saying in a cult-like way "trust in the grand plan"

If I see someone about to stick a wet hot dog into a light socket, im not going to stop people from intervining by saying "we have to trust in the gradn plan"

Party Locking is an incredibly bad thing for this game, and I have not seen anyone ask for a party of six (mostly I have seen people asking for five, but only because that is what the DMG/PHB balances encounters/groups for), I have not seen anyone talk about the Main Charcter's voice... I am not sure if you ar pro-anti Halsin being a companion, but the idea of a high powered NPC hanging out at your camp and doing nothing to help when we know he can... would be frustrating from a logical viewpoint.

Also there is no voting system on this forum. And calling other people "spoiled kids" because they are honest about what they wont doesnt make oyu look intelligent, it makes you look cruel... And finding the word "intrasigent" in a dictionary/thesaurus, doesnt make you look smart or like you know what you are talking about.

It makes you look like you are trying to present yourself as more intelligent, and thus present yourself as "more correct" through superficial means.

I have to point out that your comparison isn't really analagous here. I agree that in general there is a lot of entitelment and toxicity in the gaming community and that attitude is present in some form here in these forums, but crucially this is early access. Larian specifically invited people to play their game and share their feedback and opinions on it. I do think that some people's attitudes are pretty bad when they do so, but they are not only free to share their opinions, they've been encouraged. And from a certain point of view, one could say they have a responsibility to add their voice to proceedings. And on top of that, Larian hasn't given us a more constructive way to give our feedback and in-depth thoughts so people have to bring it up on the forums if they want to add their two cents. I'm sure if they wanted to, Larian could find a way to reduce (not fully elliminate, since they're only human after all) the amount of noice and argument in their forums, since a decent chunk of it is due to people not having another way to give feedback that they think will be heard.

If you're so behind Larian and in their corner, then you should accept all the feedback because they clearly want it and they want their fanbase to influence and direct how the game develops. It comes off as kind of arrogant when you tell the creators to ignore a section of their playerbase and do what they think is right when "what they think is right" explicitly includes asking for lots of feedback and opinion. If you think that what Larian has presented in this explicitly unfinished version of their game is good enough, that's great. I hope the end result is a game that you enjoy. I also fully support you voicing your enjoyment for elements of the game, positive feedback is important too. And yes, there are certainly elements in the forums that have bad attitudes. But you shouldn't be advocating Larian ignore people. Larian are all adults. They know what they're doing and can decide who they will and won't listen to without you.

Let's dial down the "narcissistic" and "arrogant" angle a bit, please. Thanks.

Where is this focus on kids coming from? Afaik most posters don't reveal their age. Are we just labeling anyone who disagrees with us as "spoiled, disappointing, and narcissistic kids with nothing better to do"?

I agree with you, there needs to be a balance, listening to the fans without going crazy. But, it is necessary for Larian to analyze whether these narcissistic children are the majority or not. Because if they are, then Larian should be careful not to hear their cries. I don't think so, because fanatical fans have always been in the minority. I also think it's valid to "educate" these children, explaining why what they ask for is bad, because we can convert them into people with common sense and who can add positive things to the community later on. Maybe this can be solved by giving a Halsin doll to each of them... lol

And we must also be open-minded so that we understand that we can be like narcissistic children without even realizing it. I think your comment sounded a bit like "What you're claiming isn't valid, as I don't think it's good for the game," but I know that's not what you meant.

I don't understand, I can't speak these words?

They don't have a history of encouraging polite conversation, so no, I'd rather you (and everyone else) didn't. Thanks.

Making Halsin a companion for a level 1-4 party would completely undermine his character and archdruid position in the game world and narrative.

It's comparable to making Galadriel a party member in LotR even though Halsin isn't quite that epic. To build a believable world and have some scale of power in it some monsters and NPC's have to be above and beyond your PC's. An archdruid definitely fits this bill. He has power and knowledge far beyond you and is able to teach and guide the party, like Halsin is doing. He has responsibilities leading a circle of druids and no time to join whatever rookie adventuring party that just showed up.

Powerful NPC's are a narrative tool, an example of what the party might become or what kind of power they might wield eventually if they survive. What we need to witness as players is a scene where Halsin takes on a foe beyond your ability to fight and saves you from them. Think of Gorion, even though they don't have to die necessarily.

So, anyone asking for Halsin to be a companion doesn't really know what they're asking for. They just like the character a lot and it's Larian's job to deliver quality Halsin scenes without demoting their power NPC's to low level companions.

Nettie could be a level 3-4 companion from the Druid Circle.

Haven't thought about that...
I was wondering how would they make 10~12 character with complex story and iteration starting from act1, that would probably take to much work... But making some Origin companions and some NonOrigin would make everything easier and, hell, it works for me!

Does Larian have stated that there will be some ""secondary companions""? Or is it just a guess?

Funny you mentioned *her* ...
I wonder if actual member of that party wasnt some grey (or white later on) Wizard, who was in compareable level of power.

Halsin isn't actually that powerful. You get to kill him as part of the evil storyline (depending on the choices made). Which is a tough battle, but doable.

A way to make non-origin companions, if halsin was ever made one, make more sense would be that they join at a set level.
For example, if Halsin would logically be level 5, then he'd join as a level 5 druid but his experience set to the party's.
However, if he was set to join as a level 3 druid and the party was level 4, then he would scale up like the existing companions, becoming level 4.
This would mean that if you got certain origin companions earlier they would possibly be higher level but eventually you will catch up and they will be in line with you, and it also means other companions do not end up falling behind. This would also enable Larian to have copanions already have certain things set, like having Halsin already set as a Moon Druid instead of having the player pick. This would give any non-origin companions a set role they could have.

As far as I know Larian hasn't said if they would include nonorigin companions or not. I would like them to, though!