Larian Studios Forums General Chat Thinly veiled political statement in BD?

This is the last I'm posting on this topic because it really has gone off topic here with trees.

I live in the US so I think you and I come from different cultures and have vastly different viewpoints. I read a lot and make sure I'm fairly well informed on current events. So, I can say the following statement with confidence. In the US, it's a common misconception that when paper companies cut down trees, they do so without care or respect for the community or ecosystem. That could not be farther from the case. For every tree they cut down, it is replaced and replanted. Our forests in the US are not in any danger of distinction and some groups would have you believe that there are 3 trees left. LOL As for rain forests - yes, that is a problem. One I deeply care about. But this topic had to do more with animal testing so I'll keep the rain forest issue for another thread.




Wow, what a mess that must have been, Fox. But I think you and I are on the same page with this. It's important when creating a solution to a problem (be it animals, toxic waste, rain forest) that we (humans) look as far down the road as possible to make sure our choices will have the positive outcome that is in the intent. Ecosystems must maintain a delicate balance. It takes professionals, scientists and the like to get involved in making sure that balance is maintained. However, often times political pressure by grass roots groups, lack of funding, and a plethora of other problems arise and we end up with the type of mess you had on your hands with the mice.




That's what I thought you meant but wanted to be certain. Communicating in cyberspace has its benefits as well as its drawbacks. And misinterpretation of messages can lead to missing out on the poster's intended meaning. I always like to clarify something and try not to assume. I've gotten myself in more trouble when I 'assume'. Thanks for taking the time to respond, Fox. I appreciate it.


Faralas <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mage.gif" alt="" />

Trouble is. Its rarely the same type of tree. Slow-growing majestic oaks are replaced by faster-growing trees. The environment is altered definately. You can't say the constant action of cutting down trees has no effect either. Continuous upheaval causes most of the animals to leave the area.

Well, at least the oxygen is being recycled. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

There exists nearly the same disease like BSE among sheep.

1) if you cut down a tree in the tropics you take away all the food, because most of the biomass is in the trees almost no humus.

2) To plant a tree to replace a old one is like giveing a volgswagen in the place of a rolce

3)the scheep version of bse is the original version that was transmited to cows because they were fed with scheep parts (?!?!)

4) The best medicin school of the 18 or 19 th centurie bought bodies from a guy who killed people who stayed in his hotel. And the surgeon knew this... So in other words to train the best doctors (surgeons) it was needed to kill inoscent people... To test nuclear weapons range they planted people every 5 meters from the blast site to test how far the radiotion goes... So it isn't only animals. I don't even want to know what doctor death did and what happen dureing the world wars and vietnam wars in the name of science)

5) Our knowledge of science and medcin makes it possible for us to live in such high numbers on the world and survive and some of us have it good, the price we need to pay is the extinction of animals (food and land is limited on earth we use it or they do...)and let loads of people suffer of desises and hunger. Every thing has a price.....

sorry for the blackish post and a bit
<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/offtopic.gif" alt="" />
xd

From my knowledge - there is a relation between BSE and Jakob-Kreuzfeld-Syndrome. Sheep suffering under scrapies (correct word?) were killed and their cadavers used for protein rich power food, given to cattle (see? Animal proteine for vegetarians, with a totally different digestion system). As the heating process was too low, cattle could get infected - thus producing BSE - correct, started in the UK and spread all over Europe - most JK-Syndrome victims were British up to now. The trouble with this infection going over to humans is the long incubation period.
JK-syndrome existed in earlier times, too - but rose up due to "economic greed" (too low heating). Nope, it wasn't science, it was "economy". I'm sorry, my English is not good enough to explain fully, what I know from medicinal books. We had a lot of cattle food scandals here in Europe and the EU inspectors had a lot of trouble to doubletrack devious transportation methods and eliminate those products. It may not be a strong issue in the US, but was a strong one here on my continent. And I'm sorry to say => it was manmade <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/puppyeyes.gif" alt="" /> - BSE and JK. And I wonder how genetic mutated food and hormone infected meat will add to new diseases on the long term.


Same here, Faralas <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/up.gif" alt="" /> - that's why I'm so sceptical and a real pain in the a** for some. Don't change, ok?
Kiya

Yep, you're correct - there is a relation between BSE and Jakob-Creutzfeldt. In fact, one of my neighbor's mom was diagnosed with it and died. It was a sad ending to a beautiful life. And yes, the incubation period for JK is quite long. However, there is no definitive link between BSE and JK (yet).

And you're right again about the sheep, but I thought both sheep and cows were fed a grain-type material. I didn't realize that cows were being fed sheep cadavers. I need to get more info about this. I'll take a look on the web and see what I can find. Because it sounds like I misunderstood the whole feeding process.

I read pretty much the same info about where BSE originated, though and how it spread but for some reason (and I could be wrong), I read an article not to long ago wherein scientists were able to pinpoint the original cow (which turned out to be in England) that was responsible for the latest spate of BSE that spread through Canada, the US and (if I'm not mistaken) Japan.

You're knowlege is probably more accurate than mine, Kiya. You are a librarian after all and have access to more information than I do! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> Thanks for the post! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wave.gif" alt="" />


Faralas <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mage.gif" alt="" />

I have my knowledge from books - if the internet has new infos, you're in advantage <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" /> - you see, it started as a food scandal... Ha, so you write it Creutzfeldt <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shame.gif" alt="" /> - oh dear, oh dear.... German <sigh>

Well, the different measures for high/not so high heating procedures to sterilize animal food production was known to me for a very long time (before BSE). Therefore I never bought UK or French cat food. German regulations are very strict, I felt safe - but now not anymore, due to these mangrove like dark transportations paths within the EU. BTW, BSE and scrapies (hope, I got THAT word right) are related. Though I don't know the cause of this disease.

See? This is what I call economic greed - to lower production costs a catastrophy was tread loose, like an avalanche.
Kiya

To be fair. Only a handfull of people have died from this. Calling it a 'catastrophie' would only apply to all the lost revenue in meat exports due to the hype around it.

More people die from being electrocuted by their toasters..... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggrin.gif" alt="" />

I never stopped eating British Beef. Or any other beef for that matter and I'm fine. MOOOOOOOOOOOOO! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggrin.gif" alt="" />

Sorry, Womble, I still call it a catastrophy - not only because of the humans who died - of all those cattle who were brutally slaughtered - no: I call it a catastrophy, because the scandal did not stop!
In 1984 the first cow died
In 1988 the UK government forbade to feed this contaminated animal food BUT they allowed export! Where did they learn? <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/puppyeyes.gif" alt="" />
Only in 1996! the UK had the regulation to sterilize this food 133 C for 20 min. Look at all those wasted years.
From 1990-1996 160000 cattle in the UK died from this disease
And in 1995 the first human died from CJ - was this necessary? I'm talking about a catastrophy - an ethical one, caused by greed.
Was it necessary that 88 British died until 2000? And this CJ variation fell upon YOUNG people <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/puppyeyes.gif" alt="" /> - how must their parents have felt?

German government estimates this: 800000 cattle were lead into the human food chain since BSE is known. (values from 2001)

And then BSE was know in the USA, in 2003 - how did the US government react? No, I don't want to make in panic. Yes, those 106 CJ victims in the UK up to 2003 may be a handful - but it was unnecessary - if greed had not reigned all that time.

May I call it a catastrophy now?
Kiya

Call it whatever you like my dear. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggrin.gif" alt="" />

I think of it as more of a calamity. Its never necessary for people to die, for any reason. It happens though. Greed and beaurocracy kill many things. Nice world we live in eh? <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />

Hmm, I think your word fits better - ok, it's a calamity <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/up.gif" alt="" /> and I learned a new word <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/kissyou.gif" alt="" />
Kiya

Always glad to help. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/kissyou.gif" alt="" />

"WoW" <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" /> me say...shortest post. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wave.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/offtopic.gif" alt="" /> too! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggrin.gif" alt="" />