Larian Studios Forums Beyond Divinity (English) General a not-too-good review

read about this in rpgdot.com. i couldn't link my post to that site so i just copy-pasted this instead.

made me feel a bit low as i just got the game, but hey, to each his own anyway. you can't please everyone.

fyi.

Beyond Divinity Review


Review by
Stephen Macek

Larian Studios’ Beyond Divinity is an RPG. In days past, this description would have been enough to let a gamer know what to expect as far as the "how" of gameplay. Fortunately, over the course of time, I believe two distinct styles of RPG have developed (arguably): The Diablo style and the Baldur’s Gate style. The Diablo style game involves endless point-and-click fighting and potion chugging with the ultimate goals being character development and item collection. The Baldur’s Gate style involves a deep story line and deep tactical combat system, the ultimate goal being finishing the story. When you finish a Baldur’s Gate style game, you are done. When you finish a Diablo II style game, however, you are most likely just getting started. It is really more of an addiction than a game, teasing the player with better items and they become higher and higher levels. Beyond Divinity tried to mesh the two styles together by offering a story that serves to move you forward, while implementing a skills-based character development system that encourages fine-tuning through multiple skill paths. Does it work? Read on.

Story

In Divine Divinity you, our hero, sets out to vanquish evil from the world. It’s a one-man job but you now find yourself in a bit of a different situation. It seems that you, the defender of all that is good, have somehow become entangled with The Deathknight. You are so entangled in fact, that your souls are connected, and your only hope is to find the fiend who played such a cruel trick on you both and eliminate him.

In the opening scene, you wake up in a prison cell and your soul-mate (no romance here) informs you of your unfortunate bond. You set out together to, ultimately, free yourselves of each other.

Gameplay

The basic point of Beyond Divinity is to move your characters through the story. Unfortunately, it often feels like you’re on a wild goose chase looking for keys or solving bizarre little quests that have little or nothing to do with the story. Foes are either ridiculously difficult or too easy and combat becomes annoying at times. In the first Act, you’ll face a foe that had me restart the game several times just to figure out good character development. Spending several hours doing this was not my idea of a good gaming experience. I don’t mind a challenge, mind you, but I don’t like being frustrated within a few minutes of starting a game.

The interface provides a good map and journal feature and keeps track of what you have accomplished nicely. This is not a title without polish, it just missed a few spots.

In an effort to give you a clear idea of what to expect throughout the game, I have tried to break the gameplay elements into neat little categories.

Your Character

The game begins with character creation. You’re presented with three basic character types: warrior, wizard or survivor. While the first two types are self-explanatory, survivor sounds a bit odd. Essentially, it’s a combination of a thief and an assassin. If you wish, you can opt to fully customize your character’s attributes rather than settle for one of the preset configurations. (I must admit that I would love to have had this option in Diablo II).

You can also customize the following: gender, body type, face, hair style and color which reminded me of Dungeon Siege. You also have the following attributes with minimal initial stats: strength, constitution, agility, speed, intelligence and survival. Fortunately, when you mouse-over any category, you will be reminded what effect each has on your character.

You character has three personal statistics to which you’ll want to pay close attention. Vitality indicates the amount of "life" you have left during the course of the game and as you engage in combat, hits scored against you rob you of these points. If either of your main characters drops to zero vitality it’s game over. Mana is the energy used in performing magic feats and the more powerful the feat, the more mana consumed. Finally, stamina indicates that you have enough extra energy to run. If the stamina meter drains fully, that character is only capable of walking.

All three statistics can be refilled and there are three methods of doing so. First, you can just sit and wait, stamina fills very quickly this way. Vitality and mana, however, take a bit of time. Secondly, you can consume potions and specific potions will refill one or more categories. These are either found or purchased throughout the course of the game. Finally, provided you have food and a place to lie down, you can go to sleep, refilling all statistics. Oddly enough, you can actually do this in the middle of a fight!

Attributes

As you progress through the game, you are awarded attributes, which should be improved accordant with the character type you wish to focus on. Although it’s a good idea to pour points into logical categories, you’ve the freedom to place them wherever you wish. As you reach higher levels, you’ll wish that you’d paid more attention initially to this area of the game, because you’ll be limited in what items you may use. I found it helpful to keep a small bank of attribute points so that I could add one or two when I found an item I really liked.

Skill System

Underneath a horribly confusing allocation tree, there is a very deep skill tree. You’re not limited by character type in the skills category; however, you must find a NPC or a book to teach you a new skill path. Learned skills can be unlearned for a price just in case you screw things up. Skills fall into three basic types: wizard, warrior and survival.

Wizard Skills:

Elemental attacks: uses alchemic-inspired attacks implementing air, water, fire and earth

Elemental defense: shield yourself from damage using the same four elements

Elemental curses: lower enemy resistances to elemental attacks

Body magic

Offensive: alter enemy’s physical condition

Defensive: boost your party’s physical condition

Shaman magic

Weather: meteorological carnage

Nature: it’s not nice to fool with Mother Nature

Ethereal magic: Teleportation, fireballs, durability attacks

Warrior Skills:

Melee specialties: improve various weapon skills

Ranged specialties: improve accuracy with bows and increase arrow specific damage

Defensive: block, evade, armor and durability enhancements

Whirlwind: a circular attack

Craftsmanship: repair, sharpen, identify, recover and/or convert arrows

Talents: berserk, ranged sight, play dead

Survival skills:

Thieving: pickpocket, lock pick, sneak, poison

Talents: backstab, trade, luck, wisdom, embellish equipment

Alchemy: extract and combine to make potions

Traps: ranging from simple "mines" to swarming insects

Summoning Dolls: creates a summoned creature to assist you in your fight

Combat

Combat in Beyond Divinity is simple enough. When you enter an area with enemies, they’ll attack you and you have the option to stand there and die or you can fight. Pressing the space bar at any time will pause the action so you can pick your strategy carefully. Attacks are of two varieties: primary and secondary. The primary attack is assigned to the left mouse button and will be carried out until the target is killed or, in the case of magic, you run out of mana. As you attack, a life meter above the enemy will drain based on how much damage your character is dealing out. The secondary attack is assigned to the right mouse button.

If your life meter or mana is too low in battle, you can consume potions to refill them. Potions are a shared inventory item, so it’s important to be careful when you use them. In addition, if you have not slept in a while, you can go to sleep mid fight. I find this absurd, but it works. Magicians can also cast healing spells on themselves or party members, provided they have learned the skill.

Teleporter Stones

As you progress in the game, you’ll come upon teleporter stones. One stone can be dropped anywhere you wish and you can use the other to return to that location at any time. Essentially, you can leave a stone in a safe haven and return there in the heat of the battle. You have three options: drop, use or drop and use. You do have to remember however that just using will NOT allow you to teleport back to that location!

Battlefields

Moving through the levels of the game you unlock battlefields. These are essentially random maps which include side quests, towns and a plethora of enemies to fight. The goal here is to provide a place to beef up your character’s stats, find new items and learn new skills (and add replay value!). Once you discover one, you can go to a battleground at any time in the game by selecting an icon. When you finish the entire game, you can go to the battlegrounds through the main menu, providing unlimited, albeit repetitive, replay.

Stuff

Not the most technical term, but it works. You can collect many item types throughout your adventures. This will be the entire point of the game for many people. Although I didn’t find the items nearly as interesting as those in Diablo II, I think Larian tried hard to make things interesting. Here is a basic rundown of what you can find in the game:

Gold: the currency in Beyond Divinity

Potions: used for healing or improving attributes

Weapons: a variety of equipment varying in damage and durability

Armor: protection includes body armor, footwear, shields, gloves and headgear

Charms: can be embedded in other items to boost statistics

Crystals: can be carried to improve statistics (can not be put in items)

Summoning Dolls: summon extra party members

Items can be traded in towns or with characters throughout the game. Depending on your skill in trading, you can raise or lower the value of items and it’s also possible to steal items from traders if you are adept at thieving. A word of caution: there’s no delineation in the trade window as to what you are wearing, so be careful not to sell something in use. I discovered this the hard way.

Options

You tweak graphics and sound settings if you wish, but, since the system requirements are reasonable, you probably won’t want to mess around here too much. Unfortunately, there is no multiplayer to be had in Beyond Divinity, much like the first Divinity title. This is a bit surprising to me because so much of Diablo’s popularity is tied to the online nature of the game. Larian have played on the success of their first game and probably thought it wasn’t worth the development time.

Technical

Beyond Divinity is a decent game, but not without its flaws. Graphically, it is ok. Unfortunately, this is not a selling point in a market flooded with games of this type. Compound that with the fact that it is limited to a single player experience, and then I count it as a technical limitation. In addition, the balance of enemies’ difficulty is apparently random at times. One minute you are in a battle with a seemingly impossible foe, and the next you are mowing down half a dozen bad guys.

The sound is nothing spectacular, although the voice acting has its high points. The Deathknight is a funny character when he chimes in with his belligerent banter and countless insults. It makes the game a little more tolerable.

Fortunately game saving can be done at any time, either via a quick save or from the main menu. I recommend saving often as death is inevitable.

Final Thoughts

When I was growing up (and sometimes, still) I was reminded by my father to "remember where you come from." Why bring this up in a videogame review? It could not be more appropriate, actually. Larian Studios’ Beyond Divinity is the sequel to a game that was presented by more than one review source as a "Diablo II killer." If that phrase is not one you’ve heard before then you’re more than likely new to gaming. The Diablo series shaped me as a gamer in both expectation of quality and fun. Naturally, when I hear comments like that, I don’t take them lightly. Beyond Divinity is, unfortunately not a Diablo II killer or a vast improvment over the first Divinity title, it is however a sometimes frustrating game, with limited replay value. After devoting much time to this game, it will probably sit on a shelf in storage, not alone, but amid countless other titles I played and have forgotten. Beyond Divinity is simply an OK game that players who enjoyed the first title will probably find appealing but it’s by no means a leap forward for the RPG genre or the Divinity series.

Article by Stephen Macek

Hmmm...

Not a really OBJECTIVE review is it?

Why you ask?

Diablo Diablo Diablo AND again... Diablo...

Doesn't it seem odd to you he often compares Diablo II with BD?

Most importantly in his final note...

''When I was growing up (and sometimes, still) I was reminded by my father to "remember where you come from." Why bring this up in a videogame review? It could not be more appropriate, actually. Larian Studios’ Beyond Divinity is the sequel to a game that was presented by more than one review source as a "Diablo II killer." If that phrase is not one you’ve heard before then you’re more than likely new to gaming. The Diablo series shaped me as a gamer in both expectation of quality and fun. Naturally, when I hear comments like that, I don’t take them lightly. Beyond Divinity is, unfortunately not a Diablo II killer or a vast improvment over the first Divinity title, it is however a sometimes frustrating game, with limited replay value.''

So he seems to have liked Diablo II and was a bit... pissed off by hearing Beyond Divinity was going to be a Diablo II killer.
Then he add that Beyond Divinity is NOT a Diablo II killer.

Is it a personal revenge against Beyond Divinity that was claimed to ''own'' his favorite game? ( well I think it was, at least he talks of this game a LOT in this review )

So overall it was not a bad review.
But WAY to subjective.

I don't like reviews that use comparisons to value a certain game.
And I will never do.

Reviews that base themselves on other games to review a certain game...
Sorry, no respect from me...

I mean, why not add an ENORMOUS sign saying:

'' DIABLO II IS BETTER GO BUY IT!!! ''

I have nothing against Diablo II.

I mean, if a reviewer would have used Beyond Divinity comparison to review Diablo II, then I would have said the same thing.

And besides, this is just a review on some unknown site. The reviewer gave it a 7/10... Big deal.

I think I'll trust more professional sites like RPGdot themselves when it comes to a review. (RPGdot gave BD a 80% by the by)

You obviously can see the reviewer is an egoist ignoramus.

Looks like he has no idea what D&D means as in Dungeons & Dragons, a Rogue might be a thief, an assassin or anything else.

Whereas I simply can't understand what he tried to say in this part:


Restating the obvious won't make the review any funnier:


His "Diablo II killer" comments are simply ludicrous: half of the RPG games which were ever released were named "Diablo Killers" in the preview. Of course, in the review, everything was changed. "E3 Game of the Show" becomes "Coaster of the Month".

Don't you mind this guy. Let him play his Diablo and read other reviews.

Well, this coming from somebody who thinks the Baldur's Gate games were about "deep story line and deep tactical combat". I honestly couldn't take the review seriously after that.

Well, I *do* consider Baldur's Gate games had deep storyline and good tactical combat.

Not much of a review of the game IMHO. After reading this review I got the feeling that the reviewer took most of his information from the point of character creation and got as far as the Fergus fight then quit and wrote his review.

Reviews can reveal a lot about the biases and experience of the author. This review constantly refers to Diablo II, which arguably is not an RPG in the true sense, and has a very shallow storyline, quest system, and character development. Why does he not compare the Divinity games to the genre that they belong in? That genre, IMHO, is the Might&Magic/ Ultima / Wizardry type games. Those series of games were rich in storyline, quest systems, and character development.

Some of the comments in the review had me laughing at the author's understanding of how to play an RPG. Examples are:



So I guess a quest like "My scouts have just informed me of an abomination in the graveyard" is more RPG-like than solving numerous problems to escape from a complicated dungeon.



Ummm... what foe is that? Why did you have to restart so often (ever hear of saving the game)? What "good character development" can be so hard to figure out at the very beginning of the game, and where are you getting the skill and attribute points to do that development so early in the game?



It sounds to me that the author does mind a challenge (like Diablo II is so challenging at the the beginning of the game - or at any point in the game for that matter) and lacks the skill, patience, and ability to solve problems that are expected in a good RPG.

Everything in the rewiew up to the "final thoughts" is info taken from the startup screen or the manual. I seriously doubt that this person got much further than that before running back to see what the abomination in the graveyard is all about for the umpteenth time.



I was laughing so hard at this point in the review. So the Diablo series (what series? There was the original and 3 expansions if you count Hellfire) shaped a gamer in what to expect from an RPG? It seems like such a shallow shaping.



Pull-eeeze. Games have been referred to as "Diablo killers" since 1996, and why I will never understand. Diablo is a unique type of game, IMHO more like Doom or Duke Nukem, but it is not an RPG. It seems, from this type of review, that Diablo should be referred to as an "RPG killer", a game for people who want to play RPGs but can't.

I do still play Diablo from time to time (Killing Baal is one of the finest final battles in a computer game IMHO). But only when I am extremely bored and don't feel like thinking for while.

This is hardly the place to argue about it, so I'll just disagree and leave it at that.

Are you the same DEATH AT THE DOOR who's been hanging around the Terra Arcanum forums lately? You should ask about this there; the responses will be most amusing.

And did you try Safe Mode for your magenta problem?

Yes
Yes
Yes <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggrin.gif" alt="" />

I just registered... a couple of days ago. Good to know at least somebody noticed <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />.
Mate, I won't compare BG to Arcanum or Fallout but I liked BG and have no wish to argue about it.
Thanks about the safe mode tip but I tried it and it didn't work.

As for Grim, well said, Mr. Grim. Better than I could've put it.

Juste one more thing.




Correct me if I'm wrong but I believe the items you have equipped have their price in yellow.

Quite true that... Also, some very valid points made earlier aswell...

Someone should write the reviewer some feedback about his work. And it should start like this:

"
Dear Mr. Macek,

You are an idiot for the following reasons:
...
"

<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/silly.gif" alt="" />

Well, I read this far in your post, Grim and had to stop because I think your opinion is spot on. I've played almost all of the M&M series and all of Wizardry's. The only difference is that BD is not turn based whereas those are. (I haven't played Ultima yet. I have it, but haven't played it.)

*Faralas finishes reading the rest of Grim's message*




While I did not laugh at the reviewer's statement about how Diablo II shaped him as a gamer, my eyes did pop out of my skull. I have never considered Diablo as an RPG. It falls into the category of an action/adventure without the massive puzzle-solving and hot spot, click fest of a true 'adventure' game. RPG, IMHO, means something completely different to me than it does to the reviewer.

It's clear that Stephen Macek is not an afficianado of RPGs nor does he know the critera of a proper review. I think he was given an assignment at the last minute, played a minute or two of the demo and drew on his limited knowledge. What came out was the swill he and rpg.dot call a 'review'. It's a 'comparison' and a bad one at that. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shhh.gif" alt="" />

@Tovi: The thought occurred to me to respond to his review, but I didn't want to give him the satisfaction of knowing that someone actually read it. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/devil.gif" alt="" />

Good stuff! Thanks for sharing.


Faralas <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mage.gif" alt="" />

No matter what a new game is like this person will compare it to Diablo and give it a 'It's not Diablo style so it sucks' review. But each to his/her own.

Well, I suppose the Survivor: Thief/Assassin comment proves it.
After all, an Assassin is a Diablo 2 LoD class whereas there are no thieves. I suppose he still wonders what "that 5 lettered word starting with T and ending with F" is <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />.

[color:"orange"] Heads up, Crusader - I went to RPGDot and couldn't find the review you posted. It simply wasn't there, so I did an internet search and found it at a site called "LoadedInc.com", Stephen Macek's Review of Beyond Divinity. And from the looks of it, LoadedInc. is part of a website called Rotten Tomatoes.

Good thing I didn't go to RPGDot.com with my guns loaded and ready for bear. LOL And since I know nothing about LoadedInc.com, I think I better do my homework before leaving the author (Macek) my two farthings worth on his review of <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/beyond.gif" alt="" />

As a side note, our illustrious AlrikFassbauer is a regular contributor at RPGDot

Just wanted to give proper credit [as well as accurate information] where it is due!! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wave.gif" alt="" />[/color]


Faralas <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mage.gif" alt="" />
[color:"red"] P.S. Just noticed at Loaded's website. They have the publisher of BD as Digital Jesters. I thought Hip Productions was BD's publisher. Am I wrong? Or is Digital Jesters and Hip one in the same (or an affiliate?)

[/color]

HIP is for the USA/Canada
DJ for UK
France has yet another one
Germany has Ubisoft etc.etc.

Ah! Mystery solved. Thanks, Kiya. I knew you would be able to answer my question but I didn't realize how speedy you are! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/up.gif" alt="" /> You're 'Super-Kiya', able to scale mountains of bandwidth in a single click. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggrin.gif" alt="" /> Awesome!!

Faralas <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mage.gif" alt="" />
P.S. I owe you a PM. Will try to catch up with you sometime today.

LOL, DATD. Or even the complete mind melding Thief/Assassin who is sometimes referred to as a *Begins with 'Ro' and ends with 'gue'* That's a real head-scratcher for the eternally clueless.

Question of the day: "Are the ignorant truly in a state of bliss?" <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/think.gif" alt="" />


Faralas <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mage.gif" alt="" /> *feeling extremely snarky today* <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/alien.gif" alt="" />

I seem to have given you the wrong coffee, Faralas <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/think.gif" alt="" /> - about your "bliss" question => sure, you didn't mean "blisters"? Whereas the question remains...who and how? Is the ignorant a huge blister? Or, does she/he cause blisters? <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/ouch.gif" alt="" />
Kiya <suffering under her experiments with poison>

ROFL! You didn't give me the wrong coffee, Kiya. I forgot to put sugar in it and I'm not my usual, sweet self when I go 'sugarless'. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/silly.gif" alt="" />

Looks like I've got some research cut out for me re: bliss v. blisters. LOL

And for heaven's sake, back away from the poison. It's not to be used as a hair gel. Although I must say, you're looking marvelous these days. (lol)


Faralas <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mage.gif" alt="" />