Larian Studios Forums General Chat Chat (Anything) The Argumentative Git thread

I did install it and didn't like it due to the lack of Tech support.
Especially, with Core 2 and soon Core 3.

Kyra_Ny <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/evilgrin1.gif" alt="" />

Master Guroth vous êtes totalement de mauvaise foi !
First the subject "Windows vs Linux" is closed.
Second the microsoft softwares are not so bad products and are not more expensive than other ones for exemple Word or PaintShopPro.
Third if you don't like microsoft softwares don't buy them.
Fourth i will not install linux because you are not able to convince me with your arguments.

Barta

...ah, not an issue! If you don't like Microsoft, get the GameCube or PS2 versions... or better yet, buy the original board game! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/silly.gif" alt="" />

The longest MONOPOLY game ever played was 1,680 hours - that's 70 straight days!

Longest game in a bathtub: 99 hours
Longest game underwater: 45 days
Longest game played upside-down: 36 hours

Microsoft is not a true monopoly (although it likes to act like one) because competitors still exist in the OS market, and also for its other markets such as browsers, email clients, word processors, etc.

And we’ve already discussed Microsoft vs Linux and Mac. As I 'won' that debate, I hereby declare myself the automatic winner of this reheat of the topic. So the new topic is.... what?! you don't agree that I automatically win?? <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" />

Oh well.... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/disagree.gif" alt="" />

In the meantime, here’s some Bill Gates and Microsoft jokes:

Microsoft Light Bulb Joke

Q: How many Bill Gateses does it take to change a light bulb?
A: One. He puts the bulb in and lets the world revolve around him.


When Bill Gates Meets St Peter

Bill Gates dies and meets St Peter at the Pearly Gates (no pun intended). St Peter gives him a choice of Heaven or Hell and gives him a chance to check out each.

Bill walks up to Heaven; lots of clouds and hymns - all a bit boring. He then pops down to check out Hell; it looks great - bikini-clad girls running around a beach playing volleyball. Bill tells St Peter that he will choose Hell.

A few weeks later, St Peter drops in to see how Bill is going in Hell. Bill is in a terrible state - third degree burns to his back, jabmarks on his butt, his hair all burnt off.
He wails to St Peter, "you conned me; where are all the girls, the beach and the volleyball?"

St Peter replies "Oh, that was just the demo version".

Bill Gates and Divine Brown

After the Hugh Grant/Divine Brown incident that made the papers, Bill Gates called up Hugh Grant. Bill asked him "Was it really worth $50 to almost ruin your career?"
Hugh replied "Bill, actually it was worth a million".

So Bill called up Hughes' favourite prostitute, but since she became so famous, her prices had gone up quite a bit. So Bill paid $10,000 for a night with Divine.
In the morning he said, "That was fantastic! Now I know why professionally you call yourself 'Divine'".

She answered "Thank you, and now I know why you call your company Microsoft."
<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggrin.gif" alt="" />

All jokes pinched from this site:

Bill Gates/Microsoft jokes

Some good jokes in there.. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggrin.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggrin.gif" alt="" />
--------------

Before Microsoft and Intel clawed their way to the top of their respective heaps the personal computer scene was something of a mess, with no clear winner to aim at and no standardisation between competing companies.

So when a dominant force did emerge there were some benefits. Whether the benefits of Microsoft’s ‘market leadership’ outweigh the disadvantages depends on........... oh, hell, who cares! So long as somebody makes a platform we can run our games on. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/evilgrin1.gif" alt="" />

I think that Rincewind and Hakea are taking the right approach…. So here’s another joke that ties them both together:

Barta, dearest one, i'm very glad you're in for this topic but...

imagine this situation: you ask to one of your student to calcul 2x2 and he begins to speak about the complex numbers then uses a trigonometry theorem and finally found the good result... would you be more happy than with another one making the direct calcul!

Windows is not working because it is not working like it should be. in computer science as in many other science we have a very a basic law that is Occam's razor! why is Windows making such a mess with absolutly useless background tasks? i'm not even speaking about computer science having very few to do with clicking on icons... old unix is absolutly not user-friendly but at least it works!

i don't buy microsoft produces: i have some advantages (or more exactly here disavantadges) linked to my professional function...
i thought Word was a microsoft produce... i'm sorry to say it but it's not the best text editor i've seen...

historically what i said was maybe a bit schematic but not false...

and other interventions this topic proves even if not willingly there is a microsoft monopoly... at least for personnal computers!

I'm with Kris on this one...


And one thing I hate is hearing about how we should all be using Linux or unix or whatever it's called cos it's 'better'...

I was in a book shop a few months ago looking at the computer mags..the pc gaming computer mags when this stranger, who I can only describe as a cross between comic book guy from the simpsons and bill gates younger fatter brother, waddles over to me and starts blathering on about how great linux is compared to windows and how secure it is and how this port and that port on windows allows hackers to get in and it wont happen on linux cos it's great and doesn't use that system of ports and how......SHUT UP!! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/badsmile2.gif" alt="" />

So I flicked through a mag, stopped at some really good looking game screen shots, showed him, and then walked away...and he followed me...to the cash desk..."but linux allows everyone to combine..."
I got out of the shop and he came to the door...with some weird forlorn look on his face. What a nut....long live windows...at least it allows me to work, play, and only crashes when I push it too hard!

On the point of monopoly of mircosoft...yeah but the alternative sucks more than MS ever could...

sorry but that's a counter-truth... well it may be true from the user viewpoint, as a matter of fact i don't have to judge that. but computer science as any science or art is not defined by the user but by its own laws. if medicine was defined by patients and not by doctors, it could cause a major public health problem. It is exactly the same here. computer science still is founded in some maths and logical founding and they are better implemented in lunix than in windows... prove the contrary with serious arguments and i'm willing to ask for the creation of a Nobel Prize in computer science just for you...

as for the argument about the game, i will add that if MS had not a monopoly games company would be more willing to make games for linux (i don't speak of Unix as it is not a personnal computer system) and linux developpers would be a bit more attentive to gamers... and so we would see Barta and some others here singing the "linux is great song"...

as for the 5 minutes left for installing linux i was half joking as i understand that unfortunately users are not ready for changing their OS for theoricians' sake... its a pity, though.

Good point, but as the final viewpoint from the user is the view that matters most to that user, then I'd have to stick with that point. If a doctor tells me that drug A is better than drug B, I wont know until I try it and it does in fact work better for me. Only then will I be the judge for myself if I think it's better or not. The science in drug A may be more complex and better developed, but if that drug doesn't do what I need it to then it fails.

In the case of OS's, I haven't tried Linux or any other non-windows, and I wont as I know it wont support games or most programs I use, so to me it's not better. Same thing with mac computers.

So what company has the clout to make a nonwindows op system compatible with all the games and programs...could that be done? <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/think.gif" alt="" />

MASTER_GUROTH

I truly understand your views and I know you’d never sway to the MS side of things.

My sister is the same way. She is a 100% die hard Linux user.
I am not. I am a 100% die hard Windows user. I am a Systems Administrator II here in American and I’ve had to deal with UNIX, MAC, Windows, and most recently Linux. Not including UNIX, due to it being a different beast of its own and I do like UNIX; however, back to my point, I compared and pushed MAC, Windows, and Linux on comparable computers.
The end result was that MAC and Linux locked up on me just as much as Windows.

Science aside, lets look at things from this view and let’s look at Windows only.
On average, mind you this is a rough average so let’s not get all fussy about mathematics; only 1 out of 25 Windows computers have problems. Consider this from a gamblers view point. Those are really, really, good odds for reliability. Increase those numbers on a world wide scale and it’s no wonder you hear so much about problems with Windows, yet the odds are still very good.
Plus, you seem to have a programmer’s knowledge. You know teams work on individual parts of a program. It doesn’t matter if all of the teams program parts mesh or not, come CODE FREEZE time the programmers have to start putting everything together. MS is not the only company that does this. More than 90% of the software development world follows this practice and then supplies patches to supplement for later.

Then there’s the complaint about Windows and Viruses.
Well, why bother writing a virus code for Linux that would only affect 1% of the population. A person who develops a virus wants to hammer the greatest populace possible. That’s the only reason why Windows is always hit with a new virus here and there. It would be a waste to write one for the other OS’s.

Plus, me being a Systems Admin, I see and know for a fact that the greatest and vast majority of the problems are usually never Windows problems.
This is one example out of many, but when you have a problem initially using a particular piece of software, what are you asked?
“Have you shut off or disabled your Anti-Virus software?”
And there are tons of other software’s out there that also causes conflicts.
Yet, people tend to blame Windows.

I’m not trying to sway you or prove that I’m right.
I respect you a whole lot and I mean that.
These are only my first hand experiences.

Take Care
Kyra_Ny <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

wooow how to answer all these interesting points without making the longer and so (especially from me) more unreadable post of all this forum...

anyway i will try to make short (not sure i can) and to recenter over the topic: windows and monopoly as i think that all what i formerly said was related to it but maybe not so clearly...


it will be hard for me to put science aside as it is my job... as it seems hard to put your system administrator job aside when you're speaking about your experience... true, kyra? i will just add on this point that neither windows nor linux would have exist without computer scientist's works... but it is quite obvious.



yep i have some programmer's experience, but as a matter of fact mainly in a non industrial realm and in a realm where constraints are not the same (as it is for fundamental search) but anyway i know here you're more or less right. still companies who releases the main linux distros have not pushed this time constraint to the absurd as microsoft has (and yes i know devs @microsoft, and yes, there are very good devs, but there is a limit to what a dev can do in these work conditions)... and i will say that "patches" for linux have another meaning than "patches" for windows as linux is defined as evolutive through patches where patches for windows are mainly only attempt to correct errors...



i really disagree here. first, enterprises and administrations begin to use more willingly linux than windows as it decreases the cost and they are a good target for virus-makers. second: i don't think that it will be possible to write a virus code for all linux distros and there will always be more linux distros than windows ones! (this is one of the thing that found MS monopoly btw) so even if it would be 50-50 windows will be more susceptible to attacks. as the code is transparent in linux it is also more easy to make ad hoc AV...

ok, i have a lecture to do just now... so i will be back for the following part later... and really i will try to recenter on topic...

<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/ROFL.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/evilgrin1.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/ROFL.gif" alt="" />

MASTER_GUROTH

Aren’t I a stinker? <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggrin.gif" alt="" />

I enjoy the same kind of friendly ping pong git with my sister. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/ROFL.gif" alt="" />

Unless I’m misunderstanding you, of which I hope not, if Linux ever did become as popular as Windows then Linux would be hammered just as hard with Worms and Viruses as Windows is now. For the time it just isn’t worth the effort. Also, as you well know, Linux is starting to adapt some Windows principals. I really enjoy teasing my sister on that aspect. She, in turn, gets back at me in some way. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" />

There are some pretty inventive and clever programmers out there that can figure a way to do about anything if they so desire.
I have yet to ever see anything that is impossible.
Maybe in the era we’re in now it is, but in time the impossible does become possible.
Man, I remember when Win3.1 came out!
The thought of the ideas of WinXP today, then, would be seen as almost impossible.
Not by all of course, I’m speaking in general here.
So again, in time the impossible does become possible.
So in time, if Linux does become as big as Windows, it will get hammered with Virus’s and Worm’s equally.

Now for Windows being a Monopoly and breaking it down makes things cheaper.
Well, I cannot concur there in ALL cases, some maybe, but not all.
So far I’ve only seen prices skyrocket from the deregulation / ending a Monopoly of Natural Gas, Electricity, and Phone Services.
True currency has deflated greatly creating the illusion that prices have risen since whenever, which in turn makes people think things are getting more expensive, but really they are not. What has happened is the paper currency no longer reflects the exact value it says it represents on its printed surface. So therefore it takes two pieces of paper currency to equal the value of one, and so on etc…, as time progresses.
So upon the breaking of these so called Monopolies, just as the oil companies have meetings agreeing on a community price. So the business moguls of Operating Systems will do the same. However, the meeting might be on a golf course instead of in an office.

Also, Billy had a dream. His dream was to have everyone in the world have a computer in their home. Billy’s dream was not to be a Multi-Billionaire; however, I’m sure he likes that side affect of his dream, but again, his dream was to have a computer in everyone’s home. He knew, while in his garage thinking with his hair as long as an 80’s Metal Hair band. That would never become possible unless things changed.
He and his friends developed a plan and now we have the Microsoft of today.

I’m really happy he did; because I really doubt we’d have wonderful things like Divine Divinity or Beyond Divinity or a million other beautiful things we have today.

Always a pleasure MASTER_GUROTH
Kyra_Ny <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

??? I thought it was kiya <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />


I am a nice teacher and i always give all the points when the soluce is mathematically correct.
But i really prefer the most short and simple soluce.


I don't think that computer is a science. I think that it is a technology.
In my mind you are not a scientist but an engineer.
You create computers and softwares both are just tools.


Probably Word is not the best text editor but for me it is the easiest to use and i will not change for a better one if it would be too difficult for me to understand how it works.

Try to understand that i am not like you, i don't think like you, i dont live like you so i can like other softwares or other games just because i am different.

Barta

I hear and concur with you Barta. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

To each their own and what they feel the most comfortable with in a Text Editor.

I prefer to use Textpad.
My sister uses EMACS.
And still many others use Notepad.
There are many more text editors out there and they're all good.

One text editor is no better than another.
It all comes down to the person using it
and what their personal preferences are.

Take Care
Kyra_Ny <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

well dear oh dear, I have started somehting here, haven't I? but so far so good I am really liking Kiya_NY's and M_G's tete a tete and am waiting with baited (SP?) breath for the final argument.

Oh yeah 1 more thing someone lemm know when the time limit is up <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/think.gif" alt="" /> it is 3 days but am not sure <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" />

both are <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/evilgrin1.gif" alt="" /> and if it's going on Kyra_Ny will be too <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggrin.gif" alt="" />



collectivly we computer scientists (sorry if you don't like the term but it is just the english word to say what i do) are not creating computer and softwares. We are making rules (and not just tricks) for creating computer and softwares what is quite not the same and i think it is enough for making a difference with engineers. for me personnaly i wouldn't say i'm a scientist, for some of my colleagues who are working more directly over the theory (in operational search and in logical works) i think that your comment is not so relevant as they work not only on how to implement the theory but also on the mathematical theory itshelf. Applied science and a young science who has not yet all the means for memorizing its error, yes, but science all the same.



well i'm not exactly sure of what i've done for deserving that <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/think.gif" alt="" />
as a matter of fact i still think that MS monopoly is more efficient to limit choice and difference that all what i've said.

i think that it was what you said... not what i said. as a matter of fact i was trying to say the exact contrary <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shame.gif" alt="" />



that has not really a sense to say Linux will be as big as windows if they become 50-50 as Linux is not the propriety of one company. More and more what is making a difference between a linux distribution and another is the security issues. anyway there are true differences between the implementing of Linux in the different distributions, so it would be much more harder to find a way to find a generic virus. i'm not saying that it would be impossible (even if i have some doubt about the possibility... well OS are not exactly my speciality), but anyway it won't be such a trouble that for windows for the reason i already named.



sorry, historically it was Steve Jobs dream, not Bill Gates. anyway it was time for that... if it would have not been one of them it would have been seen nethertheless... maybe two years later... is that really important?


another counter-truth... if there was not this monopoly developper companies will more than willing to make applicatives versions for other OS... or will work on multi system compatible applicatives (Bill Gates just doesn't want to hear about that and this is a pity because technical means for doing it exist)... i think there i just answered plowking question... and also said exactly what i think about this monopoly (or near monopoly).

BTW: time limit is 2 days and not 3, Mea.

It's 2 days (it's the Caption thread that's 3), but there's no punishment if you're not exact about it.... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggrin.gif" alt="" />

If I'm reading the time stamp on your post correctly you posted the topic yesterday (Thursday) at 2.25 in the morning (Perth time). What WERE you doing up at at that time of the morning..... no, wait, don't tell us... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" />

Ah... I remember ... you're in the restaurant business, so maybe you stayed up after closing for a smoke and a post.... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/delight.gif" alt="" />

Anyway I guess that suggests picking a winner after work tonight, or early tomorrow... or whatever .... yo da judge now!

I agree K_N, I've been working with computers for 20 years, and building them for 10 years, and the great majority of problems are not directly caused by Windows. Most people would have no idea what hardware and software is in their computer and how it all inter-relates when it works. But they've all heard of Windows - so, hey, let's blame that! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggrin.gif" alt="" /> So much easier, and much more fun. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/evilgrin1.gif" alt="" />

And as you also said, Microsoft are the biggest, so the hackers naturally love to target them. Why bother targeting a browser or OS that hardly anybody uses when you can p*ss off millions by attacking Microsoft products?

I've run a number of OS over the years (including Linux) and XP is a comfortable winner for the use I have for computers. I don't only play games, but as a gamer, XP is so far in front it's a one horse race. I would like to see some serious competition, but there seems to be nothing much on the horizon at the moment, as far as PCs go.

My main beef with Microsoft is that I wish they would break their products up a bit instead of packaging it all as one monolithic "lifestyle experience". I'd prefer to be able to instal a basic operating core and then add only 'modules' and 'features' that I wanted. However, I don't see this happening any time soon, so I just slap it all on, maintain it properly, and it all seems to work pretty well... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

In 20 years of use (and many years of daily internet use) I've never yet actually had a virus. That's not because my virus checker is batting them away - in fact I can't remember it ever being required to work - it's because I know what to do and not to do and how to set the machine up for safe surfing (it always wears a condom....). I get regular virus attack attempts of course, but I either delete them at my ISP server before they reach here, or my firewall does its job.. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shhh.gif" alt="" />

HEY....... why has my screen suddenly g

with that, i guess kris is out of the competition. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggrin.gif" alt="" />

bill gates's a witch!! burn him!! he turned me into a newt once!! yeah, burn him!! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/silly.gif" alt="" />