Larian Studios Forums Divinity II The Dragon Knight Saga / Flames of Vengeance (English) Divinity II - The Dragon Knight Saga A Long Feedback from Down Under

Hello all, my name is Maigrets and I'm a 56 year old female gamer from Australia and have been gaming since the old days of the Commodore 64 and Amiga. I'm also known for long posts that can turn into essays so I don't blame anyone for skipping over this one.

I'm a huge fan of games like the Gothic series (definitely NOT Arcania though), including Risen, and I even liked Two Worlds 1 after it was patched and will get Two Worlds 2 next year when it's released here.

Morrowind was my first real foray into rpg's and I played that for years on and off until Oblivion came along. Before that I mainly played first person shooters like Half Life 1&2, Dues Ex and the Resident Evil and Silent Hill games, but I also consider Thief 3, Vampire the Masquerade:Bloodlines and a few others to be in my top 10 list.

I've played Oblivion from the day it was released and even made some mods, (mainly creature companions and a couple of races), but I couldn't play it unmodded after the first play through. I only did the main quest once as I hated the Oblivion Gates for their boring, uninspired design and lack of variety. The same goes for most of the dungeons, except I do like the Ayleid Ruins.
The main really big issue I had with Oblivion is the obvious level scaling (thank you FCOM) which just ruins any semblance of character progression, but despite that and a few relatively minor complaints fixed by mods, it can be almost anything you want it to be I suppose. I've lost interest in it at the moment though since there's very little left in it for me.

I don't "role play' like many people do as I much prefer action rpg games. I have no interest in companions and romance or relationships in games, but give me a good quest mod with plenty of action and inspired writing and I'm there. Although, to contradict myself a little, I also don't like the fact that every little thing in a game like Oblivion, especially unmodded, wants to immediately have you for breakfast and will come from miles away to attack you. That's one of the many things games like Gothic do well. If you stay out of the beasts personal space they will leave you alone, except for boars which hate everyone.

I also play Fallout 3, but since New Vegas came along I'm probably going to uninstall it. New Vegas is everything Fallout 3 should have been and even though many people had issues with it and STEAM, I've had no problems at all, except something like three crashes over 60 or so hours and I haven't even finished it yet because DKS arrived. As far as Fallout 3 goes I've never ever finished the main quest because it was so uninteresting and unlike New Vegas, the game is more prone to crashes. Obviously, that's not everyone's experience, but I guess I'm just lucky with games and stability, in most cases.

I agree entirely with Divine Avenger's post in another thread when it comes to Dragon Age. I can't see what the attraction is. I have a friend who bought the game and I played it for about two hours and that was enough. The mechanics and game play left me cold. I don't understand why games still use turn based combat in this day and age when real time combat is more immersive and adds to the whole experience. I know people say it has a good story and music, but as I told my friend I would much rather read a good novel or listen to a CD to get the same effect without the frustration. Feel free to disagree though, but I'm glad I didn't buy it especially when it was first released at $110 Aust.

I made that mistake with Arcania hoping it wasn't as bad as it is and even after having read the scathing player reviews on it's forums. If that game hadn't been called Gothic 4 and left out the characters from previous games it could be OK as a straight action adventure, but even then it's only saving grace is the graphics and because my system isn't new I couldn't max them out anyway. Maybe I'll pick it up again one day when I've exhausted every other gaming option or if they patch it to add the missing content, which is unlikely. I've been told I'm too hard on that game as well, but the fact is it's not what it was advertised to be. I'll leave it at that.

Then along comes a jewel of a game like Divinity 2:DKS. I missed out on the original Ego Draconis here in Australia and I don't even remember seeing it for sale here though it may have been, so I was very happy to be able to buy DKS on DVD from EBGames. I got in on release day here (birthday present to myself) and I see they've reduced the price since then. Not that I care because although I only just finished the main game last night and barely started FOV, I feel I got my money's worth many times over.

This game has held my interest more than any other game I've ever played without playing something else in between sessions for a change of pace. I've been up all night, every night, except for one or two since I installed and many times saw the sun come up, wanting to continue playing. Even though many complain about the Gamebryo engine and it's foibles, I have had zero crashes or glitches and no bugs at all the whole time. I didn't need to change the 30 fps to a higher number since the game runs as smooth as silk as it is.

I 'm a gamer who has to find everything possible, do all quests and find all the secrets in a game and I think I succeeded pretty well in DKS, mostly without coming here and searching for help.

I can't say enough how good this game is and I recommend it to anyone who will listen. I'm going to repeat part of the text I wrote at a forum where I've added a heap of screen shots. I've added some extra points since I've played further now than when I posted there.
http://savageartistry.darkbb.com/ot...inity-ii-the-dragon-knight-saga-t234.htm

The things, in my opinion that make this an epic game:

1. The intelligent varied dialogue and often laugh out loud humour without being silly.
2. Logical puzzles that really make you think and stretch your imagination. Sometimes can be maddening when you can't find something, but that's the way I like it. It's a real achievement when you finally find that person or object you've scoured the landscape for, and it feels good to have solved it without in game hand holding.
3. Excellent voice acting. I'm positive I haven't played any game with better voices.
4. Beautiful music that I don't immediately want to turn off.
5. Fast and furious, yet fluid combat - dual wielding rocks!
6. Intuitive magic and leveling system.
7. Beautiful fantasy landscapes. Graphics are outstanding.
8. The writing in the books is very good and sometimes gives hints. I especially liked the one on how to avoid Trolls and the Hitchhiker's Guide was a nice surprise.
9. Great idea with the creature and being able to upgrade it. He/it saved me many times.
10. Very good story and meaningful quests. I was impressed with the ending of DKS and how it wasn't the same old fairy tale ending.
11. Love the variation of armour and weapons.
12. Consequences for your actions and different ways to solve quests. Even though the game is directing you to the same conclusion it doesn't feel linear because of this.
13. Extremely stable - never ever crashes or glitches. For me anyway. I see some have had problems and I can only go by my own experience.
14. Developers who care about their fan base. This I have never seen before and to such a degree. Kudos to the Larian team.

It's obvious Larian Studios put a LOT of love and dedication into this game and it shows. They are a small development team, but they do it right and are to be commended for their support and care for their customers.

Unlike the forums for other recent rpg releases where they are chock full of complaints, sometimes valid, others not, and vitriolic criticism, Larian Studios is a refreshing change indeed.

There are a few little things I would like to see done differently, but are mostly personal taste than issues so I don't want to give the impression they are complaints.

Some of the character faces are too similar, and maybe there could be more varied ages of the characters, but that's so minor, it's negligible. After awhile I hardly noticed it anymore since it was more obvious in Broken Valley.

While I like the platform jumping puzzles themselves, it can be very frustrating because of the tight camera angles and quicksave is a must. I agree with others who have said the auto save is annoying. Just when I'm about to cast a spell, especially entering the fortresses before I'm seen, the game stops to auto save in the middle of it which throws things off. Plus, the auto saves are so random throughout the rest of the game as to be of no real use.

I use quick and hard saves a LOT. I actually prefer not to have auto saves at all myself, or have them as an option that can be turned off, because some games are known to have issues with them causing corrupted saves. Oblivion being one of those.

I'm glad there weren't more flying fortresses as they could almost be like the Oblivion Gates and too much the same, but being able to complete them in dragon and human mode made them much more interesting. I know I could have not done them, but as I said I like to do it all.

When pressing "E" to open a container I would like to be able to use the same key to close it. If I don't want any of the contents or want to take one thing only it would be easier to just press "E" again rather than the cross at the top of the window. I learned the hard way not to pick up anything and everything before I got the Battle Tower despite that the loading screens say to grab everything possible. I would have liked to keep all of the books which I did read, but instead had to destroy many of them in the end. An option to drop items and to be able to pick them up again later would have been nice, if possible, or if not at least a small chest earlier in the game to store some things that could then be transferred to the Battle Tower storage. It seemed a little pointless having so much that could be collected in many cases. I'm a pack rat when it comes to keeping things.

I look forward to the upcoming patch to balance the weapons etc for my next play through which I already have planned out. At the moment almost nothing can hurt me and I've been using the same swords for ten levels without needing to upgrade them. Mind you they are heavily enchanted and charmed so part of that is my own doing.

The only other thing I can think of and I haven't seen anyone mention it, is in the graphic options all resolutions don't show in the list for me. I usually play all my games at 1680x1050, but the last option I have is 1280x1024. I disabled the "use same resolution as Desktop" but it made no difference. No other options show up for selection. I have my Desktop at 1280x1024 because otherwise everything is too small to read even with new glasses. Anyway, that's neither here nor there really because the game looks stunning anyway.

My system is:
AMD Phenom X3 Triple Core 8450
DFI LANPARTY DK 790FX
Geil GX22GB6400DC 2GB
Asus EN9500GT
Windows XP Service Pack 3
and I have a 22" LG Wide Screen LCD monitor.

One last thing. I really hope games don't go completely digital and downloading is the only option as internet here is expensive and not really condusive to massive size downloading due to upload and download limits and poor speed. For me there's nothing like having the real thing on a DVD so you can see what you've paid for and actually hold it in your hands. Not to mention actual manuals, although a lot of them these days are pretty much pamphlets. Something I also miss is having a nice printed map included with the purchase like some games used to do.

Anyway, that was probably TL:DR, but now I'm off to play Flames of Vengeance and another long night and morning. Thank you again Larian for that addictive experience.

Well, it's amazing how you write this all very complete down here !
Welcome here on the forum Maigrets

I can't it say in a better way as you write about "The things, in my opinion that make this an epic game:" ... great !!
I also take a look at the link to the forum you placed many picture and make funny notes with them also

Many thanks for joining your experiences about The Dragon Knight Saga with us !

Happy slashing ... and so much more ... in Rivellon, ... in Aleroth city ...

Thank you Maigrets - your post was the first I read this morning and it brought a much necessary smile to my face

Very good post, I enjoyed reading it (and agreed with most of it).

Hi Maigrets.

I'm a 50 year old Aussie gamer (bloke) and I agree with pretty much everything you say about DKS.

However, some things in the rest of your post I totally disagree with. The major one being this point:

"I don't understand why games still use turn based combat in this day and age when real time combat is more immersive and adds to the whole experience"

1) You mention this in reference to Dragon Age. Please, DA:O is NOT 'turn based' (not even close), it is RTwP (Real Time with Pause) - a completely different (and retarded) mechanic altogether.

2) Now, while this is completely subjective, I'm sorry, but 'turned based' leaves 'real time' (and RTwP) for dead when it comes to combat mechanics. Especially for party based RPG's. In fact, it's the only mechanic that can handle tactical combat when controlling more than one charactre or unit.

Also, the last part of your statement, that real time is "so much more immersive and adds to the whole experience", is just plain wrong in my opinion. I find exactly the opposite to be true.

While real time may be fine for a single player controled ARPG like DKS, real RPG's like the original Fallout's (1&2), Arcarnum etc. - and even TBS (Turn Based Strategy) games like the Civilization series and HoMM (Heros of Might and Magic) definately benifit greatly by being TB. In fact, some would just be impossible to play in real time.

If you want to try a game, with perhaps the best implementation of tactical turn based combat ever devised - give Jagged Alliance 2 a shot. It's even got a few RPG elements. I also see you liked Vampire: TM by Trokia, well give their other games a go: Arcarnum and Temple of Elemental Evil (both turn based and excelent games - Arc for RPG goodness and ToEE for awesome D&D TB combat).

Turn based games just offer so much more depth in combat strategies and tactical maneuvering then real time ever could. Have you played the original Fallouts? Give them a shot, they are SO much better than FO3 it's not even funny. Agree though that New Vegas is a step in the right direction - mainly becase it's made by Obsidian rather than Bethesda, who havn't made a decent RPG since Morrowind (sorry, but even modded Oblivion is crap).

Spot on with the Gothic series (especially 1&2+NoTR) and Risen (not Arcania). Excellent games. I honestly don't know how anyone who's played them could ever stand playing the atrocity that is Oblivion.

Anyway, "horses for corses" as they say. As you can probably tell, I prefer the more 'in-depth' experience of traditional RPG's as opposed to the more casual ARPG's, but I can definately appreciate the brilliance of games like DKS, which is actually equal parts RPG/ARPG in my opinion.

Cheers

Thank you for the welcome and replies to my long post.

Hi AlaCarcuss,

Thanks for your feedback. My mistake I guess re the turn based comment, but as you may have guessed I'm not into tactical pausing either or RTS team based games. The impression I got from playing Dragon Age briefly was turn based enough to know I didn't like it at all. I find pausing the game in the middle of combat to plan each move a chore rather than a pleasure. But as you say "horses for courses."

Now you could say that pausing a game to take a potion or enter inventory is no different, but there is a choice whether or not to do it and I don't most times. If I die that's a consequence of my actions and I try again. Gothic does that well. You can take a potion during a fight, but that won't pause the action and you will probably die while drinking it. A tactical withdrawal (ie running away a short distance) is often a better idea, but depends on the number of enemies.

With real time combat it really feels like you're fighting for your life (to me), that's if the game in question has a decent combat system of course. Then again, I'm not a good fighter either and I rely a lot on luck, and some skill. I did get pretty good in Risen though. In that game I felt every blow and blocking actually works. I'm not an expert on combat mechanics by any means and I don't bother with the fine statistics and numbers associated with weapons and armour because I find it boring.

I haven't played any of the early Fallout games or the RTS games you suggest because they are not to my taste. That has nothing to do with graphics or the isometric view (which I hate) but strategy to that degree isn't fun for me. I have plenty of old games with dated graphics that I still play occasionally. I dug out Arx Fatalis a couple of months ago and started it again. There's another rpg that was ahead of it's time. The magic system there really takes some thought and dedication and is quite unique.

I could write pages about the Gothic series and how they do everything right for the style of games they are. At least when Pirahna Bytes are involved, not JoWood. The attention to small details, like the animals sleeping at night, and more important things like factions, a real theft and consequence system and much more.

My preference is Gothic 2:NOTR, but I also enjoy Gothic 3 especially since the community made Enhancement Pack. It's like a new game, more balanced, virtually no stuttering and even has a version of HDR which looks pretty good. It's also as bug free as it's possible to be now and there is a new Content Mod that adds elements from G2 as well as re-texturing the whole game. They are big downloads though, but worth every bit of it.
Apologies if you already know about this and the Enhancement Pack:
http://forum.worldofplayers.de/forum/showthread.php?t=886288

There is even a "remake" of Forsaken Gods almost ready for release. If they can redeem that game the community deserves ultimate praise. In fact they have created their own development team.
http://forum.worldofplayers.de/forum/showthread.php?t=902795

I didn't elaborate too much on Oblivion because I actually have more complaints about it than is reasonable to print and I'm not too popular for my opinions in the community. Not that I care about popularity, but in most cases expressing an opinion that isn't totally positive is a big "no no" on most of it's fan forums. One reason why I'm reticent to join any forum these days, until I found this one and that changed my mind.

Given a choice of games it wouldn't be Oblivion I'd choose now in hindsight. I do find it playable with mods that change practically every vanilla aspect of it though, but I haven't played for over six months and if I do it will only be to update my own mods. My opinion of the vanilla game is they produced a virtual blank canvas with bare basics and let the community make it a real game, as much as the engine allows anyway. At least Bethesda gave us an editor to fix the game because they didn't. Otherwise it wouldn't be still getting the recognition it does.

I find it sad that many game developers now seem to settle for the casual approach. Yes, there's a demand for it, but they should also consider making it an optional choice for people who like older style gaming, otherwise I for one will have to rely on what I have now for replay value. That's why I love Larian's approach so much. No hand holding and you get to use the brain you were born with. I understand to a point why "casual" gaming is becoming so popular with time constraints and other stresses in real life, but on the other hand I find a game like DKS and Gothic etc are the ultimate stress relief.

Regards...Maigrets.