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Wrapping the entire text in spoiler tags just in case. Especially keen for any developer input that might be provided.


So, I just got done recording info on the stuff inside the Morals Cave, aka the Mysterious Cave, or Bellegar's Cave, and had some questions and observations.

In ED, the "Good" path rewards were better than Evil. The "Ultimate Good" weapons far surpassed the Ultimate Evil weapons, in both raw attack power and enchantment slots (2 on Evil vs. 3 on Good). This was, I thought, intended, to balance out the fact that the "ultimate" Good path required sacrificing 3 stat points (1 Vitality, 1 Spirit, 1 random).

But in DKS, I find that the Ultimate Good weapons (now "Paladin" weapons) are WORSE than the Ultimate Evil (now "Damned One") weapons! They have lower attack power AND only two enchantment slots. What's up with that? This means there is literally no reason to choose the good path over evil, since not only do you get a crappier reward, you still lose three stat points. And since the choice doesn't affect anything in-game (that I'm aware of), it just makes no sense.

ED's version gave a solid reason for choosing Good: 3 enchant slot weapons were pretty rare in the game, and some could even be missed entirely (especially Myrthos). These combined decent melee/magic damage (for endgame) with the 3 slots, giving a good reward that could possibly justify losing 3 stat points. But now, these weapons are essentially outclassed by others you couldhave already (including Razakel's Hammer, Bow of Tiberius, and...whatever two-handed swords are available). It's doubtful, at least, for the Good weapons to be obtained early enough to be definitively superior, and the Evil weapons are even better, in any case.

Also, for anyone who's tried it, what happens if you get to the dying old man with only 1 Vitality and Spirit? Will it let you give up the points? Does it prevent choosing good?

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Yes, you lose the points for giving stats to the dying old man. As for me, I didn't notice these little changes and they don't bother me because I found a random 2 handed sword in the Gremory family chest that far surpassed in strength any 2 handed sword in Flames of Vengeance. As for my battlemage, Myrthos was the most powerful weapon I had found until I brought the blade of hympthmania (or something) of off Deodartos in Ego and that blade is still more powerful than any weapon in Flames (not like I need to use it anyway since my spells normally kill enemies with 1 hit).

I find random weapons that you find to be more powerful than weapons that are always there in all playthroughs.

Last edited by Demonic; 28/05/11 01:58 PM.
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what happens if you get to the dying old man with only 1 Vitality and Spirit?

You start with one point in each, and get another point to all stats after defeating Amdusias, so the minimum you can have in the morals cave is 2.

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Originally Posted by Raze

what happens if you get to the dying old man with only 1 Vitality and Spirit?

You start with one point in each, and get another point to all stats after defeating Amdusias, so the minimum you can have in the morals cave is 2.


Ah, right. I forgot about that forced extra point!

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Originally Posted by Lancet
This means there is literally no reason to choose the good path over evil,...


This is only true if you are powergaming and not roleplaying. If you roleplay your character, then that is reason enough to choose the 'good side' if that's the choice you want your character to make.

In the grand scheme of things, you can become particularly powerful by the end of the game and the 3 stat points and slightly gimped 'good side' weapon makes little difference.


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I agree.

Action-RPGs are mainly about power-gaining power-gaming and greed ( = loot).

True Role-Playing is like being an actor in the Thearte. You play a role - one (a role) that you decided to play before the game began.

Okay, there are evil roles, too.
But the way of the Dark Side is the quick one, not the thorough one. wink


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"Interplay.some zombiefied unlife thing going on there" - skavenhorde at RPGWatch
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Well, obviously if you're role-playing, it's a different story. But it's a different story for a lot of aspects of gaming if that's your goal.

My complaint was simply that, in ED, it was nicely balanced. Evil nets you a decent weapon (for mid-20s) for "free," while sacrificing a few stat points gets you the Good version, with three enchantment slots and slightly better power.

It was a subtle enough difference in power and capability that it was a nice reward for Good (and the stat sacrifice), without being too powerful and breaking the difficulty.

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The cave is about role-playing, not getting the best items possible. Besides, the best items possible are not from the cave, they're found later or elsewhere.

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The door is locked did I miss something? I double checked to make sure I was at the mysterious cave and I am. Can you not get in after you're so far in the game? I'm about to start hall of echos and was debating if I wanted to lose the stat points in the cave so I waited till last.
Thanks!


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It should be opened to start with, and locked after you go through the cave. AFAIK there isn't another trigger to seal the cave.

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I still can't get in I did go in once triggered bellagar then left maybe that locked it? Can you get into the proper fort in the harbor?


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Yes, it sounds like the cave gets locked after you enter, rather than after you finish it.
If you are playing the Developer's Cut version on PC, you can use the Developer Mode cheat window to open locked doors, or teleport into the cave. If you have the PC version of DKS, see here about an upgrade you may already have or be able to get.


No, there is no way to get into the champions' area in the harbour building or the tower there.

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Wasn't stats supposed to be random? Try to level up and replay the cave.

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Originally Posted by Kein
Lancet
Wasn't stats supposed to be random? Try to level up and replay the cave.


Not to my knowledge. They're more or less pre-determined. Unless people can quote me different stats than the ones listed for those items in my guides (especially if whoever is doing so has the NA release of DKS on Xbox 360).


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