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apprentice
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OP
apprentice
Joined: Jan 2012
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I just don't get it. I spent around 100 hours on this game, got my character up to level 36,only to discover that the final battle is impossible. My character, a ranger with epic weapons and armor, was doing fine up to this point.But I spent over 2 hours trying to get through this battle and couldn't last 10 seconds. I can shoot divine dude in the face with exploding arrows 10 and it doesn't knock his hit points down by even 5 %. But it doesn't matter because within a few seconds I just get turned into a ladybug and killed anyways.
I lose around half my 750 HP just coming out of the cutscene, before I can roll, equip my weapon or do anything else.I can't use heal, way of the ranger or summon my creature because in the few seconds it takes to do that I just get killed in 1 or 2 hits.But even if I do manage to last a few seconds getting turned into a ladybug means instant death.
It just doesn't make any sense. There is nothing in the entire game even close to this level of difficulty. It was clearly designed in such a way that its pretty much impossible to get through the final battle.I have never seen this in a game before and I've been playing RPGs and other games for a long time. Why do so many people like this game if it can't be finished ? I would be curious to know if anyone has ever gotten through the final battle on normal difficulty and, if so, what am I missing ? Because I think that having gotten this far I should be able to get through this, but after 2 hours and dozens and dozens of reloads it just isn't happening. I have never been so completely baffled or so upset by a game before, not even System Shock 2, not even Fallout New Vegas with the Legate Lanius fight. I'd be interested in hearing any suggestions. Thanks .
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Support
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Support
Joined: Mar 2003
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Are you playing DKS or the original release of D2:ED? This is the final battle of D2:ED, but leads directly into FoV (the add-on Flames of Vengeance) if you are playing DKS (Divinity 2 - The Dragon Knight Saga). Jump forward and to the side as soon as the conversation ends. Once you get out of the hallway into the main room things will be much easier. You can run around the outside of the room to give yourself time to heal, summon your creature (and a demon or ghost if you have either skill or equipment with that bonus), then concentrate of taking out the weaker opponents with Exploding or Splitting Arrows first before going after (the memories of) Zandalor and the Divine. D2:ED topics: I need help with a battle (Spoilers) Ygerna's memory help im stuck in hall of echoesI didn't play a ranger in the original release of D2:ED, but in DKS found Splitting Arrows at close range better for taking out bosses than Exploding Arrows (especially combined with Way of the Ranger, though I didn't try that skill until I was into the FoV section of the game). Some skills were changed in DKS, so that may not be applicable in the original release of D2:ED. If you don't already know, DKS includes the remastered D2:ED (redesigned flying fortresses, changes to enemy placement, changes to the loot and enchantment systems, etc) along with FoV, but unfortunately saves from the original D2:ED are not compatible. You could start a new level 35 character at the beginning of FoV, though (as you can with the original D2:ED and FoV installed). With FoV (only available separately on PC) you can install the add-on, start the game, load your last save in the Hall of Echoes, finish off that fight and continue into FoV with the same character. If you are patient you may be able to get DKS (if applicable) cheaper than FoV (Steam and Amazon, etc, sometimes put it on sale). If you get FoV, there is a large conversion patch to turn D2:ED+FoV into DKS. If you want to see a deliberate huge difficulty spike for the end of a game, check out Psychonauts. There were a couple difficult spots in the game, but I could manage them with a few (or sometime more than a few) tries. The end level is insane, though, and none of the hints or strategies I could find online helped. Eventually I watched the end of the game on Youtube looking for an idea of what to do, but there was no way I would ever manage the series of timed twitches necessary to get through those levels. Until then it was an excellent game, though. Welcome to the forum. 
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apprentice
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OP
apprentice
Joined: Jan 2012
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Thanks for your reply, and the welcome and hello to a fellow Canuck. I'm in New Westminster.
I'm playing DKS and I think my character is about as optimized as possible.I'm doing around 1200 damage on some critical hits but the problem is that I don't get many hits in, and it seems as though it would take hundreds of hits to get through this.
Exploding arrows 10 and splitting arrows 5 do massive damage but it seems as though Divine and Zandalor have well over 10,000 HP each. Even a crit hit with exploding arrows doesn't knock their health down by more than 10 %.
If I quickly roll left and bunny-hop along the left wall I can get all the way across the room, and I can even bunny-hop around the room for a short time. But even if I manage to get a few hits in I just get polymorphed within a few seconds pretty much every time.I just can't do enough damage fast enough. And in the time it takes to fire one shot I lose about a third of my hitpoints.
I have earlier saves I could go back to but without knowing how I goofed up its hard to know how I could improve the character.But I'll probably try because it really bothers me when I can't get a playthrough out of a game and there were a lot of things I liked about this game up to this point.
BTW, I haven't tried Psychonauts, I think my favorite more recent boss battle was Frank Fontaine in Bioshock.
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Support
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Support
Joined: Mar 2003
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Did you try lowering the difficulty to Casual? In the dragon sections of the Hall of Echoes you can return to the battle tower to upgrade enchantments, etc, but can not use the teleporter, so can only return to the Hall of Echoes. Did you install the patch, if the game wasn't already updated? There was a bug where certain opponents could be over-powered (though generally that meant an instant or almost instant one hit kill attack). I ran into a glitch the first time I entered the Hall of Echoes where opponents were very tough, but after quitting and reloading the game the next day the difficulty seemed reasonable. I described that and the final fight in another topic, quoted below. Playing on nightmare (level 37) the end of the Hall of Echoes wasn't easy, but it wasn't terribly hard, either. I couldn't remember if you could unseal the door to the Hall of Echoes and complete that quest before actually entering, but I had a recent save, so tried that on the way back from the Gremory chest. It turns out you get the experience as you enter, so I decided to check out the Hall of Echoes, even though I had a couple minor things left to do. In principle the changes to the memory eaters looked good, but the difficulty spike seemed insane. A Fire Sphere could only do about 5-10% damage, and unless they were at the far end of range, there was no way to avoid their seeking attacks. I started doing ok once by taking out the first couple nests and then circling around the area high up, but by the time I took out the first memory eater there were half a dozen more, making it impossible to survive. After dying several times, I exited to the main menu rather than load a save, then decided to give it one more shot before I went to bed, so loaded the auto-save. The game seemingly changed the difficulty level (the setting remained on Nightmare) as this time the memory eaters were easy to defeat, attacks were relatively easy to avoid and the nests seemed slower spitting out opponents. I kept going when I was done, and the arena was also fairly easy. The next day I reloaded the save at the Gremory chest, and double checked the difficulty setting, not wanting to make it through the Hall of Echoes only because the game decided to make it easier. ... I returned to the battle tower and retrieved a couple pieces of dragon equipment from the chest, that had a shield skill bonus (and I put my 3 spare points into that skill), as well as the +40% defence bonus leggings (which I didn't end up needing). Earlier I removed all dragon equipment except for the Bone Dragon Cuirass (+40% hit points) and Bone Dragon Leggings (+40% offence) once I could max Firebreath, Fire Sphere, Dragon Spirit and Dragon Burst without the need for equipment spell bonuses. I only had about 10 each of healing and rejuvenation potions, so farmed for enough ingredients to make a stack of each (while wearing my +3 Master Herbalist earrings, of course), as well as gold ore to add some enchantments to my new jewellery. The earrings had a level 4 Healing Aura enchantment, so I left it and changed the other to Static Charge; for the bracelet I removed all 3 enchantments and added Static Charge, Magic Damage Aura and a Healing Aura (my second malachite gem used). Returning to the Hall of Echoes, the memory eaters were tough, but not nearly as much as in my first attempt (the Dragon Shield spell also helped a bit). The killers could be killed with 2 (or sometimes 3) Fire Spheres, while the generals needed 3-5, depending on how much they healed; attacks at mid range (that I could see coming) could usually be avoided. Two memory eaters at a time were not too dangerous, especially if they were close together. Three increased the difficulty, and 4 started to make things quite dangerous. Unlike D2:ED, it was ineffective to circle around nests while using target lock (and having a flaky target lock in DKS didn't help either). I found it best if there was a memory eater in the distance when going after a nest to try and sit on the opposite side while using Firebreath (to hopefully block any seeking attacks), then hightail it out of there to avoid taking too much damage from the memory eater if it got close (fly, heal, then turn and use Fire Sphere). The arena was fairly challenging. In the previous play session (when the game made things easy) I didn't even summon my creature, and think I only needed 1 potion. This time combat became much more hectic, with more and tougher summoned minions, which required more potions and strategic running away tactics in a couple places. My creature even died, which hasn't happened very much when it started off a fight at full health. I'm assuming the difficulty level when I first entered the Hall of Echoes was a glitch, and the second was how it was meant to be. I don't see how it would be possible to take out all the nests with Fire Sphere doing so little damage to the memory eaters (the nests didn't seem to be particularly resistant to Firebreath). I also had a problem the first time I encountered the large group below the Grand Knight teleporter shrine in the fjords, where opponents barely took any damage, especially at long range (the next day I loaded the same save and tried again, and they took normal damage). In Ygerna's memory, my first attempt lasted about a second, with the Divine Rush Attacking me as I jumped backwards, and me dying before I could heal. The next try I jumped back slightly sooner after the conversation ended. I still got hit with a Rush Attack, but didn't take as much damage, and jumped off to the side and got around the corner before using a healing potion. Lucian was quite dangerous at medium range; at long rang there was time to react, and at short range he didn't use Rush Attack, so I could usually get off some Splitting Arrows, before running away (often needing to heal). My creature and a couple explosive arrows took care of most of the weaker opponents, with a poison and normal arrow finishing off a couple that survived. When I defeated Lucian, Zandalor was closing in, so I had to run around the room again, to give me time to grab the loot bag and pick up the skill book [ED: by the stairs from the starting corridor]. My creature apparently diverted Zandalor's attention on the opposite side of the room as the entrance, so once I had the loot I got first shot in, and we traded a couple arrows and spells until I finished him off. I tried circling around when his health got low, to see if I could use a close range splitting arrow to finish him off and have time to grab any loot, but the cutscene started immediately. ... At the end of the Hall of Echoes, I had 98 unused stat points (base stat values the same as they were at level 15), and 21 unused skill points. equipment with without
hit points 942 306
mana 639 222 vitality 53 14
spirit 22 2
strength 21 21
dexterity 51 36
intelligence 7 7 damage 281-425
magic damage 114-133
melee resistance 22.1 10.4
ranged resistance 38.5 16.6
magic resistance 37.2 3.7
conditioned body 21 21
heightened reflexes 74 36
indomitable will 7 7 Ranger Strength - 10 Explosive Arrows - 6+8 Splitting Arrows - 7+3 : these 3 I should probably max soon Poison Arrows - 1 Stun Arrows - 1 : secondary skills Death Blow - 1 Evade - 1 Healing - 1 Regenerate - 1 : tertiary skills Lockpick - 5 Ranger Stealth - 5 Mana Efficiency - 6 Mindread - 15 Before the battle tower I had a couple points in Poison and Stun Arrows, as well as equipment bonuses (recently replaced some +2 Poison Arrows earrings). Both still come in handy, but mostly just as a way to pause and select a specific target, then come out of pause attacking (a normal ranged attack doesn't unpause the game).
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apprentice
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OP
apprentice
Joined: Jan 2012
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Well this is one of the weirdest things I have ever seen in a game. I tried at normal difficulty a few more times, tried changing some equipment, same results. So I finally tried switching to casual and the fight was so easy it was a joke. I got through it in less than 2 minutes. Divine went down in 4 hits, 3 others went down simultaneously with one exploding arrow hit, and I barely took any damage.
The difference between easy and normal is astonishing.At normal even 1200 damage hits barely dented the level 32 guys. But at easy they went down like 9 pins in a few seconds.At normal I got polymorphed almost every time, at easy I resisted it several times.
I never play games on easy difficulty. I think that if your'e a reasonably experienced gamer you should be able to get a playthrough out of pretty much any mainstream AAA game on normal. I think this is either a bug or just poor game design. At normal this was impossible, at easy it was just a gimme, which isn't what I wanted.
I have the Steam version so it should have the latest patches, but I think they still need to work on the balance issues.Thanks for the tips, much appreciated.
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Support
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Support
Joined: Mar 2003
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If you have the inclination, maybe try it on normal difficulty again and see if the fight is as hard as before. If not, there may have just been a glitch the first time around.
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veteran
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veteran
Joined: Apr 2005
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I can't "to be quiet" here ... sorry if my words don't make any "sense"  In DKS it's not so important how much damage you can do in one hit ! Most of the time it's more rewarding, more fun and also give more satisfaction if you search (each battle) for a nice combination of skills to defeat the enemies . For example some very useful strategical skills (with only 1 or 2 points in it is already enough for the profit) are Hide in Shadows, Rush Attack (especially against rangers), Polymorph, Stun Arrows, Healing, Firewall, Regenerate, Mana Efficiency, Evade, Ranger Stealth, ... And if you like the following skills, go for it, but remember to upgrade them each time you can (via investing points OR via yewellery or other equipment!) : Charm (charming the Healer or Captain !), Blind, Fear, ... And a Summon Ghost (use fireballs + can Heal you)/Undead/Demon + your Creature is always very welcome help ! Example 2 : if you've the luck to find a Ghoulish Head (Rush Attack/Fatality skills!) for your Creature, be sure to give it a go when you are planning to make an end of the life of Amdusias !!
On 7th of february 2015 : I start a new adventure in the Divinity world of Original Sin,
it's a Fantastic Freaking Fabulous Funny ... it's my All Time Favorite One !
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apprentice
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OP
apprentice
Joined: Jan 2012
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Tried it again another dozen or so times at normal, same result.Same thing every time. Either I instantly get rushed, knocked down and killed or, if I manage to avoid that, I get turned into a ladybug and killed before I can recover.
You come out of the cutscene right in tho line of fire and unequipped.Just equipping rhe weapon, even after dodging the initial rush, causes the loss of at least a third of my hitpoints.And even when I get a few hits in my best weapons and active skills don't do any significant damage.
I do understand that it's not simply a matter of damage per hit, but using some sort of strategy or tactics implies that you have time to do that.In this fight you have to react instantly to an overwhelming mass attack, you have to make very fast defensive moves and there isn't really any opportunity to fight back. Just taking a second to heal means getting instantly rushed and killed.
For what its worth these are my stats:
Level 36
HP 734 Mana 635
Vitality 52
Spirit 45
Strength 54
Dexterity 63
Intelligence 27
Weapon Damage 101-191 + (22-22)
Melee Resistance 37.68 %
Ranged Resistance 45.08 %
Magic Resistance 43.62 %
Conditioned Body 58 %
Heightened Reflexes 75 %
Indomitable Will 45 %
Skills:
Poison Arrows 5 Rush Attack 1
Ranger Strength 3 Mindreading 2
Stun Arrows 3 Wisdom 3
Ranger Stealth 5 Lockpick 5
Splitting Arrows 5 Encumbrance 1
Evade 3 Unarmed 2
Exploding Arrows 8 Single-handed 1
Way of the Ranger 5 Dual-wield 4
Heal 5 Sword/Shield 1
Firewall 3 2-handed 4
I would just add that although Amdusias looked hard at first he was actually easy when maneuvered into the right position on the dragon carcass bridge. And even Laiken/Raz wasn't too bad with Sassan healing. And there weren't any real tough boss fights after that. Even the arena battle in the Hall of Echoes wasn't bad, only took a couple of reloads. So that's why I was so surprised by this final battle and it's hard to know what to make of it.
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veteran
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veteran
Joined: Apr 2005
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I just wonder why you invest points in Dual Wielding/Unarmed AND in Ranger Skills also ... while you said in your first post you playing a ranger ? Maybe unlearn all skills at the Trainer platform and try another strategy ? When the fight started I immediately jumped away form the Divine and run behind a pillar, use Hide in Shadows (HiS), look around for a enemy I can Charm or Blind ... but always first summon my Creature (a fighter with Rush Attack/Fatality is my best friend on the Finale Battle here). I never was polymorphed by a magical spell in this finale battle, but I see your Intelligence is low (27) and mine was at least 80 so mine Indom. Will (to resist magical spells, see your Stats page for more info!) was also high ! It's important you can run behind a pillar when using Hide in Shadows because most of the time if 1 or more enemies are shooting magic or arrows at you whilst using HiS it did not succeed ! While you're invisible you can always use the skill Healing without becoming visible ! My strategical steps : 1) Start a battle with Creature + Summon Ghost (and Demon if Ghost is in cooldown time). 2) Also very good to drink all highest possible potions (like Strength, Intell, Resistance, ..). 3) Jump back and use HiS, use Healing if needed 4) after that search for a enemy to Charm and/or Blind. If Needed take a Mana potion. At higher levels of Charm you can Charm more than 1 enemy at the time! 5) After that I mostly look if not to much enemies are try to kill my Ghost, so I use Stun Arrows + 'Rush Attack in' and if I've a equipment item with the skill Wirlwind on it I switch to that and use it to give my Ghost more place to breath and give it the chance to heal me (the Ghost can't defent himself and heal me at the same time!) Or stun arrows + firewall is also a good weapon if you're surrounded ! Don't forget to take your time (pause the game to ponder over your next move !) Good Luck ! 
On 7th of february 2015 : I start a new adventure in the Divinity world of Original Sin,
it's a Fantastic Freaking Fabulous Funny ... it's my All Time Favorite One !
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Support
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Support
Joined: Mar 2003
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Don't worry about drawing any weapons until you are into the main room and around a corner, and will have a few seconds where you are not open to attack.
I don't recall having a problem being polymorphed... Your resistances are fine, though. An armour and strength potion might help (Conditioned Body helps reduce the time you are polymorphed).
I had an extra 200 hit points with the same vitality as your character. My first choice in armour enchantments was almost always Life Line, so I assume you did something different.
All your other stats are better than my character at that point...
Your base damage sucks. Are you not using the Bow of Orobas, bought inside the harbour building in the fjords? I used that from level 28 until the next unique bows were available in FoV (level 38 and 40).
Ranger Strength should really be maxed with a ranger. Splitting Arrows is also very nice at high levels.
I tried a warrior creature with my ranger for awhile, but preferred a mage (as I did in the original release of D2:ED with my warrior character).
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enthusiast
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enthusiast
Joined: Aug 2008
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The damage you deal and the damage you take is still level dependant, not to mention the stat points you are missing. Vitality and dex around 60, plus your character level of 36 makes for a bad combination of the ending fight.
If i remember correctly, Ygerna and Behrlin are around leve 38-40. The best weapons in FoV are also for 38+.
I'm afraid you simply started the ending sequence a bit too soon. You should have a few more levels and better stats (via charms and enchants as well). Some more skills above level 5 would also help in dishing out damage.
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apprentice
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OP
apprentice
Joined: Jan 2012
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Well fortunately I kept a lot of saves going all the way back to Broken Valley, but I don't think I would have to go back too far to pick up a few more levels since there were a few sidequests I either skipped or didn't finish.
I think I could have also paid a little more attention to enchantments which would help boost my stats a little and I definitely could use more potions in the final battle.
I put some skill points into dual-wield and 2-handed early on because my Ranger skills were weak and I kept getting stuck in small areas with a lot of melee enemies, like in Laikens Study, and having some melee skills helped a lot. I think that moving a few skill points around would probably be a good idea, particularly to max out Ranger strength and get a few more active skills above level 5.
I don`t know exactly why but I have really become more hooked on this game than on any other fantasy RPG since Dragon Age: Origins and I would really like to get all the way through it at normal difficulty, right to the end of FoV, just to see how it all turns out.
Thanks very much to everyone for the helpful advice. Good to know about this forum because there are some tough spots in this game.
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Support
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Support
Joined: Mar 2003
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Larian_QA, DocSmith59 was referring to the final battle of D2:ED, though, not DKS/FoV, so level 36 is normal. I got to level 37, and don't think higher would be possible without taking advantage of the few spots where opponents can respawn.
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apprentice
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OP
apprentice
Joined: Jan 2012
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I am playing DKS but I have found that to be a problem too, that enemies don't respawn and you also can't go back to earlier areas.Its very difficult to level up much past a certain point but I think I could get up to level 38 particularly by spending some more time in Broken Valley in the later stages after the defenses have been taken out, It would be interesting to see just how far you can level up before the final battle.
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Support
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Support
Joined: Mar 2003
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In the original release of D2:ED, a couple people were able to get to level 40. In the DKS/FoV topic helpfull way to gain experience!, Uriel reported leveling from 33 to 40 in 2.5 hours in Keara's fortress headquarters.
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apprentice
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OP
apprentice
Joined: Jan 2012
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Success at last ! ED complete on normal,although I still wasn't able to get past level 36. I see now that Larian QA was talking about FoV, I get a little confused about that too, I think it would be near-impossible to get much higher in ED because by the end of Orobas Fjords I was getting less than 50 XP per bad guy.Using the respawning bad guys in Keara's Fortress would just take too long. What worked for me was tinkering with enchantments/charms to get my base damage well over 200, HP around 900, Dex 74. Just one point of Hide in Shadowa also helped a lot, giving me time to take potions, heal and summon my creature.Also used a lot of potions, resistance, strength, dex, etc. All in all, one of the best final battles I've had in a long time. Thanks again for the tips, on to FoV ! 
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veteran
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veteran
Joined: Apr 2005
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Glad you succeed ! And I'm happy a nice Priestly Skill helped you in a very good way : Hide in Shadows ! This skill saved Ronja already many times ! And it's also handy if she's not wearing her Earrings + 1 to Rush Attack, but via HiS she can run close to an enemy and attack by suprize with a 2-handed sword attack of Thousand Strikes* or blind the enemy or use all her Charms ... * great funny skill, bought some Earrings with + 1 to this skill . Greetings from Ronja the Ranger Priest to the hero of DocSmith59
On 7th of february 2015 : I start a new adventure in the Divinity world of Original Sin,
it's a Fantastic Freaking Fabulous Funny ... it's my All Time Favorite One !
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