Larian Studios Forums Divinity - Original Sin Divinity Original Sin - Beta Weapon damage balance issue study

Would some of you be so kind as to report here some weapon stats ? I would need damage range, critical chance, AP cost, and so on. I tried to check myself, but couldn't find any magic weapon.
Basic weapons do a fine job of being quite related in power. However, my theory is that if weapons vary vastly in power, balance will be much harder to make.
For example, lets say you avearge damage for a weapon is 9/AP. If I find a weapon that does 30/AP, it could be a balance breaker, because then you would one shot a lot of things, such making things much easier, and breaking the balance. Of course, it all depends on the system in place.
If the damage output of weapons vary a little bit, you would still get better if you find a better weapon, but not grossly overpowered to make fights to easy.

Just a theory I need to check here.

Bump.
Nobody found a weapon ?
Nobody wants to help identify a possible very bad balance issue ?
Everybody is in kindergarten "cromcrom is mean so we will not answer him" ?

Just name, min-max damages, APs for a blow, would be nice, thanks.

Of course, is there is a problem indeed, I will probably rant about it, but as often, I will have have some argument.

Of course, it is system relevant, so any naysayer wil say I am stupid, as always, and to shut up. However:
Let's say
Basic weapon does 10 damage.

Enemy has 100HP.
I need 10 blows to kill him. Fine. No issue here.
Not mentionning the fact that goig from 4AP for a blow to 2APs for a blow basically doubles your damage output for your turn...

However, if I find some times later a weapon that does 50 or 60 damage, BLAM, two shots and the goon is dead, so it becomes "VERY EASY".

When I hear that combat is either too easy for some, or too difficult for others, this might be part of the problem.

You just have to find the proper weapon to make the game become "Too easy", which can lead to frustration, because it could be so hard with a "normal" weapon.

I know, these are very theorical numbers, just to try to make the theory more understandable. I am probably false. It is really a matter of balance, but this is what this beta is about, right ?

Nobody is helping because nobody knows what you are on about.

Of COURSE weapons are going to do more damage per action point as you progress through the game, to account for enemies getting stronger. Why on earth would you think otherwise?

You are basically asking other people to investigate a fairly obvious and fundamental balance issue to do with weapon scaling.

Weapons don't have AP modifiers on them. All one handed weapons seem to cost 3 AP, from my play through. I've never had a melee attack cost less than that, and it can cost more based on skill modifiers or standing further away from a target.

Two handed weapons might have a higher base AP cost to account for their greater damage, I don't know as I haven't played with them much.

Magic items have a variety of modifiers to the vanilla base item. The higher tier magic item (e.g. gold), the more modifiers you can get. I've seen plenty of green weapons that do the same basic damage as a default white version of the weapon, but have some shitty extra like +1 to charm. I've had gold weapons that seem to have higher damage than similar weapons, but not by huge margins. They are potentially excellent because of the amount of modifiers such as 10% chance to blind, bleed, or bonuses to stats. I had an orange/gold axe drop that was +1 to way of the warrior, 15% to mute and 15% to cripple or something like that, so it was pretty nice. But not totally overpowered.

Not sure if that helps to answer your question at all.

I don't. I am just wondering if weapon damage difference can somewhat break the combat by making it too easy, due to swinging from "low" to "very high" damage.
It's not like everything is perfectly balanced in this game, so it could be possible.

Big word for writing:
dagger; 1h; 3AP; 20-30 damage
magic dagger, 1h, 3AP; 40-50 damage.

Especially easy if you do have the weapon, might take 15 seconds with the proper alt-tab.


It doesn't, but thanks for taking the time anyways.

You are asking other people to catalogue the AP cost and damage range of every weapon in the game.

Do it yourself, or if you can't be bothered don't fucking snark at other people who are equally as lazy.

Yes, my point wasn't clear enough, maybe one or two of the best weapons they dropped. I can easily get the stats of basic weapons in evelyn's emporium. However, random drops and loots are different.
And the more numbers, the more precise the stats can be.

As to be lazy, I wouldn't say that. The game is boring the shit out of me, and just 30 mn of playing in cyseal, of wich 20 mn was to find a weapon merchant after I broke my weapon, took the best out of me.
However, it's not because I don't like the cyseal part that it means there is not a possible balance issue with weapons.

So the request.

it doesn't make sense to stat AP and damage because the weapon damage is going up with new found /crafted/ bought weapons after you level up so a dagger lvl1 may have 5 to 10 but a lvl 10 dagger may have 40 to 60 HP

it's the same with weapon crafting:
doing a sword with lvl 1 char gets a smaller damage weapon than doing the same with a lvl 10 character with the same crafting skill
the crafting skill is only needed to check if you can make a sword, but not how powerful it becomes, that depends mainly on your character level!

I agree this theory is highly variable dependant. I think another variable to take into consideration would be mob life points.

AP can make a huge difference in damage output in a round.

Sure it is level dependant, I am aware of that. However, damage scaling for weapon can make a difference, and keed things balanced.

I already gave theoretical example, I would like to check with in game numbers.

Lets say, mob life doubles with each level. So weapon damage would basically have to double with each level, if you want to have the same efficiency. If you want a better weapon, it would have to more than double.

The bigger the difference between weapon damage, be they magic, normal, rare, whatever, the bigger chance for unbalance.

Even more if a player can randomly loot a very powerfull weapon in early stages, thus making the game very easy.

I just have a feeling there is a balance issue here, and would like to either prove my point, or be proven wrong.

MOB HPs could be very interesting too, although I can get them myself.

why does the damage has to be level dependent? Only because diablo3 uses a system like that?

This ought to be a rpg with a unique story line, why put something like this from an action-rpg into it.

This really bugs me, as I like my weapons and I don't want to switch every time I level up.

Some numbers:

shovel: 4AP, 3-11, = 1,75 dam/AP
hammer: 3AP, 12-17, = 4,8 dam/AP
hand axe: 3AP, 12-20. Average 16 , per AP = 16/3 = 5,3 dam/AP
fighting knife: 3AP, 13-21, = 5,6 dam/AP
training sword: 3AP, 15-20, = 5,8 dam/AP
short bow: 4AP, 18-31, = 6,125 dam/AP
dagger: 3 AP, 14-28 = 7
infected fighting knife: 3AP, 13-21+3-6 = 7,16
blackjack: 3AP, 18-26, = 7,33 dam/AP
hand axe: 3AP, 18-31 = 8,1
Sword: 3AP, 18-31 = 8,16
short sword: 3AP, 23-31, = 9 dam/AP
Ceremonial 2HS: 4AP, 29-47 = 9,5
Rondel: 3AP, 22-36 = 9,6
short bow: 4AP, 30-52, = 10,25 dam/AP
knobbed mace: 3AP, 24-41 = 10,8
light crossbow: 6AP, 51-80 = 10,9
spear: 4AP, 19-71 = 11,25
splitting maul: 3AP, 24-48 = 12 dam/AP
Bastard sword: 3AP, 30-52 = 13,6
2 handed axe: 4AP, 31-78 = 13,625
splitting maul: 3AP, 30-60 = 15
executionner sword: 4AP, 48-78 = 15,75


Damage rate of basic weapons seems well balanced overall ?
However,
Beginner training sword (=starting sword) = 5,8 dam, executionner sword is 15,75, almost triple damage for basic weapons.
Basically means the fight will go three times faster.

This is not mentionning some very damaging magical weapons I may have probably not found.

Only conclusion I can find here is that the proper weapon will make the fight go three time faster than with beginning weapons.

At the 3-4 way of warrior, faster annihilate all enemies with warrior abilities.
And two handed weapon here makes best damage.
So i think, isn't important weapon balance here...
And slashing weapon is op now. Piercing and crushing weapon usually ignored too much (but crushing weapon op vs biggest part of undead).

I checked, if they are not bugged, some skills damage are weapon related (which is very nicely done, btw)

Two handed weapons don't seem to make that much more damage, AP Wise.

However, attacking just 1AP faster will increase damage by 33% for 3AP weapons, and by 25% for 4AP weapons.
In this case, the 1H splitting maul could be better than the executionner sword.

Any numbers for magic weapons ?

Wheel with two handed - 250+.
wheel with one handed - 150-170.
Don't say nothing about others abilities.
Costs are equal.
All with basic weapons.

could you precise damage range and AP cost please ? and damage range and AP cost of weapon you are using ?

wheel - is ability with 3'd level of way of warrior.
With same stats, price for one handed and two handed weapons are 2-4 AP. At the 2m radius (250 makes every person).
So phenix and ram. And so one skill, that allows oneshots mini bosses (with two handed weapon).
And crit with scythe makes 320 damage. For strike only.

nvm. Thanks anyways.

Necroing this post. Still nobody wants to participate in this study/Survey ?

DAmages ranges and AP of best found weapons needed, along with the HP of mobs/levels would be nice.