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Originally Posted by Jito463
Exactly this. It's easy to differentiate between real violence and fake. Even virtual nudity is pornographic, and pornography is a very slippery slope that's very damaging to the soul.

I'm still not really understanding the basic premise that pornography (actually I think we started off on partial nudity, but I'll run with it) is somehow inherently harmful to the point where depictions thereof are undesirable but the same is apparently not true of violence. "It's easy to differentiate" one but not the other: why? I'm seriously not understanding this.

I'll repeat, just for clarity, that I don't believe that a depiction of either is a slippery slope: which is important because there are people who believe both to be the case, as well as other aspects in video-games. Another topic is already talking about the apparent evils of ouija boards, and it's fairly well-publicised that even the Harry Potter series of novels were criticised in some quarters for supposedly promoting witchcraft. I think the slippery slope is that if one thing offends someone and should be removed, then many other things offending other people have the same merit and we wouldn't be left with much.


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Originally Posted by Haleseen
Originally Posted by freeportaa
The thing about nudity is that, yes, we are very sexual beings. We are easily driven by sex. Nudity in video games can be arousing which leads to pornography and pornography is a horrible addiction which not only destroys self-esteem, relationships and lives, but it also takes advantage of women. On the other hand I can play violent video games and never harm another soul. That's why I have to draw the line at nudity. That's my logic.

Man, what kind of world do you live in? One where you read and trust this kind of propaganda that you read on the internet?


Propaganda? Women tell me that pornography exploits women. Women are taken advantage of: women who can find no other way to make money get into the pornography industry, they don't want to but have little choice (I don't even want to get into the exploitation of children). And you can say pornography isn't as bad as drugs, and you're probably right but pornography addiction is still an addiction and is unhealthy.

As far as art goes, I don't know if I would consider pornography in video games art, especially if it's to follow a trend or to sell more copies. And it still puts you at risk for pornography addiction.

I don't think looking at porn is healthy and there are a lot of people whom I have talked to in the religious and the medical (especially mental health) communities who will tell you this.

If I was married and had children and I was looking at internet pornography regularly do you really think that that would be a healthy situation, Seriously? You're in denial if you think you can maintain a healthy marriage whilst being addicted to internet pornography. What kind of example would you be to your children? What would your wife (or husband) think of you?

I was hoping there would be a way for Larian to leave nudity out of their game because I really want to play it and I didn't think it would hurt to ask, but I do have my opinions. think

I don't mind a healthy discussion but if this turns into an "attack the OP because his opinion differs from mine" I will no longer post in this thread.

Last edited by freeportaa; 04/09/15 07:31 PM.
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Oh, it was nudity rather than pornography I was refering to as an art form. Sorry if I wasn't clear on that. Pornography as an art form does exist, but in video games it's... Well it often means zero interactivity, graphic novel, and Japan.
And alas, nudity is often used in video games as a way to sell more copies to a young male audience. We can't deny that. It's sad. I remember the sex scenes in Mass Effect 3 being pretty laughable because they went as far as give laced underwears to female shepards. It was.. No really, it was both awful and laughable.

Anyway I should watch Don Jon one of these days. The story of a man addicted to pornography, which perfectly fits the topic we've been discussing smile

With that all and said, please know that my intent was never to judge your opinion but rather to discuss it to try and understand it. In the end we both have ours and it's what the world an engaging place !


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Originally Posted by freeportaa
Propaganda? Women tell me that pornography exploits women.

Some women say everything exploits women; some say pornography is empowering if a woman chooses to do so.

Larian will not be adding nudity to the game, and have never indulged in 'fan service'. If you didn't have a critical problem with Astarte's outfit in D:OS or collecting the second teleporter, there is no reason to expect a change in design for the worse for the next game.
One of the female writers has said in an interview that the male writers can write good female characters. While an effort to design good male and female characters with realistic motivations and interactions does not preclude nudity, it is certainly inconsistent with nutidy being added just for the sake of adding it (or as Dr Koin said, because you think your main demographic is adolescent boys).

Realistically, there will be no way to filter profanity, but modern profanity will not be used in the game, because it doesn't fit. If you didn't have problems with the language in D:OS, I don't see why there is any reason to expect D:OS 2 to be worse in that regard.

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Nudity and overt sexuality in a Divinity game would be silly; it would contradict the established tone of Rivellon. I don't expect to see it, I wouldn't expect to see it and I'm pretty certain I won't see it in the finished game.

It's kind of a silly topic to discuss, since one thing Larian has always been very consistent on is the tone of their games, which have always been very whimsical and hardly "grim," "gritty" or adult-themed.

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I don't feel strongly one way or the other, I wouldn't avoid a game for having certain content in the same way I wouldn't avoid it if it didn't. I'm guessing this thread and discussion is a spillover from the FUBAR that is the D:OS 2 user-voice?

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Originally Posted by freeportaa
Originally Posted by Haleseen
Originally Posted by freeportaa
The thing about nudity is that, yes, we are very sexual beings. We are easily driven by sex. Nudity in video games can be arousing which leads to pornography and pornography is a horrible addiction which not only destroys self-esteem, relationships and lives, but it also takes advantage of women. On the other hand I can play violent video games and never harm another soul. That's why I have to draw the line at nudity. That's my logic.

Man, what kind of world do you live in? One where you read and trust this kind of propaganda that you read on the internet?


Propaganda? Women tell me that pornography exploits women. Women are taken advantage of: women who can find no other way to make money get into the pornography industry, they don't want to but have little choice (I don't even want to get into the exploitation of children). And you can say pornography isn't as bad as drugs, and you're probably right but pornography addiction is still an addiction and is unhealthy.

As far as art goes, I don't know if I would consider pornography in video games art, especially if it's to follow a trend or to sell more copies. And it still puts you at risk for pornography addiction.

I don't think looking at porn is healthy and there are a lot of people whom I have talked to in the religious and the medical (especially mental health) communities who will tell you this.

If I was married and had children and I was looking at internet pornography regularly do you really think that that would be a healthy situation, Seriously? You're in denial if you think you can maintain a healthy marriage whilst being addicted to internet pornography. What kind of example would you be to your children? What would your wife (or husband) think of you?

I was hoping there would be a way for Larian to leave nudity out of their game because I really want to play it and I didn't think it would hurt to ask, but I do have my opinions. think

I don't mind a healthy discussion but if this turns into an "attack the OP because his opinion differs from mine" I will no longer post in this thread.

And religion can be an addition as well and it constantly hurts hundreds of millions of people every single day. It also empowers hundreds of millions of people every day.

Too much of anything is a bad thing. People can become addicted to sugar, video games, sex, working, body-building, salt, water, television, sleep, and more. But just because someone looks at pornography doesn't mean that they are addicted, or are going to become addicted. Nudity and sexuality in video games != pornography.

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Originally Posted by Haleseen
Originally Posted by freeportaa
Originally Posted by Haleseen
Originally Posted by freeportaa
The thing about nudity is that, yes, we are very sexual beings. We are easily driven by sex. Nudity in video games can be arousing which leads to pornography and pornography is a horrible addiction which not only destroys self-esteem, relationships and lives, but it also takes advantage of women. On the other hand I can play violent video games and never harm another soul. That's why I have to draw the line at nudity. That's my logic.

Man, what kind of world do you live in? One where you read and trust this kind of propaganda that you read on the internet?


Propaganda? Women tell me that pornography exploits women. Women are taken advantage of: women who can find no other way to make money get into the pornography industry, they don't want to but have little choice (I don't even want to get into the exploitation of children). And you can say pornography isn't as bad as drugs, and you're probably right but pornography addiction is still an addiction and is unhealthy.

As far as art goes, I don't know if I would consider pornography in video games art, especially if it's to follow a trend or to sell more copies. And it still puts you at risk for pornography addiction.

I don't think looking at porn is healthy and there are a lot of people whom I have talked to in the religious and the medical (especially mental health) communities who will tell you this.

If I was married and had children and I was looking at internet pornography regularly do you really think that that would be a healthy situation, Seriously? You're in denial if you think you can maintain a healthy marriage whilst being addicted to internet pornography. What kind of example would you be to your children? What would your wife (or husband) think of you?

I was hoping there would be a way for Larian to leave nudity out of their game because I really want to play it and I didn't think it would hurt to ask, but I do have my opinions. think

I don't mind a healthy discussion but if this turns into an "attack the OP because his opinion differs from mine" I will no longer post in this thread.

And religion can be an addition as well and it constantly hurts hundreds of millions of people every single day. It also empowers hundreds of millions of people every day.

Too much of anything is a bad thing. People can become addicted to sugar, video games, sex, working, body-building, salt, water, television, sleep, and more. But just because someone looks at pornography doesn't mean that they are addicted, or are going to become addicted. Nudity and sexuality in video games != pornography.


Heh, I wonder how many people who look at pornography are not addicted to it. I can imagine it is a vast minority.

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Originally Posted by Raze
Originally Posted by freeportaa
Propaganda? Women tell me that pornography exploits women.

Some women say everything exploits women; some say pornography is empowering if a woman chooses to do so.

Larian will not be adding nudity to the game, and have never indulged in 'fan service'. If you didn't have a critical problem with Astarte's outfit in D:OS or collecting the second teleporter, there is no reason to expect a change in design for the worse for the next game.
One of the female writers has said in an interview that the male writers can write good female characters. While an effort to design good male and female characters with realistic motivations and interactions does not preclude nudity, it is certainly inconsistent with nutidy being added just for the sake of adding it (or as Dr Koin said, because you think your main demographic is adolescent boys).

Realistically, there will be no way to filter profanity, but modern profanity will not be used in the game, because it doesn't fit. If you didn't have problems with the language in D:OS, I don't see why there is any reason to expect D:OS 2 to be worse in that regard.


Good to hear, thank you.

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Originally Posted by Vometia
Originally Posted by Jito463
Exactly this. It's easy to differentiate between real violence and fake. Even virtual nudity is pornographic, and pornography is a very slippery slope that's very damaging to the soul.

I'm still not really understanding the basic premise that pornography (actually I think we started off on partial nudity, but I'll run with it) is somehow inherently harmful to the point where depictions thereof are undesirable but the same is apparently not true of violence. "It's easy to differentiate" one but not the other: why? I'm seriously not understanding this.

I'll repeat, just for clarity, that I don't believe that a depiction of either is a slippery slope: which is important because there are people who believe both to be the case, as well as other aspects in video-games. Another topic is already talking about the apparent evils of ouija boards, and it's fairly well-publicised that even the Harry Potter series of novels were criticised in some quarters for supposedly promoting witchcraft. I think the slippery slope is that if one thing offends someone and should be removed, then many other things offending other people have the same merit and we wouldn't be left with much.


Men are very, very visually sensitive when it comes to sex, so even drawings can be very arousing to men. Whereas, when we look at violence in a video game we don't generally go out and start punching people...

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Originally Posted by FriarRosing
Nudity and overt sexuality in a Divinity game would be silly; it would contradict the established tone of Rivellon. I don't expect to see it, I wouldn't expect to see it and I'm pretty certain I won't see it in the finished game.

It's kind of a silly topic to discuss, since one thing Larian has always been very consistent on is the tone of their games, which have always been very whimsical and hardly "grim," "gritty" or adult-themed.

True. As much as I'm currently enjoying The Witcher 3, for example, it'd be terribly dull if every game was done in that sort of style. I'm quite content for Divinity games to continue being done in their own established style, which I'm sure they'll continue to do.

Originally Posted by Haleseen
Too much of anything is a bad thing. People can become addicted to sugar, video games, sex, working, body-building, salt, water, television, sleep, and more.

And buying shoes. Though I can't see how owning too many shoes is a bad thing. Except for minor injuries sustained from the resulting shoe avalanche whenever I open the wardrobe.


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Originally Posted by freeportaa

Men are very, very visually sensitive when it comes to sex, so even drawings can be very arousing to men. Whereas, when we look at violence in a video game we don't generally go out and start punching people...

So, what about gay people? They are 'visually sensitive' to other things.

Also, men aren't the only people who look at pornography.

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Yup, women also watch pornography. It's a well established fact now.

And really, sure, we don't go out and start punching people when we play violent video games ( despite what the medias would like to have us believe ), but then again, we don't go out and start raping women when we watch porn.


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Can someone point out to me where in the 1st Divinity Original Sin there was nudity or vulgar profanity? I don't count the encounter with the mayor's wife considering you never see any nudity. Frankly I think people are getting themselves worked up over a moot point.

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Originally Posted by gbnf
Can someone point out to me where in the 1st Divinity Original Sin there was nudity or vulgar profanity? I don't count the encounter with the mayor's wife considering you never see any nudity. Frankly I think people are getting themselves worked up over a moot point.


The OP never claimed they did, nor did I ever see him get worked up. He wrote (emphasis mine):

Originally Posted by freeportaa
I hope, like the first one, Larian won't have swearing (like the s-word and f-bomb) and nudity, otherwise I cannot play it. I plan on backing this game for $50 when Larian starts accepting PayPal. I'm pretty excited about this!


So whom are you addressing? I think the thread has been relatively civil so far.


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Originally Posted by Dr Koin
Yup, women also watch pornography. It's a well established fact now.

And really, sure, we don't go out and start punching people when we play violent video games ( despite what the medias would like to have us believe ), but then again, we don't go out and start raping women when we watch porn.


Pornography is harmful to the recipient, you don't have to go out and rape someone for it to affect you or other people in a negative way.

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Originally Posted by freeportaa
Originally Posted by Dr Koin
Yup, women also watch pornography. It's a well established fact now.

And really, sure, we don't go out and start punching people when we play violent video games ( despite what the medias would like to have us believe ), but then again, we don't go out and start raping women when we watch porn.


Pornography is harmful to the recipient, you don't have to go out and rape someone for it to affect you or other people in a negative way.

Have you ever looked at porn before?

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I laughed.... I laughed hard...I laughed long...Oh my god people..as a female gamer I want to say LAWL, LAWL I say. "Porn is evil and will melt your eyes" *throws bibles at people* seriously get off it. This is not the place for a topic like this. Take it to 4chan.

I think there are some small minds wobbling around and if I offend someone with saying that, well you know where you fit. Porn is not a drug nor is it dangerous... is also does not exploit women. That is just narrow minded thinking.. cause what about gay porn? let me guess that exploits women? *shifty eyes*

If anyone is worried about Larian adding any nudity or even sexual graphic material to the game, you are worrying for nothing...I mean they might add gender specific replies in dialog chats, but I doubt it will be anything nude or porny.

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Originally Posted by Ellary
I laughed.... I laughed hard...I laughed long...Oh my god people..as a female gamer I want to say LAWL, LAWL I say. "Porn is evil and will melt your eyes" *throws bibles at people* seriously get off it. This is not the place for a topic like this. Take it to 4chan.

I think there are some small minds wobbling around and if I offend someone with saying that, well you know where you fit. Porn is not a drug nor is it dangerous... is also does not exploit women. That is just narrow minded thinking.. cause what about gay porn? let me guess that exploits women? *shifty eyes*

If anyone is worried about Larian adding any nudity or even sexual graphic material to the game, you are worrying for nothing...I mean they might add gender specific replies in dialog chats, but I doubt it will be anything nude or porny.

*puts on her black robe*

Probably one of the best replies I've seen in this thread so far.

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Originally Posted by Windemere
Originally Posted by gbnf
Can someone point out to me where in the 1st Divinity Original Sin there was nudity or vulgar profanity? I don't count the encounter with the mayor's wife considering you never see any nudity. Frankly I think people are getting themselves worked up over a moot point.


The OP never claimed they did, nor did I ever see him get worked up. He wrote (emphasis mine):

Originally Posted by freeportaa
I hope, like the first one, Larian won't have swearing (like the s-word and f-bomb) and nudity, otherwise I cannot play it. I plan on backing this game for $50 when Larian starts accepting PayPal. I'm pretty excited about this!


So whom are you addressing? I think the thread has been relatively civil so far.


Perhaps switch much-to-do-about-nothing for worked up. I didn't & still don't understand the concern for something unwarranted. The only time I could remember profanity in the 1st game was during the beta when an upset vendor chased my character to the homestead where she killed everyone there. Zigzax was understandably upset & said something profane before dying. As far as I know that never made it to the final game. I've already addressed nudity.

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