Larian Studios Forums Divinity: Original Sin 2 Divinity - Original Sin 2 - General "Stolen" tags - difficult to understand the design

Let's assume someone invests points heavily into skills like "pickpocket" and "sneak" around the concept of a rogue character. Items are stolen, but even if you "get away" with the crime the items still have a "Stolen" tag stamped on them.

I understand the real-world logic here, but I'm struggling to understand how (from the perspective of game design) this is practical. For example, you steal a nice piece of armor and.. then what? You can't walk around using it without risk of being busted by a guard later on. Perhaps the original owner will eventually die and the "stolen" tag will be removed (a feature which does not work reliably, by the way) - but by then you've likely obtained better gear and no longer need that item.

Again - I understand the real-life logic there, but for gameplay purposes it's like.. what was the point of even stealing anything? What was the point of providing a pickpocket skill in the first place? And what's the point in players investing in it?

I feel like the only purpose behind theft is to turn around and sell the stolen items to a merchant - which (if we're focusing on logic) doesn't make much sense either. I would rather encourage targeted, meaningful theft, rather than encouraging players to vacuum up everything that isn't nailed down because then you can sell it for money and buy what you actually want legitimately.

I just feel like the whole stealing mechanic is poorly thought out. Either that, or I'm seriously missing the intended purpose of it.

The "stolen" tag is removed for stackable items if you have a non-stolen item of that kind in your inventory and the stacks get merged.

So if you want to have a "nice piece of armor" without risk (and without "paying" for it) you must actually buy it and then steal your gold back. Your stolen gold and non-stolen gold gets merged to one stack without "stolen" tag.

That's all well and good for stolen gold, but if you (for example) find a nice piece of equipment in a container that is marked as being the property of another NPC, then the equipment you liberate from said container is marked "stolen" as well. And then we're right back to the issue I raised in the opening post.

I share the exact same sentiment. In fact, I think you're practically forced to vacuum up anything and everything you possibly can via theft, just to sell it, to keep up with the gold requirement to buy the necessary gear to obtain the stats roughly close to basic monsters or foes of equal level.

Older games make you feel rewarded for procuring this type of gear and risk keeping it. (Baldur's Gate, Morrowind, Ice-Wind Dale, etc).

This game throws a dozen gear upgrades every level-up at you which is almost a requirement based on the statistical scaling of foes. Again, just seems like it makes theft+re-sell a requirement and nothing meaningful. Almost like a chore.

The "Stolen" tag is removed, though, by the way, on stackable items which I think is great and makes sense... because how is someone going to recognize 1500 gold pieces from your other 10,000 gold pieces? They aren't -
and shouldn't - same with other stackable items, like special arrows, grenades, spell scrolls, crafting ingredients and so forth... So I enjoy that aspect at least, where other games still kept the item as stolen and did not stack with legitimately procured items.

'I need to search your bags! YEP, I KNEW IT! those TWO Shocking arrows out of your stack of 30 are DEFINITELY mine! Same with that single Nailbomb grenade and those Drudanae buds! THIEF!!!'

(He can have the arrows and grenade back but at least leave me the Drudanae )

Edit:
And yes, something that is truly unique, like a piece of gear, should remain tagged. Especially if it's a valuable piece. But I don't think I should be limited to stealing from an NPC one time, either. THAT just doesn't make sense. How does a vendor re-stock their supply so fast and tantalize you with 15 purple items, 5 pinks and a unique items, then he's fully restocked after you rip him for tons of gear? THAT doesn't make sense.

Edit#2:
You can sell stolen items marked as such to an NPC which that item did not belong... FYI.

You can even sell it to the original owner, which seems a bit silly.

Yeah that's strange.

I see it this way: stealing is very easy in the game and without real risks. To battle this they took a look at real life, where stolen goods are usually sold. Using stolen stuff is risky as many thiefs notice all day when caught in stolen cars during traffic controls.

I think it is ok, stealing should not be the master way to live an easy life.

1. Steal expensive item.
2. Sell back to owner.
3. Repeat 1-3
4. ???
5. Profit?

~NuttiKrust

I'm going to guess you haven't actually tried this, because it doesn't work that way. You can only pickpocket a specific NPC one time.



The problem is players invest points into related skills like pickpocket and sneak, valuable points that can be used elsewhere. So while I agree stealing shouldn't be the end-all-be-all of everything, the point investment should at least pay off with a system that makes sense. Stealing an item and then not being able to use it because the entire world can see a "stolen" tag on it really doesn't.

Why bother stealing gear? Buy it steal money easy fix.
Or steal skill books consider they are consumables.

Also steal tag do not makes zero sense how do a other person on other side of the world knows it's stolen....

Then why have unique gear laying around that can be stolen? For example, early in the game the shopkeeper Nebora has a nice pair of boots in her tent - an item that's far better than anything you're likely to own when you initially arrive to Fort Joy.

And yet, if you steal them and get away with the theft, the "stolen" tag remains making them impractical to actually wear.

So what's the point of them even being there in the first place? You can't purchase them, you can only steal them. But if you steal them you can't wear them without getting into trouble once you're caught wearing them.

Again, from a real-world perspective it makes sense. But from a gameplay perspective where theft is part of the game, and rogues exist, and stat points are spent on making them better thieves, it's a nonsensical design.

What if I steal a spell book and I use it instantly? I didn't test this. No matter if they wanna see your bags cause you have nothing

If you pass the persuasion check, you're never hassled again, so I never even noticed the NPC reactions.

..until you get stopped for another robbery later on, at which point you risk losing all your earlier stolen items if you fail the next persuasion check. At some point you will fail a roll, and then what? Reload and save-scum yourself out of a jam? That's not an inspiring game design.

The Stolen tag needs to have a time limit and then disappear after a while, with the higher your scoundrel skill, the faster the tag disappears. The thief specialist is the most UNFUN JOB. Yes, J-O-B because you are basically required to be one to pay for anything AND it is a mind numbingly borring job where you have to steal something, then wait for the same person to accuse you of stealing and search or talk your way out, just to do it again later..over..and over...and over. All for what? A few scraps of coin? A few consumables? Armour/Items that are unique and you have to sell because you cannot use them and will cause too much trouble if you are caught with them. Then throw in the fact the game is built around you HAVE to thieve and barter because all the prices are jaw dropping ridiculous.

This is where balancing completely sucked the fun out and made it a chore to do with no real reward for it.

You can just talk to an npc with an different char than the person which has stolen goods in it's inventory. Rob him with another char while he/she is still talking. Run away, - Quit the talk screen if your second char is away far enough and let the npc accuse you of stealing. If you have no stolen items in your Inventory you don't have to pass a speech check and all is good.

Afterwards the npc will search the near area for aound 10 seconds and than returns to his usual spot and won't search again for stolen items. You can repeat this as many as you like if you just create a new char afterwards. Which means: Everytime the merchant inventory resets you can rob him again.

Edit: That is btw the most obvious reason why some ppl bragging how easy tactician is. They just exploit this and running around with epic equip worth ~40k per lvl up which is in a normal game unobtainable.

I find this to be an issue too and what it teaches me is that everyone should carry at least 1k gold with them now until they do something about the tag.

I find it hilarious you can steal 10k gold from someone and when they confront you about it, you can bribe them to gtfo for 700 gold, guaranteed to get out of any situation.

Wow! There is a "Buyback" option - but only if you play the game with a controller. On the mouse + keyboard interface this option doesn't exists.

by using this option you can clear the "stolen" tag for every item without losing any gold.

https://i.imgur.com/cMhRJcM.png

source: https://www.reddit.com/r/DivinityOriginalSin/comments/7130gq/small_tip_on_stealing/