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OP
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Joined: Dec 2017
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Since I'm waiting now for the 4th hour in a row in Arx for the vendors to restock so I can go into the last 2 battles with good gear, I wanted to take my time to propose what I think would be the right thing to do when it comes to gear / vendors and crafting for D:OS3.
Reason is that I think that the one big problematic thing about D:OS2 in my opinion is the shopping.
Problems are:
* Tons of nonsense-items (strength gear with +Huntsman and +Finesse? Seriously?)
* Unique items are very good for their specific level but are useless right afterwards
* When you are a completionist, like me, lucky charm gets you underlevel-gear all the time, where even divine quality items are nothing but "vendor trash"
* Levelling up comes with the "punishment" of "oh no, now I have to travel like crazy and do 30 minutes of shopping" - multiple times, btw... because every hour you HAVE to repeat because the vendors only have very, very few really usable items per restock (at level 22 I know now that for a party of four I need to do about 6-8 (!) restocks before I'm acceptably geared again)
* I never use crafting after level 3 or 4 (except for the Eternal Armor) because there are no good receipes
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So here my suggestions for D:OS3:
* Vendors only sell white items, except of course for very, very few uniques (such as the "Chamore Doran", which my summoner / support caster still uses, because there was no replacement... see the problem?) - and you buy them because of their basic item type and looks, not because of their stats
* Basic item stats automatically get better with your level
* You enchant items to add stats and +'s using materials you find / get as quest rewards (90%) and buy (10%)
* Civil ability bonuses can be extracted into "essence of the thief" or something similar (to give an example) and applied to other items as well, by destroying the original item
* Make crafting great again by not selling items for the better part of act 1 of D:OS3 at all - force the player to craft like crazy to get something better than rags, sticks and stones
Additional ideas (bonus ideas):
* Transmogrification
* Very nice designs for items are gathered for cross-playthrough use via achievements (like this nice spear Malady drops in the dream realm) and you can use them using transmogrification from an early level on
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stranger
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stranger
Joined: Feb 2018
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Tons of nonsense-items (strength gear with +Huntsman and +Finesse? Seriously?) Those are not allways trash. Some points from gear in huntsman can give you some usefull skills like First Aid and Tactical Retreat. Same with scoundrel - you can grab Adrenaline. That is true for almost any ability. My suggestion will be changing vendors so they sell just MORE different items with different bonuses. Like Huntsman vendor can sell all types of armor (str/fin/int) with +Huntsamn. That is so simple yet so convenient.
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addict
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OP
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Joined: Dec 2017
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Or something like that, yes.
But as it is now it feels like Arx is drawn out artificially by the lack of good vendor items.
Did the doc once again now (after weakening him for the first time), and now I'm in for another 2-3 rounds of vendor waiting until I'm rid of the last underlevel item...
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member
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Joined: Nov 2017
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To be honest, your suggestions hold dangers of their own.
I think, when it comes to shopping, people fall in extremes. It's pretty OCD to want to have absolutely every piece of gear on the same level as soon as you lvl up... and it's also pretty needless. We have said enough about OS2 combat. Despite, it still holds enough variety and options for you to be able to tackle anything the game throws at you even if you're underequipped for the level. A bit of armour will not change that--it's mostly an issue at the beginning of the game.
I, for one, give all my party members points into strength, intelligence and finesse exactly because I want to gear them up with anything in hand. If I stick to one high attribute per character, gearing becomes very difficult. If I spread the stats a bit, gearing becomes very easy. That's why I am not against intelligence gear having strength bonuses and so on. Pretty much the same with skills... might just be me, but I never focus on a single skill, such as--I absolutely need to have 20 in summoning. That's quite boring when you think about it, too.
Last edited by Yasen; 24/02/18 02:38 PM.
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OP
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Joined: Dec 2017
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I was considering this, too... but this comes with at the price of damage output so I decided against it.
Just finished the playthrough now. Watching ST:TNG on Netflix while I was waiting for the restocks did the trick and I was fully geared in second best and divine tier level 22 gear, with most bonuses at least somewhat useful.
Now I'm thinking about my next playthrough. Full magic party is, because of the gear / vendor issues, a no-go, obviously, so I have to come up with something else.
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member
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Joined: Jan 2015
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To be honest, your suggestions hold dangers of their own.
I think, when it comes to shopping, people fall in extremes. It's pretty OCD to want to have absolutely every piece of gear on the same level as soon as you lvl up... and it's also pretty needless. We have said enough about OS2 combat. Despite, it still holds enough variety and options for you to be able to tackle anything the game throws at you even if you're underequipped for the level. A bit of armour will not change that--it's mostly an issue at the beginning of the game.
I, for one, give all my party members points into strength, intelligence and finesse exactly because I want to gear them up with anything in hand. If I stick to one high attribute per character, gearing becomes very difficult. If I spread the stats a bit, gearing becomes very easy. That's why I am not against intelligence gear having strength bonuses and so on. Pretty much the same with skills... might just be me, but I never focus on a single skill, such as--I absolutely need to have 20 in summoning. That's quite boring when you think about it, too. I tend to give some INT to my STR based characters and some STR to my wizard to balance their physical / magical armor stats a bit. FIN items are balanced anyway so those chars should not need any points in INT and STR. I'm also tired of regular save-scumming and waiting for restocks after each level-up. As the OP suggested, this game feels unfinished regarding crafting. All previous divinity games had an acceptable crafting system. Basic items with no stat increases but with more slots and more rune types could solve this issue easily. Alternative solution: vendors could provide custom items at enhanced prices. This however, would require an additional vendor menu where you could choose stats for the final item. Level-ups could unlock additional options for these custom items. Having to stop after each level-up for multiple hours of shopping really kills the immersion. EDIT: I didn't add this originally as it was already suggested elsewhere on this forum but of course additional quests for unique items or unique ingredients would also be a great option. Sadly, the only memorable unique item in this game is Shadow's Eye.
Last edited by SleepyBadger; 25/02/18 08:33 AM.
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addict
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OP
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Joined: Dec 2017
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It's interesting that this problem doesn't really exist in act 1, is borderline acceptable in act 2 and gets really bad in act 4, where the situation in act 2 (long shopping trip 2-3x per level, as you go) turns into "oh I reached level 21... now it's time for 4-5 / level 22... now it's time for 6-8 restocks before I continue". The terrible supply situation is a real fun-limiting factor and I think that this is not the intended balance, because it can only be mitigated by not having fun (= waiting for restocks). Also I think that just decreasing the delay between restocks wouldn't really solve the problem, because the extended shopping trips would still exist. And this also wouldn't solve the serious devaluation of unique items (something which I also dislike, because I think that if you get a very good unique item you should be able to use it until the end of the game, not just for one level - or, in many cases, not at all). We didn't even touch lucky charm, yet... it's ok to have a vendor trash creation tool, but it would be really good if it gives items @ character level, not at supposed area level. I have a hard time remembering if I ever used a lucky charm item past level 3 or 4. I just wish there was a big itemization / crafting overhaul. Together with the wasteful spending on talent points and civil abilities (which I mitigate by using the "FortJoyRespec" mod after gathering the companions, but this feels a little "cheaty") this would be something I really hope for. Imagine no more "restock waiting", "throw away uniques" and "mindless scanning through the vendor inventories", but getting items which scale to your level, can be upgraded with +stat and +skill and, maybe, even transmogrified... this would be something. In theory this could even work like this: 1. Your tank gets that nice unique sword from that semi-hidden area near Braccus Rex' statue on the beach @ level 4 2. Level 7: your tank wants necromancy, too, to become a blood drinking death knight and can add, via a nice process, "+1 Necromancy" to that sword as well 3. Level 9: Wow, those gloves I stole from that dwarf chick have +2 thievery... I want that on my +strength gloves... no problem! lets destroy the gloves, thereby getting 2x "essence of the thief" (or something similar) and use that to enchant the gloves I wear!!!1 (Extra result: no more armor pieces to swap out for... ahem... artisanry  ... makes the game also much, much smoother to play!) 4. Level 11: oh, that sword from that vendor (white quality) looks nice, I want the stats from the unique I got but the looks of this vendor sword... lets transmogrify! 5. Level 17: the sword now is perfectly fine for a level 17 character, has been upgraded to, say (+/-) +2 warfare, +2 necromancy and it has an enchantment which makes it glow in red 6. Level 22: DING!! you just reached endgame character level... now lets see if the party can do a last enchantment on all the items before we kill those satanic scumbags who torture and enslave sourcerers... yes, it's possible... level 22 opens another slot on, lets say, head gear (either a +stat or a +ability or even a +skill slot) --- Overall balancing idea: if you're a completionist, like me, you should be in character level divine quality gear at the end. If you simply play the story, without many sidequests and without a divine order killing spree before engaging the Doctor and Lucian, you should be in character level gear with an average quality of the third best tier (dark purple?). May sound extreme, but there should be a real advantage for completionism over just rushing through. Not doing sidequests and not taking care of the balance between good and evil should be punished by not getting best quality gear. Because the more you do the more crafting materials for item upgrades you should have. Item level should automatically scale with your character, so you don't have to worry about shopping (and, therefore, being punished by having your fun interrupted) with every level up.
Last edited by Firesong; 25/02/18 09:04 AM.
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member
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Joined: Nov 2017
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It's interesting that this problem doesn't really exist in act 1, is borderline acceptable in act 2 and gets really bad in act 4, where the situation in act 2 (long shopping trip 2-3x per level, as you go) turns into "oh I reached level 21... now it's time for 4-5 / level 22... now it's time for 6-8 restocks before I continue". The terrible supply situation is a real fun-limiting factor and I think that this is not the intended balance, because it can only be mitigated by not having fun (= waiting for restocks). Also I think that just decreasing the delay between restocks wouldn't really solve the problem, because the extended shopping trips would still exist. And this also wouldn't solve the serious devaluation of unique items (something which I also dislike, because I think that if you get a very good unique item you should be able to use it until the end of the game, not just for one level - or, in many cases, not at all). We didn't even touch lucky charm, yet... it's ok to have a vendor trash creation tool, but it would be really good if it gives items @ character level, not at supposed area level. I have a hard time remembering if I ever used a lucky charm item past level 3 or 4. I just wish there was a big itemization / crafting overhaul. Together with the wasteful spending on talent points and civil abilities (which I mitigate by using the "FortJoyRespec" mod after gathering the companions, but this feels a little "cheaty") this would be something I really hope for. Imagine no more "restock waiting", "throw away uniques" and "mindless scanning through the vendor inventories", but getting items which scale to your level, can be upgraded with +stat and +skill and, maybe, even transmogrified... this would be something. In theory this could even work like this: 1. Your tank gets that nice unique sword from that semi-hidden area near Braccus Rex' statue on the beach @ level 4 2. Level 7: your tank wants necromancy, too, to become a blood drinking death knight and can add, via a nice process, "+1 Necromancy" to that sword as well 3. Level 9: Wow, those gloves I stole from that dwarf chick have +2 thievery... I want that on my +strength gloves... no problem! lets destroy the gloves, thereby getting 2x "essence of the thief" (or something similar) and use that to enchant the gloves I wear!!!1 (Extra result: no more armor pieces to swap out for... ahem... artisanry ... makes the game also much, much smoother to play!) 4. Level 11: oh, that sword from that vendor (white quality) looks nice, I want the stats from the unique I got but the looks of this vendor sword... lets transmogrify! 5. Level 17: the sword now is perfectly fine for a level 17 character, has been upgraded to, say (+/-) +2 warfare, +2 necromancy and it has an enchantment which makes it glow in red 6. Level 22: DING!! you just reached endgame character level... now lets see if the party can do a last enchantment on all the items before we kill those satanic scumbags who torture and enslave sourcerers... yes, it's possible... level 22 opens another slot on, lets say, head gear (either a +stat or a +ability or even a +skill slot) --- Overall balancing idea: if you're a completionist, like me, you should be in character level divine quality gear at the end. If you simply play the story, without many sidequests and without a divine order killing spree before engaging the Doctor and Lucian, you should be in character level gear with an average quality of the third best tier (dark purple?). May sound extreme, but there should be a real advantage for completionism over just rushing through. Not doing sidequests and not taking care of the balance between good and evil should be punished by not getting best quality gear. Because the more you do the more crafting materials for item upgrades you should have. Item level should automatically scale with your character, so you don't have to worry about shopping (and, therefore, being punished by having your fun interrupted) with every level up. Not bad.
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veteran
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veteran
Joined: Oct 2016
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D:OS 1 had the Sword of Planets, the probably best unique, just because of the fact, that you could recraft it about every two levels and afterwards buff it for example with Tormented Soul do give it a level depending Str and Dex boost. Though calling these things 'unique' is pretty missleading, it was probably their best invention regarding together with all those option to improve damage and stats from weapons with crafting. Not sure if this was still possible in EE. In EE you had some craftable weapons, which were improveable if you found the missing pieces, but I think they were hidden so hard, that they were already outdated, when you finally managed to gather all the pieces together. Similar of how Bracchus armor works in D:OS2.
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Joined: Apr 2017
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Yeah vendor are annoying...there are patterns to enforce items to change at the vendor... but it takes tremendous time.. so that you get the proper item with the stats you're looking for...
Been a while since I've used it but I've already described it earlier in this forum...months ago.....
There is some sort of a 3 wheels system:
When you speak at a vendor, the items listed are good for one hour and will change after that.
Each time you speak to a vendor, the wheel click one turn (wheel with about 6 click). All vendors use the same wheel. When speaking with that vendor, it loads the item listed for that specific vendor using that number. So if you see a uniq belt and you don't want that, since this wheel is part of your savegame, you can load your save game before speaking with him, instead talk to any other vendor first and then speak with that vendor again... the wheel would have click twice and therefor load the next set of items in line and let's say show you a uniq ring.
Now that you know how to get a uniq ring, the said ring might not have the stats you're looking for. Therefor there is another wheel (about 30 clicks) that is hardcoded into the game (not your savegame) showing different variation of said item. So when you know that click on a vendor will show you the item you want, uniq ring, you load the game before checking the vendor for items...and therefor move the item to the next click and show you a uniq ring but with different stats...
The third wheel rotates/replaces (about 4 clicks) the first wheel's items every time an hour is spent at the vendor to completely change the available items. Hardcoded in the game, not the savegame. So for instance, you've bought the ring you've liked, but the next hour, that vendor will no longer show you any uniq ring as the new wheel does not have any on either 6 clicks....but now might be the time to look for that uniq armor witch is now showing...
but it is indead a pain in the ass to look for specific items in this game which could be improved greatly considering the almost infinite build you may want to be playing.....and therefor would like to have the proper stats for your own build....
So even though some items may not fit any of your characters, it might be good for another player.... +1 scoundrel even on an item +2 Pyro is good as that +1 scoundrel allows you to learn Adrenaline...
Last edited by AngeliusMefyrx; 10/04/18 12:04 AM.
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apprentice
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apprentice
Joined: Mar 2018
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Instead of giving suggestions for a new game how about giving suggestions for an expansion for D:OS2?
by making an expansion they could try/test new ideas on the game, not only that would keep the game alive for longer but it would also give more options to be improved on a new game(instead of trying/test them).
Last edited by watcher; 10/04/18 02:02 AM.
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stranger
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stranger
Joined: Apr 2018
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Hi everyone, Though l am new, l don't want to be stranger...  Unfortunately l can not play online because l have only limited internet connection. I wish there would be this game for offline DVD version too... though l know it is nasty request. See you soon in Aleroth. 
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member
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Joined: Apr 2017
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Throngs, it is very simple, if its online, people tend to buy the game instead of getting a cracked version.
As for a solution for the items, The Division (game) found their own system where you can reroll stats, improve stats and have sockets to put the proper bonus in the item that you want... as they were a lot of complaints about it....unfortunately they are doing this toward the end of it's lifetime...thing I hate about games when they enforced "grinding"/"wasting your time"
Maybe a game like this where they are so many stats possibilities could make use of something similar to that.
Last edited by AngeliusMefyrx; 10/04/18 05:31 PM.
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