Larian Studios Forums Baldur's Gate III Baldur's Gate III - Mega-threads and Guides The Turn-Based/Real Time with Pause topic

Don't you people only ever use 2 casters and a bunch of melee guys? Some people want 4 casters and that doesn't work too well without pausing all the time

But even in that case, how can one say pausing even a lot in RTwP is more than auto-pausing after every action in TB? TB, by definition, is pausing in the extreme.

With 4 casters not only do you have pausing quite a lot, but a buttload of nice managing and even still your dudes might not do exactly what you wanted. In TB, it always does what you want

Okay, but the discussion was about too much pausing, not how easy it is for someone to manage their party.

Well 38/41 classes that have been confirmed are casters or have some other form of slot mechanic. Most of the time there will be 3 or 4 "casters" in a party so there's going to be a butt load of pausing in RTwP. At that point, isn't it much the same as TB?

Okay, let's just say for the sake of this discussion that the amount (number of times) of pausing is the same. Then it comes down to what is convenient, doesn't it? And that is personal preference, isn't it? For you (and others), the game automatically pausing after every action is what is most convenient. For me (and others), the game pausing only when I tell it to pause (which includes conditional pause presets) is what is most convenient. Furthermore, the game constantly auto-pausing is actually very aggravating and annoying and intrusive to us. And further to this furthermore, with RTwP, the TB fans at least have the possibility of getting something akin to what they want if the game includes an optional toggle to auto-pause after every character's action. But no similar compromise for RTwP fans exists within a TB combat system. Or put another way, a RTwP system can be made to work like a TB system to at least some extent to make it more palatable to TB fans. But a TB system offers nothing in it that can make it more palatable to RTwP fans.

I think it depends on what points of TB that you like. For example, if you like an initiative system, you're poop out of luck as well.

The IE games as well as P:Km do implement initiative. In P:Km you actually get to see the character (in RT) just standing there doing nothing for a few seconds and waiting for their initiative to come up.

While that could work, I think it's strange having a real time aspect but people still just standing there. I like how they are trying to find a compromise, but it seems to go against a real time feeling. But I never played it so maybe it worked out well

It's not strange because the animations give the feelings that the characters are fighting but there's a delay. Even in BG1/2... Combats are divided in individual turns but you just can't notice it if you only look are your screen.

I think TB could find ways to give the feelings fighters aren't freezed but I don't think Larian want to do more than just another usual (improved and with other rules) TB combat system.

Well it's either that or an improved with other rules RTwP system from some other game. Unfortunately, I don't think there's any practical systems left to develop so it's a lot of improving on past systems.

But I'm glad they implemented it without it being strange. I was worried a out it being awkward and I'm kinda tempted to try it out

In RTWP you were able to move or change your actions depending in what the enemy does.

The problem in TB (among others) is that you have clusters of enemy turns where they can literally kill you and you are just watching without any reaction. Not only unrealistic, but also frustrating.

Plus in DOS2, there was always a very strong enemy that would start the fight with 4-5 actions and you would only stare without doing nothing.

That's option one. Then you can balance the game better.

Option two would be: don't use system revolving around analysing stats, chances to hit, bunch of status effects, riddiculus amound of spells, so one can play in real time, and still, well, play the game.

That's just part of the strategy. It takes some mental prowess to control 4 party members in real time, even with pause, just like it takes mental prowess to make sure you're prepared to take on 4 turns in a row. Also in BG3 there are reactions which help.

Baldurs Gate was originally made with the idea of translating a D&D to video games, so it's kind of crazy to abandon the system like that. And you basically just described an arpg

I think @Wormerine was speaking in general terms and not specific to this game. And as such I do agree with option 2. I don't really like the D&D D20 system. I think it is an archaic and inferior system. But because it goes back a long ways it has gained some sort of cult status and everyone just keeps using it or some version of it. Three things in particular that I hate about D&D mechanics are: initiative; dice rolling for everything/luck determining the outcome of events; and, too many spells and other similar active abilities. So, yeah, I would much prefer a cRPG system that did away with those three things in particular.

Oh I get what you mean now, my bad. And I'm actually on the other end of the spectrum. I love the d20 system and how chance has a play in everything. It makes combat more exciting and as someone who makes it up as I go along, it's definitely my style. I get how it can be annoying though, if you are a good planner, it ruins every single plan. I also like the volume of spells because I feel there is more ways to do things, and I like new ways to do things. I think initiative makes sense in some ways but not others. I fully expect my ninja monk to get a hit in before my wizard can. But it's set to an extreme with a turn order, which I don't think is entirely fixable

Sure, one cannot completely change nature of D&D when making game based on D&D structure. I was talking on RPGs systems as a whole.

I call bullshit on claim that one can analyse battle situation of 10+ characters all making attacks, activating abilities and casting spells at least once every 6 seconds. Hell, in modern titles (Kingmaker) preventing units from activating bunch of opportunity attacks and killing themselves is a nightmare alone, not to mention doing anything coherent, unless dice is already in your favour (and therefore it doesn't really matter what you do).

It's rather hard to keep track of all the things going an at once for sure, and that's not merely the to-hit-rolls, but also concentration checks, checks on concealment, etc. etc. Owlcat's next game is going to be turn-based Sci/Fi, btw. Probably based on Starfinder, which equally is based on Pathfinder/D20, but they've yet to announce it.

I found the combat mostly more fun in Deadfire -- even something as adding the simple combat speed slider did so much to the experience.