Originally Posted by Haps
Originally Posted by mithril
Table top players realize a single die roll can change a good/bad situation instantly. When a DM has multiple rolls it being used to create tension like the Nettie situation. If the tension isn't there, multiple rolls are being used because a DM wanted a different outcome but the player either rolled too good or too poorly. Never let something really important be decided by the dice alone. Meaning, a DM shouldn't let something occur in which only the dice can get a player out of. The player needs to make several mistakes on their own and perhaps that one last die roll determines their fate.


Here's how I would design the encounter for a tabletop game:

Introduction
Medicine check succes: Hm, this druid can't even heal a bird fully. This is probably a waste of time.
Option to leave.

Walking towards backroom
Insight check succes: Her mood has darkened considerably and she doesn't meet our eyes. Something's afoot.
Option to leave.

When entering backroom
Nature check succes: That vial she picked up was wyvern venom.

Nettie speaks again
1+ succes on previous checks: Call Nettie out. Persuasion check to pinky swear to poison self, or murder hobo option
0 previous succeses: Get poisoned. Deception/Intimidate/Persuasion/murder hobo to get antidote.

This I feel will give several character builds a non-lethal way out while building tension, and it won't serve four match points against you.


I would be fine if they implemented that scene in that manner. When I first encountered that scene I was a bit annoyed that my Ranger character didn't have the option to identify the plant she was holding. Up until she tells you she is trying to kill you there is little to say that doing as she says isn't a bad idea. Then you have to go through the multiple skill checks and frankly, if I'm successful at a "give me the antidote or I'll kill you" type intimidation I expect the result to be a cowed and compliant Nettie not an indifferent one that I have to then intimidate again. Logically, multiple threats of "give it to me or die" should be less threatening not more.

I think the entire multiple successive skill checks for a single action and encouraging a murderhobo approach via mechanics is a terrible idea and needs to be rethought. The only reason I can think of for them doing this is that they wanted to make it a difficult check, but because of the way they have implemented skill rolling they need to ensure a final target number between 1 and 20.

I did eventually manage to succeed at the conversation once, which required a persuasion (DC 9), deception (DC 11, no persuasion option) and another persuasion (DC 9) roll. I assume this means a base DC of 10 for each check, my character had proficiency in persuasion but not deception and despite having a 10 charisma seemed to be suffering from a -2 charisma penalty (from the poison?). On straight rolls this results in an 18% chance of success, with disadvantage (which I assume was also applied due to poison) this drops to a 3% chance of success. For a single skill check this would require a base DC of 18 for persuasion, a non-proficient skill check with an 8 charisma would therefore result in a DC 20 check.