Larian Studios Forums Baldur's Gate III Baldur's Gate III - Suggestions & Feedback Evil Playthrough Feedback

So I did my first playthrough as a True Neutral Zariel Tiefling Cleric of Kelemvor, I'm now doing a Chaotic Evil Lolth Drow Beastmaster Ranger and just finished helping Minthara kill everybody. Here's my feedback so far on my evil playthrough. Just feedback, no bug reports. This will get long.

The beginning of the raid feels very short, there should be another tiefling or two up there. I didn't get much past yeeting Zevlor off the wall into the middle of goblins before all the tieflings guarding the wall were dead. Zevlor's speech also made me feel like a horrible person for betraying him. Good guilt tripping. Still yeeted him. I think another evil option would be to force Zevlor to open the gates himself, involving intimidation rolls and him trying to jump you and cut your throat like Astarion's introduction. Also the goblins killed the tiefling kids before I got to them. I want to be evil, let me kill the tiefling kids myself. I got to kill a goblin child, on screen, in cold blood, why do I not get to the murder the tiefling children for maximum evil? Also, for more maximum evil? The Zhentarim trader in the goblin camp talked about the goblins selling prisoners to her. There's surely a market for tiefling slaves, perhaps tying them up and delivering them to her for some extra gold.

After the tieflings were dead and Minthara went into the little cave, she just kinda chilled out and started praying to the Absolute. She told me to go kill the druids. I wasn't quite sure what she's doing there or why she's not helping kill the druids? Is it supposed to be her 'test' of me? The whole time I'm trying to kill 15 druids with just 4 people and a bird I'm thinking, "Does she want the job done or does she want to test me, pick one Minthara, because this is ridiculous."

The druids themselves were a tougher fight than the tieflings, but still easier than fighting Dror Ragzlin and his entourage. Mainly due to the terrain difference, in Dror Ragzlin fight, I had enemies coming in 3 different directions on my party and one character got War-Cry'd into the spider pit. For the druids, I just kept to the top of the staircase while they filtered up. One of them Wild Shaped into a Spider and became too big to get up the stairs and spent the majority of the fight making spider noises and jumping around the grove. One of them kept casting Entangling Vines AOE on the stairs which entrapped more of her allies than mine, which made the fight way easier when there were 3 druids just standing there in the vines not moving or attacking because their AI didn't want to risk the saving throws involved in moving.

Nettie in my opinion should have more HP, or more healing ability. The healing on the druids did introduce a new challenge the Dror Ragzlin fight didn't have, but I focused fired the healers and with their low HP, they were down very easily. She's even mentioned by Halsin as a very good healer-in-training, but she healed less than some other druid I hadn't even talked to. The druids in general seemed to lack ranged attacks, which is likely the reason my 2 ranged characters were the only ones to live. I had to lead the druids up the staircase to the Death Wish goblins, who had a pretty amazing detonation chain that wiped out three druids. It should be easier to get the goblins to help you with the druids, they just kill a couple of tieflings kids and sit around boasting like hotshots. The trader dwarf had a crossbow, but did not seem to do much with it. The bears should also have a little bit more HP in my opinion, they were the most terrifying part of the fight besides Kagha.

As for the post-raid party in the camp - The good option gets a lot more dialogue from the tieflings. We see Marricko murder Kagha in cold blood in what is possibly the most badass scene in the game. The evil option doesn't really have an equivalent. The goblins are all unnamed and don't really have much in the way of dialogue options. Easy fix is just giving all of them names pulled out of a "Goblin Name Generator" and some of them having dialogue options discussing their raid and future plans. Maybe a goblin boasting about what he's going to do with his loot, or Volo's goblin girlfriend learning how to sing and performing. I also want to make Volo dance, for the evil points. We also don't get a permanent camp buddy being evil like good players get Halsin. Obviously Minthara can't stay, but maybe Volo's girlfriend.

Minthara's romance cutscene - wow that was a lot of drow boobs. Very good stuff. I got whiplash from how fast she went from kissing me to trying to kill me. It felt like the conversation ended a little quickly compared to how long Halsin talked about Moonrise. She also only mentioned the mountain pass road, not the Underdark or Risen Road path. Considering Wyll's quest talked about how the drow took Mizora to the Underdark, I expected her to at least mention the Underdark as an option.

I would also like a chance to at least roll to convince Wyll to stay. Maybe by convincing him this is all part of the bigger picture to free ourselves, the ends justify the means, give me a chance for redemption, sometimes sacrifices have to be made, etc. It was a true gut punch to see him leave though.

Finally, outside of the goblins vs tieflings arc, I actually had some trouble finding evil choices. Ethel for example. Didn't really feel chaotic evil to save Mayrina, but I still wanted closure on the whole Ethel shebang. Maybe an option to team up with her, do a quest to find something she needs for the Mayrina stew, and then she becomes a trader selling those potions you find on her shelf and other goodies, or she gives you a special ability for helping her. The owlbear was another example where I didn't see much of an evil choice. I told the novices to go find the owlbear, but then they assumed I'm coming with them. So I followed, they died to the owlbear, I killed the owlbear and the cub. Didn't feel all that evil outside of killing the baby. I headcanoned myself as telling them to sacrifice themselves to the owlbear. Perhaps an option, if you have Speak With Animals and why wouldn't you, to converse with the owlbear and tell her she can eat the novices in exchange for whatever goodies the last person she ate had.

In general, there should be a stronger incentive to be evil, like the fights being easier or getting extra abilities or choices or loot. I think I actually got less loot being evil. Evil choices in Pathfinder Kingmaker for example open up new kingdom councillors, more loot, skipping or easier fights, and even another companion. Selling prisoners, getting gifted something from Minthara (besides her ass in your face), or getting an evil companion would all be cool ways of rewarding evilness.

Loving the game and probably gonna do a third playthrough after this one is done.

Update:

So I left Halsin alive because I wanted to taunt him after killing all the druids. Promptly forgot about him and never actually did so. He later showed up in my camp to ambush me in retaliation. Gotta take a moment to say this was an absolutely amazing scene. I'm still raving about it a day later. Really felt the consequences of my actions there. I do think the fight is undertuned, some suggestions to improve it: He shows up with two bears instead of one, and still summons his wolf companion, this puts him 4-to-4 (although it's weird Lae'Zel just stood there and watched just cus she wasn't currently in the party). He throws some good damage-y AOEs or crowd control AOEs on us. The bears have 5-10 more HP and more damage. And when killed in Wildshape he should turn back to his human form with the HP he had before Wildshaping like in 5E, this would definitely make him feel tanky.

On companion reactions to being evil: Astarion delights in it and actively complained about being good, but giggles like a schoolgirl when I do bad, I love it. Gale doesn't seem to care all that much besides some "Gale disapproves" popups, it could be better clarified through dialogue why he doesn't care all that much as he seems to be at the least a good guy, if not big G good. Lae'Zel does not care for anything besides githyanki related matters, you could stab a child in front of her and she would yawn, which sort of makes sense, but made her romance cutscene a little jarring. She went from "I care about literally nothing except githyanki and killing mindflayers" to "The way you slaughtered that tiefling was so erotic, I'm going to dominate you all night." which kinda weirded me out. Wyll I already mentioned is staunchly good and his leaving was quite good, although I still wish I could convince him. And Shadowheart, I thought she had a very well-done reaction to killing the druid grove as an evil cleric feeling guilt over evil actions. Complex emotions and interesting writing, although I still think she could be convinced to open up sooner.

I started to run out of traders after killing the grove and the goblin camp turning hostile and helping Glut destroy the sovereign circle. Really feels like playing evil is limiting myself in some aspects.

Also as a drow, I would very much like to be able to talk to Commander Maz'rin in the Underdark and help whatever evil drow mission she's on, the fact she gets hostile and her corpse doesn't even talk is sad.

Final update:

So I killed the dog to see what would happen, nothing really happened. A mailman's dog doesn't seem an appropriate pet for my Lolth worshipping bloodthirsty drow, I really wish I could adopt those spiders in the goblin camp though. I used Speak With Animals and deceived them into thinking I'm Lolth, told them to kill all the goblins and even after I opened the door they just sat there. Another pet would be nice besides the owlbear cub and dog, if not the spiders, then maybe the rat in the tiefling camp, he's adorable.

I re-did the Ethel fight and killed her in her hut, was cool to see that it lifts the magic off of the petrified dwarf and the elf. The dwarf just sort of walked away after I demanded payment for saving his ass, I guess being petrified would mean he wouldn't have much on him, but I felt more like his savior than someone extorting him for my own evil gain. The elf I could mock for being an elf as a drow, but besides that every option just ended with telling him to leave. I am a drow, he is my sworn enemy! He should be imprisoned for even looking me in the eye, and then I could sell him to the nice slave trader girl.

The masked people were still hostile and rolling against Hag's Pawn, even though she's dead. Was fine with killing them though.

Mayrina yells at you to let her down, and then gets mad at you for rescuing her, weird incongruency. I also made sure to go into the hag's workshop before letting her down and grabbing the Stillborn potion, thinking I could offer it to Mayrina to solve her "I'm gonna be a bad mother" problem (not that abortion's the evil option but it seemed like a sensible option), but there was no option to give her the abortion potion. I dunno if that just hasn't been considered by the team, or if it was metagaming for me to read the description and assume my character would know what it's for when they don't have the in-game description. You do know that the Bitter Divorce is for raising Connor though, so bit odd.

As for Connor, I obviously raised him and kept him to myself. Mayrina's howling and falling to the ground was exceptionally acted and animated, love that Astarion found it hilarious as well. Connor, however, is pretty useless as a pet. What exactly was Ethel's plan here, since she obviously intended to raise him considering the wand exists? Maybe some more HP and damage and if he didn't disappear after a few turns and he'd be useful.

The artist in the Zhentarim hideout: So I purchased him as a slave and told him he'd be my slave. He yelled he was no one's slave and ran away. Right past all the Zhentarim guards. Who did absolutely nothing. No reaction. I tried to attack him for being insolent and couldn't. I guess the Zhentarim just don't care since he's no longer their slave either way?

Helping Glut kill Spaw: This was an incredible fight. It felt like a battle in a war. It was quite challenging, but I think it can be tweaked in some areas. The Confusion clouds by the myconids introduced a unique challenge. Probably a case of Gameplay and Story Segregation, but the duergar had talked about how the myconid confusion spores made his allies jump off a cliff laughing. Obviously doesn't need to happen here, but when my companions got the Confused debuff, they would still attack the enemy just in a less optimal way. I think they should attack their own allies, it would add another layer to the fight.

The hobgoblin trader said that he wasn't much of a fighter, yet was more of a force than Spaw or the hook monster, his Shatter wiped out Gale and nearly killed my ranger in one turn. And then when he got low HP, he just teleported out. Bit of an inconsistency from him saying he can't fight and he was hiding in his spot when the duergar were attacking, and I've also lost two more traders playing through the evil choices. Not sure what the right solution is here, because he brought a big level of challenge to the fight and I don't want to miss that. Maybe when he gets low HP he surrenders instead. The myconids didn't really fight in unison, they were rather all over the place. One of them hilariously spent most of the battle running around trying to keep up with my party and by the time he got there, everything else was dead and he got focused.

At the end of it, Glut said he gave me some sort of song of victory, but I don't have anything. The challenge was its own reward, but boy I sure wouldn't mind a cool mushroom-y power, or a little mushroom pet. We see Glut walking around his new colony, it would give a little more life to the world if we saw him raising bodies like Spaw did for his new colony. Good quest, amazing battle, could use some tweaks. Either way, it felt appropriately evil to walk up to Spaw calling me "Peace-bringer" and murder him and all of his children. Loved it.

The duergar: It really doesn't feel evil to grab the boots off the gnome and sail away, it actually feels rather heroic because the duergar seem to take this as "ok, let's leave the myconid colony alone now." Not sure what the solution here is either. The choice to just bring them the boots should still be there, but they should be insistent on you attacking the myconid colony, their allies died after all. Maybe have a roll for convincing them that just having the boots is enough. And they can come help exterminate the mushrooms. So it's a choice between the duergar, Glut, and Spaw.

The fish people: This was a fun scene. I made the deal with BOOOAL, and that seems about the extent of the interactions down there. BOOAL said he wants blood, I killed a couple of people, and he still doesn't seem to react. Should be some more stuff down there in general. But really funny area.

Lastly, I feel like there wasn't enough companion reactions/voicebarks to me being a murderhobo. Turning on Spaw, killing the dog, purchasing people, dealing with duergar/fish people. My companions were silent as mice. Astarion's reactions when they did come up were great, Shadowheart's felt a little preachy but still enjoyed her input. And Gale...I can't recall Gale ever commenting on anything.

And with that, I've finished my evil playthrough and sailed off! Hope the feedback was helpful.

Nice analysis, thanks for sharing such detailed thoughts that you obviously kept in real time. I'm sure it'll go a long way toward helping Larian improve the game.

I totally agree about the whiplash with Minthara. It's also a very unsatisfying but common trope in evil RPG playthroughs - where you have to sequence break and engage in harder fights to find the evil option to begin with, and then the evil quest giver turns on you anyway as soon as you're done, and you lose out on both locations or factions. It's really rare for a game to say, "Okay, you worked to find and take the evil route, now you get to use the Goblin/Orc/Undead/etc. area as the new town/base/merchant/faction for this location permanently," and I'd like to see more of that from BG3 if they have the resources to pull it off.