Originally Posted by DuderusMcRuleric
Originally Posted by Ascorius
@DuderusMcRuleric Which class does the most damage at lvl 4, without all the feats and races might be rogue, but it is useless information. Lets compare that rogue to a relatively optimized ranger in 5e at lvl 5. Human variant with 16 dex sharpshooter and crossbow expert as feats. Horizon Walker. He uses 2 hand crossbows. And his fighting style is archery. Average damage on the three shots he can fire is 4.5+3.5+3.5+3.5+3+3+10+10+10=51 damage. I know this is before miss chance, and it will fall quite a bit, but math on taking -5 with sharpshooter is well known. And missing becomes rarer and rarer the higher you get in level because of bounded accuracy.

Rogues with an extra offhand attack does not do much. As a rogue I would rather have expertise. And if I want to do massive damage with a rogue, I am going to multiclass.



yeah disregarding the fact that much of this stuff is not actually in the game laugh So whats the point? not even sharpshooter feat is in the game right now and im not sure if it will come online. And in DnD the rogue can not get a bonus action for 2 offhand attacks in 1 round. so how does that even compare?
this is a feedback for the game of BG3. not for DnD5e. They diviate from DnD5e quite a lot. I would not argue rogue is the best DPS in DnD. No way.

This is also why even shadowhard can out DPS a ranger with a bow in ranged combat iwth fkin alchemist fires. you tend to always hit at least 2 ppl. most of the time 3. it deals bludge on hit +d4 initial fire + d4 fire for up to 3 rounds. No hit roll required for the fire damage. coming up at potential 9d4 damage if you hit 3 people + battlefield control effect if the enemy needs to cross the fire.
you pull that off very reliably. Wich you honestly dont need. I just reloaded the fight with the traders north of the gnolls and solo´d them with astarion. its not even hard. hiding mid combat so the enemy can not attack you is pretty fkin brilliant and he has highest DPS.
Hence why it is a game feedback for BG3. The rogue is very strong combatwise is this game. Not talking about what he can do in actual DnD. The thread was about the rogue are lackluster in BG3. they are absolutely not, they are freaking murder machines. The best one you can get at this point in time.




Yeah, it is feedback for the alpha. And my point was to show that the rogues damage output was completely fine and nothing insane. And things change over levels. Just at lvl 5 many classes get extra attacks, while the rogues only increase in damage comes from 1d6 sneak attack. But it is true that I am assuming that most feats will get implemented. Which might be an error on my part. I am hoping though we get most of the feats though. Some of them are needed to make interesting builds for martials.

That being said, I still think the rogue is lackluster compared to the tabletop. Expertise is huge, and cunning action is much weaker now that everyone gets disengage as a bonus action. I just dislike that the rogue has lost what I think of as its identity. I don't see any gameplay reason for changing the rogue really. Well, they did give everyone something that was exclusive to rogue and monk to everyone, so I guess they felt they needed to give something extra to rogue etc. But I fail to see a good reason everyone should have a bonus action disengage anyways. Maybe that is another error on my part.

EDIT: Also your damage calculation for the rogue, above in the thread, is off. You will not have both 18 dex and the dual wielder feat at lvl 4 without human variant.

Last edited by Ascorius; 13/10/20 09:57 AM.