Larian Studios Forums Baldur's Gate III Baldur's Gate III - Suggestions & Feedback Save scumming during pickpocketing. Can you deter this?

Restrictive to users" is all a matter of perspective. Maybe its in their design that the game should increase the prices of all of the items that are in shops now. If you said that was restrictive, it would be your perspective based on the price it was before. There is no such thing as being restrictive in there design, because their creation of art, their game - is what they want to produce. You may feel restrictive when comparing it to other games, but they dont owe you anything. They dont have to follow any rules. No one is telling anyone how to consume their product and I never suggested that. You are the one saying that. Im not sure why you keep trying to add analogies to sex, identity and politics and parenting and race in this discussion. Its really weird and making me uncomfortable and has nothing to do with this game or this discussion. Its just weird. Please take it a notch back with the strange analogies which dont even fit the topic. Thank you.

As far as increasing the difficulty to balance the game, this is a normal thing all developers and game companies do. Do you think that all games have to be created with exploits for you and cheats because you deserve it? Dont be so self absorbed please, the world doesnt revolve around you. Be humble. Im just expressing what I think would improve the game and what I think is wrong with a part of the game, and I am welcome to do so because its early access. Its called feedback. You dont need to argue against it or say that its wrong, you can just provide your own opinion on what you think would improve the game.

But right now, it is YOU arguing Larien should change the game to suit YOUR tastes. It's not Larien changing the game and everyone complaining.

You are not suggesting improvements to the stealing mechanism, or enhancements to thief skills. You are saying stealing is currently too easy for you to resist, and it should be harder to help you do so. I have no problem resisting the urge, and no need to prevent some other folks from giving in to that urge. However, cheer up - if Larien doesn't meet your needs, I'm sure someone will make a "Shopkeeper from Hell Security Mod" you can use - or you can feel free to make one yourself.

So Larian and other developers should add limits to their games since people like the OP can't resist save scumming when it comes to pickpocketing and other checks? How about no? It's not up to them if you have no self control. Plus I'm confused. If pickpocketing is too easy you wouldn't need to save scum.

And you are immensely wrong. They have an obligation because they've entered a commercial transaction - they have an obligation to provide a product that is expected and desired. If they were just programming this for fun and playing it themselves or giving it out for free then they would have no obligation. I gave them a predetermined amount of money so they owe me a game based on expectations. The specifics of that game determine whether others will purchase it as well as their ability to sell other games in the future or get licensing for other games, so they have a strong incentive to make as many people happy with their product as possible.

But, as other people have pointed out, you are the one demanding that they make changes and thus have the burden of proof that it is a good idea - and you don't have anywhere near that proof because you're just hating on other people when your game experience doesn't overlap with yours. Also, I stole a little - and I stopped stealing because it was cumbersome and I had to keep talking my way out of being arrested because they caught on so often. It is not easy to steal things that you'd actually want to steal. I'm sure I could steal all sorts of 1gp items but it's way too much work for the payoff.

This would make too much sense. :P Rather than prevent people from save scumming in their single player game, they should just make things a bit more realistic. Like you said, pockets should contain only things that would fit in them. Merchants should have a chest that they would be paying close attention to, this would contain the gold from transactions and the items for sale. Still possible to steal from them but would take a bit more creativity. Save scumming would be possible for those that prefer it and the rest of us can simply not do it.

I paid for it and it has become my property so yes it is mine.

If they were going to bother to do the work it would take for the game to autosave every time you attempted a pick pocket and then check all your past saves to see if you have attempted this pick pocket before they would just put in a 1 save file mode and have it auto save on pick pocket attempt. Problem solved. They might legit even do that. As DoS does have 1 save file only modes.

That said I doubt they care in general. This is your game and your world to tell your story in how you want it to be played. Every time I fail a fight and lose should my game be over or do I get to reload a save and try again? Or do I have to pay gold to try again? What about dialogue roll checks? Can I reload to get a better outcome there? Why is failing a pick pocket any different. If I want the bloody item I'm going to take it. It's my lore. When bards sing tales of my epic thieving it wont include all the times I failed to pick pocket a guy. It will be told with how slippery these fingers are!

I'm sorry you seem to really be against others save scumming things. That the rolls that are made should be the final rolls and it should be discouraged to try for another. But my story and my game isn't yours and isn't even Larians to command once it's on my PC. Nor would they want it to be that way. Experience the game the way you want. Set the rules you need for yourself and let every single person enjoy the experience in their own way. It will never affect you. It will never be a hindrance upon your life. And it adds nothing to the overall gameplay to prevent just that.

I really do think there will be a 1 save file mode and it might auto save on all roll checks in the game preventing you from reloading. And that sounds like it's your mode friend.

It almost sounds to me like Gametester's values are in conflict with what he would actually do in game. If he really didn't want to save scum, then he wouldn't. If he did want to, then he would. But to me it sounds like he's saying he doesn't want to, but he will, since it's there.

So hes either conflicted, or recognizes that he has no self discipline, and therefore wants someone else to make the decision for him.

My suggestion is to have two games going at once. One where you play within the spirit of your idealized version of the game, and one where you give in to every exploitative impulse that comes over you.

This way you can have your cake and eat it to.

I don't understand why people are so concerned how others play their game. It's a single player game, let players play in their world as they see fit. If they want to "save scum" so be it. Heck, Arron in the druid's grove is in the perfect position to be pickpocketed repeatedly.

Why allow mods? Why allow custom characters so they can be min-max built? There's other issues with this game that needs addressing and pickpocketing, in my opinion, is not a high priority.

Because some people realize that a good game needs to be balanced instead of relying on the player to stop using something when it gets too easy/game breaking.

I understand your position but it’s not gamebreaking if you don’t pickpocket. It’s not essential to the game. I don’t plan to use it when the full version goes live because my characters wouldn’t steal.

Gamebreaking is the absurd combat mechanics such as height, backstabbing, explosives...etc because they affect gameplay you can’t avoid. You could not use the exploits but the mobs will.

But I wouldn’t care if Larian made an attempt at reducing pickpocketing. It’s just so inconsequential at this point when so many other major systems need fixing.

Its gamebreaking when you constantly do it.

To which I shall reply anything outside the parameters of Larian's final version is "gamebreaking" under your definition and thus all modding should be forbidden - afterall, any modding alters the balance of the game.

You are essentially acting like an addict, blaming the addiction on the existence of whatever you are addicted to.

If you don't like save-scrumming, don't. If you don't like stealing, don't.

If you can't play refrain from such activities when playing the game, you can choose not to play.

Do not proclaim that everyone else should be bound by your preferences and proclivities - because you sure as heck would object to being bound by someone else's.

As I said before, you are welcome to design any mod you like to help you self-enforce your game play, but that's as far as it goes.

Wrong.
Balance is where fun goes to die.

Way to twist my words, but it doesn't surprise me. There is a difference between people installing mods to alter the game and the game being badly balanced in the first place.
Its really sad to see that todays instant gratification players start to whine whenever there is actual challenge involved and they can't have everything instantly by a button press.

Is he though? His point is exactly that it doesn't affect balance at all unless YOU, the player make it so. In other words, if you don't pick pocket at all it is literally not in the game. No enemies, NPC's or anyone else in the game will pickpocket you, anyone in your party, or anyone else in the game on their own.

It only happens if you do it. It's a mechanic entirely within the players control, and therefore can be disregarded without any fear of it being used against you in the game.

That's entirely different than say, questioning the way height advantage works. Because a player could just stroll directly into the blighted village, fail some die rolls and be sniped out by the goblins on the rooftops.(or some such other encounter)

Do you see the difference? Pickpocketing, like save scumming, is a player choice, it's something only the player does, and if you choose not to then it simply doesn't exist in the game.

I think what alot of you are talking about is self discipline. Essentially you are saying, if it's there, you cannot resist the urge. That's fine, and it would be a valid argument. It would also be a more honest one than hiding behind this "balance" thing, because you for some reason fear that admitting you don't have the self control not to do it would make you appear weak.

I don't necessarily think that's the case, but let's all at least be honest here. This is an issue of self control, not balance.

Present proof that a single player game is made more enjoyable due to balance.

So true. I understand the wanting of balance in multiplayer but in single player? Totally unnecessary.

I always wonder, people that want this kind of thing which is purely a disciplinary type measure that shouldn't effect you if you just don't do it, given Larian has limited time and resources to design the game, which features would you like to see not added just to handcuff the players? Is this more important to you than, say, Dragonborn being included as a playable race?

Oh yeah "boo hoo I have no self control and keep ruining my game experience for myself by save scumming all the time even though I do not want to do that, so now I want to remove that option for every one else in this single player game".

But sure, Larian can add some kind of savescumming prevention mechanics if they want. As long as it is an option. For example one that I select when I create my character. And once it's enabled you can't disable it other than starting over with a new caracter.