Larian Studios Forums Baldur's Gate III Baldur's Gate III - Mega-threads and Guides Camping and resting.

This ^^^ But Larian stated very early on, that they would not be doing a Day/ Night cycle. In my opinion it's the best solution though, so I hope they change their mind. I try to go 4 encounters between long rest. But then what is an encounter? I only eat food during long rests. If I don't have enough for everyone, then I don't rest. But that only works for a little while. Food becomes plentiful soon after you get to the grove.


I definitely believe companions should be able to talk to us, whenever and wherever.

The prospect of restricting use of long rests doesn't appeal to me at all, and I don't return to camp after every encounter. The price of returning to camp is the break in the adventure.

That said I would be pleased to see certain enhancements to the camp, including working crafting stations (portable models, of course ) and streamlined access to all follower inventories, as the OP suggested. I'd also like to see "pick up" options added to the right-click menu for certain pieces of furniture (chairs, standing mirrors, and other not too large items that could conceivably be carried back to camp).

The original BG games allowed frequent rests--if the player chose--and I see no need for that to change. Limited camping also seems likely to break follower story lines.

That said, I really don't care if at release restricted camping is added to hard modes that I'm unlikely to play, anyway. BG3 needs to appeal to a wide range of players. I personally am finding "classic" to be about right. Sure, it's easier on replay, but I think normal difficulty should be tuned for first timers. It should allow for choosing companions based on who you'd like to spend time with, not just which classes/characters are most min-maxed. It should also be possible to land hits without "dumping" stats not used in combat to "below commoner" levels. The player should need to make an effort to understand game mechanics and to play competently, and feel that they need to pay attention to be successful, but I'd rather not see "gotcha" mechanics (like not being able to rest when you need to) added.

I think instead of restricting rest, they should design more time sensitive encounters. Like with the burning building for example, if you go there, see it's on fire, and decide to take a long rest without helping, then those "8 hours" should change your ability to rescue certain characters.

This leaves players with choice, but also makes the decision matter. Sometimes you might want to push your characters because you have a problem in front of you that will get worse if you give it time, but sometimes you might not care/it might not be worth it to engage in the danger without recovering.

This.

Instead of a character saying, "I'm tired. Let's call it a day" whenever a character has a dialogue that can be triggered, can we have a character say, instead, something like, "Hey. Can we return to camp a sec? There's something I'd like to do there" or "Hey. I'd like a word with you in private. Can we return to camp?"

Then allow whatever dialogue that can be triggered to be triggered whenever I Fast Travel to camp, as opposed to End Day.

Example: Gale's Go to Hell dialogue is ready to be triggered. Gale isn't even in my party while I'm going through the Dank Crypt. The game has Astarion, who is in my party, say, "I'd better see a bedroll in my immediate future." Instead, why not have Astarion say, "Hey. Can we take a break and head to camp a sec. There's something I want to do." You Fast Travel to camp and Gale has an exclamation mark over his head. Though Astarion said he wanted to go to camp, it was only because Gale had something to say. Astarion could have wanted to go to camp for any personal reason he doesn't want to share. Whatever. That's not important. The main point is that the characters aren't always tired and needing to End Day just because they have something they want to say. Instead, they just want to head to camp for a bit for one reason or another.

Same as the other threat ...
You allready said this multiple times in other threats, creating another one dont make it good idea. :-/

So you think it's not a good idea?

I decided to put these in their own separate threads because on the other thread people are focusing too much in one thing I said instead of on each item. This one is swallowed up by all the fighting over whether there is urgency in the narrative.

I really dont see any difference from the other threat:
https://forums.larian.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=765998&#Post765998

There you want to untie dialogues from end of the day ...
And here you want dialogues to happened everytime we get to camp ...

That is basicly the same.

First of all, while we have to appreciate what has been given us by Larian so far, I believe is also important to talk about mistakes, after all, we, players and Larian both want to play/create the best RPG game out there.


SO, the resting system. Its might actually be a tricky one, making it work properly. in my opinion, might actually need some map changes, in order to acomodate this essencialy D&D RULE.

The way that it is right now is just lazy. being able to constantly spamm it, and worse, HAVING to do it in the most non immsersive ways possible is not fun.

For example, if you want to kill the goblins, all of them, its extremely difficult to kill them all without long resting.

So, what you do, simply go to camp and get back to the dungeon, in an instant, you get out a dungeon full of globlins, just to sleep and get in without any alarm.

Or maybe before the hag fight, going to camp from the dungeon just to rest and get my spellslots felt like a non immsersive chore.

Some might say, ''git gut'' ''learn to 'use your spells slots in a more eficient way'', "resting is an option".

What I get from this is "dont use your fun spells, be in a fight for +5 minutes bcz of less spell damage means more attacks which means more miss (sacred flame im talking to you), which means more turns (without abusing spells) which means in such long fights.


The system, as it is, also leads to balancing issues in fights. If the game in a certain moment is trying to caught you by suprise in a boss fight, but you furtionately rested not long ago, but was, nonetheless, caught by suprise, how would that scale, will the npc be programmed to fight a half slotted party, and if it is, would it be too easy for a full slotted party? (which was also caught by surprise).


My sugestion: in ALL nonefriendly dungeons, the player cant go to camp. We should have a system that allow us to rest inside the dungeon once, using the tools provided, or using the surrounding, like beds. This would mean the dungeon itself could be designed for a full slotted party of a specific level. Considering the fact that they are going to rest only once.

We need pc to actually interact with the enviroenment, with skills checks to determine if they are going to find the right tools to set some improvise camp up.

Most of the party dialogue should be available in the dungeon, and there could be some unique dialogue depending on the place you are resting.

While resting, there will be a chance to be attacked by the nonefriendly npc that rules said dungeon, or any other form of interaction with the party might occur, like some unique quest you might stumble to while spending the night there. Rangers and such could be provided with scout mecanisms to forsee fights for example, and other unique supporting spells other classes could use, like light, darkvision and also traps.


I hope Larian goes the extra mile with this and make the resting system better. This will probably be the best game we get for 10y to come.

Now think about how many dialogues you will need remove from the camp to somewhere else. There are no problems with the rest system, I believe there are problems with the dialog system for which you need to rest.
Also
> if you want to kill the goblins, all of them, its extremely difficult to kill them all without long resting

This is not difficult at all if you use food and a short rest. We can also have one fight in the camp, if you go with goblins. This is just the case when you have not rested, and still this is not impossible fight. You should also explain "dungeon" in more detail. Goblin camp? This is an open location. The Underdark? No. Conditionally we have two dungeons in my understanding:

1. Owlbear Cave
2. Hag's Tea House

Idk about Owlbear. but I think we can't rest in Hag's Tea House. So maybe there's a difference.

You can rest in the Hag's House, just not in the plant trap maze. Not that it matters, because if you're smart, you backstab Ethel out of combat with one character, and then proceed to do the same with the other 3 characters for 4 separate surprise attacks that give you 2 free starting turns per character, or 8 total actions before Ethel can react. If you can't kill Ethel with 8 total actions, you either went in severely underleveled, or you are just playing completely suboptimal builds. Killing Ethel clears her entire house of the curse and deactivates the plant traps. Obviously before visiting Ethel, you want to kill the Redcaps outside; just get on a high ground mound and since their mobility is bad, you can get several surprise attacks in from high ground and just burn down each redcap one by one as they reach you.

Either way, the goblin camp is not hard. Outside, you can first take out with a single 100% crit on the sleeping mobs up top as sleeping mobs are automatically crit, so a single Lazael auto one shots them, and then you take out the 2 bugbears easily without aggroing the camp.

You then go and save, poison the cauldron, pass the dialogue check so you don't drink the poison with them, it wipes out half their camp and leaves the other remaining Goblins at like 6-7 health, and then you climb up to the stone bridge above, surprise attack the mage up top and kill him, and simply snipe down the remaining force as none of them can reach you besides the ogre throwing javelins at you, so you focus him first.

Inside, you tell the hag whatever dialogue you want, follow her to her room, kill her in private with a single surprise attack in the first turn before she calls help (just do a Lazael Frightening Strike from backstab stealth, or select the dialogue where you tell her you are killing her and if you roll initiative well, you go before her).

You then go talk to Razglin, pass the dialogue check to sabotage him (or don't talk to him and save him for last), go to Minthara and easily kill her alone with the 2 other goblins; if you kill the archer first, nobody rings the drums for help. Then you go back to the central room and get up the ladders to the roof and start sniping the goblins from high ground; they'll miss most crap on you and die trivially. Make sure to talk to Spike with Wyll and kill him alone with the other goblin easily.

All in all, that route lets you go rescue Halsin, bring him to Razglin's chamber and fight at most like 10-12 goblins, and they're separated by a wall and door if you know how to use LOS to your advantage hiding by Minthara's room, let the melee trickle to you and you kill them easily before Razglin's room; when fighting Razglin himself, bumrush him to kill him asap as it removes the aura of leadership off his allies; clean up the rest easy.

By far the hardest fight in the game is Bulette if you don't cheese him, followed by Githyanki patrol.

Man I hate these fights where standing somewhere high means you can just shoot everyone down without ever being at risk of being attacked.

The entire Goblin fortress, Minthara, the entire Zhentarim hideout...

Insta kills by shoving into a pit or river comes close second. The environment overrides all class abilities and undermines clever resource management.

There's so much cheese! The resting cheese is just more cheese on top. I want it all gone.

Yeah!

It's great that you all know this, but people won't know it at the first playthrough, so many of these fights will be difficult for them. However, I do not consider a fight with a goblins to be such, they just have little HP. Also, about "hag's dungeon" I meant the underground part, because it is closed. That's the difference. By going there, you "load" another area. And don't forget about spider, first time it was a very difficult fight for me.

I find resting to be always a problematic mechanic in cRPGs (perhaps, that's I actually welcomed that it barely exists in PoE2).

I don't think it can work well without fundamentally altering game's structure. The best implimentation I have seen so far was, I think, Pillars of Eternity1 - a set amount of camp supplies meant devs would know with how many "rests" you would come and could design accordingly - and give you extra supplies if a dungeon was longer. That way they could pace resting, and endurance mechanic meant that depleting HP gave a clear indication when we will be resting, and , at least in my case, it didn't trigger my spell hoarding habit. That is still not without fault, as nothing stops players from overusing rest and trekking back to town for more supplies, nor from barely using their skills. It doesn't quite prohibit unfun play, but at least encourages fun play and gives indications on how to achieve it.

Making resting not available in some ways can backfire - for example I really didn't enjoy Kingmaker for that reason (among many many others). You have to manually decide on how many rests you will carry at any time - amd the game doesn't provide information on which we could make an informed decision. Most of the time supplies are useless, but everyonce in a while one will suffer without a decent supply - but one cannot know that without a foreknowledge making the whole thing frustrating.

I think resting works better in a procedural setting - Darkest Dungeon does it well. When one will misjuidge their rest it might result in a failed run, but it won't halt players progress as such.

For a more handcrafted experience like BG3, I think resting also needs to be to some extend handcrafted. And interesting idea might be (though not fit for BG3) a bonfire system, like in Dark Souls - having resting checkpoints set and having to defeat enemies before reaching the next one (of course respawn is mandatory, as otherwise nothing stop players from cheesing by backtracking, making it not an ideal fit for a game interested in characters and story). I think the best we can hope for is some kind of pacing mechanism. Again, PoE1 I think is good example - encouraging certain pacing, and disencouraging cheese, without prohibiting it. I think Solasta has set resting points, which somewhat serves the same point, but I expect it, again, doesn't prohibit backtracking and cheese (didn't play it, so I can't comment).

In BG3 resting will never be really good, I don't think, as it is a mechanic that runs counter to the world design. Some form of limitation might be nice, but in my personal playthrough I felt I rest rarely, as with backstab and hight advantage spells are mostly an unnecessary bonus, and there were plenty of items to provide healing.

Since the game *is* D&D 5e, you can't really fight against the Long Rests. More problems will arise if you try to ignore the rule.

They need to embrace the resting rules, and make them the best they can be. There's a lot of good stuff there too! Especially if they let us camp on the road in the spirit of D&D.


- Finding a safe looking spot and camping in the Underdark after a tough day can be really, really immersive

- Companion talks get more scenes that are more immersive and atmospheric

- Higher risk / higher reward. Personally I love the feeling of actually being in trouble and scraping my inventory for anything that will help me get out of it.

- Wizards play differently and require more planning for the day than other classes, which is very fitting for Wizards

- Tiny Hut and Magnificent Mansion would be absolutely incredible in BG3 for resting in dangerous areas. You could even have cool scripted scenes waking up inside a Tiny Hut with a band of ogres waiting outside and having to devise a plan how to fight them after letting the force field down. High level Wizards with Mansion (something like Raphael's?) would be incredibly useful for the party.

Another post about resting. Lol. Larian has to do something about it. There are just too many of us saying it's broken.

More like this should of been posted in the previous thread and this one should be merged. Also forum goes through phases, not to long ago it was about gods.

Its not about phases ...
One new person creates an account to complain about something, dont even care enough to see if there isnt simmilar topic allready ... create new one ... and others will smell it at range of few kilometers, like sharks ...
Then it may create ilusion of "big isue" unless you notice, its still the same people repeating still the same sentences. :-/

Ragnarock.The entire point of this forum is so that people can come out here and tell Larian what they would like Larian to change about the game. It may sound like complaining, but it is all about telling Larian what they think isn't working. When you say things like this, you are discouraging people from doing what they are supposed to be doing.

Please stop defending the game and making it seem like people are just being vicious jerks because they don't like something about the game. How else do you think people are going to take it when you say we're like sharks.