Originally Posted by Frumpkis
Letting the player override NPC orientation would cripple the game writer's ability to develop the NPC stories and backgrounds before they're romanced.

For example, we learn about Judy's orientation in CP2077 through the story of what happens to her friend and presumed lover Evelyn. That whole side campaign is an organic part of the main plot line. Judy is the most developed NPC in that game, but there is one sequence with Kerry during the Silverhand flashbacks where you see him making out with another guy backstage after a concert, so you don't have to guess what his orientation is. Things like this help establish who the characters are, and I think allowing the player to just flip a "bi" switch if you want to romance them works against character development.

Anyway, it's a fun discussion but all of this is somewhat moot for BG3, because Larian obviously isn't going that deep into developing this side of the companions.

When I say split the difference I mean still do that but just let the player flip a switch in the options which lets them still romance characters where the story doesn't really support it. Just add the bare minimum of voice lines so the player doesn't get misgendered. It's not a perfect solution for anyone but as a compromise neither side has to give up much. If you don't want character's backgrounds to be undermined don't enable the option and everything is exactly as you want. If you want everyone to be player-sexual then you get that but some of the stories won't make quite as much sense as they should, which is almost what you were asking for in the first place.

Originally Posted by vometia
I dunno. If someone is bi, make them bi; but I think that being a sort of default for everybody (with or without coercion!) doesn't really appeal to me even if it does result in fewer "options"! IMHO it makes characters less individual and more generic; and I think I'm too used to characters in TV programmes often ending up being "whatever the script writers want at the time"-sexual which feels a bit cheap, though tbh that's just a subset of characters undergoing complete personality changes, something soaps in particular are especially guilty of doing. Running with CP77 as an example, there's a significant amount of pressure to make Judy "bi" because Panam isn't enough choice for some players, and I hope CDPR doesn't cave in a future patch as Bioware reportedly did with Jack before ME2's release, who was apparently supposed to be bi or lesbian but a decision came from on high that some media outlets might object so it was better to cave in advance, which effectively resulted in no female/female LIs (based on the assertion that Liara doesn't count as Asari are monogendered; still haven't made my mind up whether or not I agree with that, but y'know).

I guess the question I have about this is why do you hope CDPR don't cave? If it's made explicit she isn't bi and the male/female Judy romance is non-canon would it still bother you players are able to access it? For myself it's the Panam relationship I'm locked out of and I have a suspicion the only relationship they'll change is Judy's. That change would never affect me but if they were to shift Kerry's relationship I'd never really notice his character made less sense if the decision were left in the players hands. But it would be nice for me if Panam got a meta dialogue pick where it says "She's going to reject you because she's straight. Do you want to break the narrative slightly to make Panam bi?" that only appeared if I selected the appropriate option in a menu.

Last edited by Rack; 14/03/21 03:29 PM.