old hand
Joined: Oct 2020
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The problem with "different introductions" is Act 1. You can't skip part of the narrative because you want a special start for a character that could be the PC. Party members sure, but they'd have to skip all of Act 1 to start the Player in Baldur's Gate, and who knows, maybe they'd have to skip more than that, if we're not going straight to the city for Act 2. Also, as I said previously, even if Tav had a story, it would be the same one for every Tav, just as all of the Origin characters are. That's what I meant by "generic" story. I tend to look at the main story as Tav's story, with Origin characters getting it if there is no Tav, which is a distinct possibility. A lot of people love the Witcher series after all, and may find playing one of those predefined characters enticing.
Using a mechanic, broken or otherwise, and ignoring a mechanic are exactly what player agency is. Let's look at resting: It's been an issue since release, despite the fact that one can simply not rest after every battle. It's what I did, I took long rests, when I remembered them at all, at story beats, instead of spending a lot of time on the forums worrying about what Joe Casual might be doing in their game. As far as implementation is concerned, is it broken, or is it "but someone else might be able to do something"? That's not facetious either, I haven't tried to do any pickpocketing, so I have no idea. I've seen a lot of "barrelmancy" videos on YouTube, but if you could see my actual gameplay footage, you wouldn't find any of it. I wasn't aware that it was a problem until I came to the forums. Why? That pesky player agency, it never occurred to me that I should be packing around 100s of barrels to make major fights easy, and so, I never did it.
You see, you read my comments and go "but that's broken" instead of the context of what was actually meant, and explained: Player agency isn't a bad thing. If, as is to be surmised from reading someone complain about it, a mechanic is an issue, then players have a choice to use it, or not, or to use it where it makes sense. For example, a powerful mage is standing next to an exploding barrel, or is forced to move by one during their turn, and so, you blow them up, or use a dipped arrow on a spider web, to drop the spider to the ground. So what's the real issue? "But someone can do something easier than what I did it" is a usual suspect, and I wouldn't be surprised to find that statement mixed in amongst all the complaints. "But the economy", in a SP game, really? Yes, there's a MP aspect, and as I stated previously, there need to be toggles for some stuff that apply to MP. But in the SP environment, it just doesn't matter at all, unless you read the forums. Why is that?
I played AC 4, Black Flag, and thought, since I was way late to the party, I could catch up on their richest pirate leader board, until I saw some YouTube videos about how players were getting there using Cheat Engine. I could have followed suit, but I chose to just continue playing normally, and put the thought of getting into a high position, on PC, out of my head. Someone that sees Pickpocketing as a problem is going to have a stroke when they see what some players will do with Cheat Engine. I mean, there's a tutorial video on YouTube that teaches players how to max out all of their stats in Pillars of Eternity, do you believe players won't be trying that for their SP characters, or worse, for their MP characters. Neverwinter Nights had an "Enforce Legal Characters" toggle for servers, and something like that may be required here as well, for MP. What they may do in SP doesn't bother me in the least.
Don't you have the feeling we're turning in circles here ? The purpose of the message you quoted 2 pages ago was there exactly to say that they did the exact same thing in BG3 than in DoS : Act 1 (and maybe 2) that HAS to be the same for every companions and the main character is a problem "by Larian's design". That's only a consequence of an Origin / Custom character system that has not be improved at all. Thanks for the definition of players agency. As you confirmed, it does not mean that things have to be broken to allow players more "agency". Does it mean that players that don't like doing broken things and/or that don't like "glitching the game" (to quote Swen in the video Ragnarok posted) have LESS players agency in BG3 ? Yes, and that's exactly my point. Wierd things that makes the game even more a joke or less players agency including basic RPG mechanics like stealing or stealth and cool fresh ideas like a coherent dipping or throwing (things or ennemies) mechanic. Except that they don't. As I said, I haven't tried any pickpocketing, but if I can attempt to pickpocket w/out using whatever the glitch or exploit is, then it's not forcing me into less agency. In fact, the only way an exploit can "force" a player into less agency" is if they feel like they have to abuse it, because it's there. If I can play the game w/out choosing to take a long rest after every battle, which I can, then it's not affecting my agency. If you mean "but someone else can abuse it", yes, they can. In a SP environment, that's not affecting my agency, or my gameplay at all. Toggles for these kinds of things in MP is a solution to this issue in MP, which is the only place it will be an issue. Other than that, it's a whole lot of worrying about what Joe Casual might do. Unless, of course, you're stating that if it's available, you'll be abusing it? I'm not logging into any SP game to be competitive with any other players. So whether they're using a "broken" rest mechanic or pickpocketing mechanic in their SP environment has 0 (zero) repercussions for me. It has 0 impact if they accomplish similar things with Cheat Engine, or mods. If they're exploiting in a full time MP game, especially one with PvP, it's an issue. Other than that, it's simply none of my business. Odd that you mention stealing here, since I have stolen a few items, but didn't have to exploit anything to do it, one time was even on accident. How is it supposed to work if it's not "don't be seen, and grab something off the table"? Maybe I didn't notice a problem because I didn't get caught? On another note, what generic story line do you want to be pigeonholed into that will cover every possible race/class that Tav can be? That's every playable race and class, btw. Is it ideal? Not really, but when I look at the game as Tav's story, and the party members as NPCs, it's fine with me. It's not like I've never played any games where NPC party members had their own quest lines, and some of those games predate Larian, let alone DoS. I mean, they run back to BG and BG 2, and even the first Mass Effect had little things tied to specific squad members. The Geth data for Tali, and Wrex's family armor, for example. So party members having story quests doesn't bother me a bit, I've come to expect that they'll have something that serves to flesh them out as characters, instead of sprites on the screen to do damage, or tank, or heal the PC.
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