Originally Posted by LordRhaegar
Originally Posted by robertthebard
Yeah, there's lots of "bs" here, but I think you're going to be surprised where I find it lies. Looking at page one of this particular forum, just before clicking in to this topic, and there aren't even 3 topics specifically aimed at resting on the first page. So, there's "BS" number one where "every third thread" is concerned, yes?
That was clearly hyperbole, but there are in fact exactly 3 threads just on this topic on the first page right now.


Originally Posted by robertthebard
Here's another example of BS: "Well, we just find a way to pressure them into taking those long rests", despite the fact that they may not have enough rest points to actually do that, right? I mean, that's the premise of your thread, to artificially limit LRs, but your solution to this very real issue is to force more LRs. Some more BS: "you're not going to get every sequence". So now, instead of replying to what was actually said, you're making stuff up, aka "strawman", so you can refute it.
Stop putting things in my mouth, and perhaps look up the meaning of words such as "strawman" in the dictionary before you start throwing them around. I said I was perfectly happy with no pressure to rest -and- with people missing storylines.
But if you want to make sure people don't miss out on those rests - it's not that complicated. There are only a handful of dream sequences + Astarion biting scene. Players will definitely take those handful of rests before finishing the goblin camp anyway. You don't really have to pressure them at all, just make triggering of the scenes less conditional and more consistent on those rests. You also have the option of encouraging the long rest through penalties I mentioned, in which case, of course, you make sure that all the combats and non-combat adventuring that the character has to do in order to get to a place where his rest is "required", earn them enough points to do so.

But crucially here, I actually missed no dream sequences due to infrequent resting, because they are so few, and most of the content I got "locked out" of was companion-related cut-scenes and relationship development. This is also the part that's bugging me the most with your whole bullshit rant - you just persistently keep ignoring my proposition that none of the other companion interactions have to be camp interactions. They should not be tied to resting in any way, shape, or form. There, your "problem" solved.



Seems like I knew exactly what it meant.

Quote
The straw man is a fallacy in which an opponent's argument is overstated or misrepresented in order to be more easily attacked or refuted

You say "pressure them to take a long rest", I add "despite the fact that they may not have enough rest points", but I'm "putting things in your mouth"? Sorry, did you realize that this was a hole in your "final solution", and you were just too embarrassed to admit it? The tadpole elements are all based on dreams, short rests don't, as of now, trigger those. So someone that's not doing absolutely everything may not accumulate those 100 rest points your system requires to trigger them, thus cutting them out of character development. This doesn't have anything to do with "getting every camp scenario", despite your strawman from earlier in the thread.

Originally Posted by robertthebard
I don't think there's a problem with the rest system to begin with
Yeah, shows how much your opinion on the matter should be taken seriously.

Then there's this. Since you've already indicated that your problem with the current rest system is that it can be spammed, that tells me how much your opinion on the matter should be considered: Not at all. How Joe Casual chooses to play the game is, quite frankly, none of your business, unless they're playing in your MP instance of the game. In a SP environment, it has no bearing on what you're doing. You do want to control how they play, however. I've said this in another thread on the matter, but if I didn't read the forums, I wouldn't know there's an issue with the rest system, which tells me that there isn't one. Obvious flaws/bugs/exploits don't require reading the forums to know about them, they can be encountered naturally by playing the game. I didn't eat food to heal up in combat, but that "issue" was "fixed". Another thing that I wouldn't know about because I didn't try to do it, except that I read about it on the forums. I missed a lot of character development because I didn't take enough LRs to get it. That is a bigger issue than "someone might rest too much for my liking in the SP game that they also bought".

You see, I don't know if tadpole dreams are tied to specific story beats, or to a certain number of LRs, because I didn't get all of them. That needs to be fixed. I missed out on a lot of comp dialog, because I didn't take enough LRs. Nowhere does this imply that I should get them all, in spite of what your strawman tries to imply, but I should have gotten more than I did. That needs to be fixed. How much Joe Casual is resting in their SP campaign? None of my business, as it doesn't affect what is or isn't happening in my SP campaign. What I do need to get are the crucial elements to both comp and personal stories. Your "final solution" does nothing to address my problem with LRs, in that if I don't take enough of them, I'll be missing out on those elements, and if I'm not doing everything there is to do in Act 1, I won't accumulate enough "rest points" to get them, and so, your "final solution" actually makes the game worse, instead of "fixing" anything except your need to control what another player may be doing in their SP campaign.

TL;DR? Your little system makes the problems that I'm having with the rest system worse, instead of addressing them, and therefore brings nothing of value to the conversation. I already don't "abuse" the LR system, so making it harder to abuse doesn't do anything for me but make getting the things I should be able to get harder to get. So, from where I'm sitting, it's not even a band-aid, let alone a "final solution"...