Thank you
Originally Posted by Niara
Originally Posted by WebSpyder
Where are you getting this extra +2 to hit from? There aren't separate to hit and damage bonuses in 5e. With a 14 DEX and a 12 STR she has either +1 to hit and damage with non finesse weapons or +2 to hit and damage with ranged and finesse weapons. 5% difference between the two. That's it. I haven't the first clue where you're getting +4 with simple weapons from. I will add though that I 100% agree she should just have elf weapon training over the silly cantrip. That's just a poor character choice.

I suspect they are referring to total attack/damage bonus:

With the starting stats of 14Str and 10Dex;

Attacking with a ranged weapon (with which you are proficient) using Dex when you have 10 Dex, at level one (PB of +2), is a +2 to hit, +0 to your rolled damage.
Attacking with a melee weapon using Str when you have 14 Str, at level one (PB of +2), is a +4 to hit, +2 to your rolled damage.

They changed her to having 14Dex and 8Str, but didn't change her starting load-out, so, still no ranged weapon, and no finesse weapon;

Attacking with a ranged weapon (with which you are proficient) using Dex when you have 14 Dex, at level one (PB of +2), is a +4 to hit, +2 to your rolled damage.
Attacking with a melee weapon using Str when you have 8 Str, at level one (PB of +2), is a +1 to hit, -1 to your rolled damage.

They've changed her again now, giving her 14Dex and 12Str, but still haven't changed her starting equipment, so now her start-up is:

Attacking with a ranged weapon (with which you are proficient) using Dex when you have 14 Dex, at level one (PB of +2), is a +4 to hit, +2 to your rolled damage.
Attacking with a melee weapon using Str when you have 12 Str, at level one (PB of +2), is a +3 to hit, +1 to your rolled damage.


Precisely. Thank you. You have to take into account proficiency modifier in the to-hit roll. Currently Shadowheart is dex based, but doesn't have proficiency with any finesse melee weapons except daggers. So if you give her a dagger she has 1d20+4 to hit, and 1d4+2 damage. Damage spread of 3-7, average 5. If you give her a str based d6 weapon she has 1d20+3 to hit, and 1d6+1 damage. Damage spread 2-7, average 5 If you give her a shortsword, which is a 1d6 like the simple weapons that she is proficient with, she gets 1d20+2 to hit, and 1d6+2 damage. Damage spread 3-9, average 6. Her damage spread is higher for a d6 finesse weapon, much like a ranged weapon, however, she has a 10% less chance to hit than with a dagger.

If you use her starting equipment, you have less chance to hit than with a dagger, AND your minimum damage is lower. Clearly dagger is better, but they have not given her a dagger. Both minimum and maximum damage is better with a finesse d6 weapon, but it's even lower chance to hit, because she's not proficient. If you give her a rapier, you have the same to hit modifier, +2, but suddenly it is 1d8+2 damage, damage spread 3-10, average 7. Clearly rapiers do the best damage for finesse melee, but that shouldn't be a surprise to anyone. But they mean for her to use 1d6 weapons, but have given her stats where they are less effective than a dagger. Give her elf weapon training, so she gets shortsword proficiency.


Damn... I miss my Rogue/fighter shieldmaster multiclass build now... half-plate, shield, shortsword, and shieldmaster feat! <3

Last edited by Harudus; 20/01/22 02:26 PM.