It's good to know that my effort paid off . Anyhow, piggybacking on a popular IP in order to prop yourself (or your company) up should be some sort of crime.
Guys, I'm sorry you feel that way and I used to as well, but after spending a lot of time playing the game and also reading a lot in r/dndnext over the last couple of years I've realised that D&D has a lot of imperfections. There's no point slavishly recreating it RAW. Even the developers have regrets and are doing surveys to see what people would like changed in 5.5E – which at this rate will come out just after BG3. So even if BG3 was a perfect adaptation, it would only be rules-accurate for a year at most. WotC is even deprecating short rests, based on the most recent books where all the racial short rest recharge features have been changed or removed.
Guys, I'm sorry you feel that way and I used to as well, but after spending a lot of time playing the game and also reading a lot in r/dndnext over the last couple of years I've realised that D&D has a lot of imperfections. There's no point slavishly recreating it RAW. Even the developers have regrets and are doing surveys to see what people would like changed in 5.5E – which at this rate will come out just after BG3. So even if BG3 was a perfect adaptation, it would only be rules-accurate for a year at most. WotC is even deprecating short rests, based on the most recent books where all the racial short rest recharge features have been changed or removed.
The core of D&D is fine and is actually still great for a general RPG and still leaves them open for their own twists on some things and presentation. You are making excuses.
This game isn't even trying to get the core right. It is a Larian generic RPG with a THIN D&D whitewash. And their marketing doesn't reveal that fact so it is deception.
Patherfinder Kingmaker is a game that takes the rulesets it is based on as the core mechanics, and builds around them with their own interpretation and presentation around that core the right way. And no I'm not wanting this to use old 3.5, just showing how a game uses the core rules set it is based one as a backbone done right.
kind of wonder if people had this same feeling with Star Wars Knights of the Old Republic II: The Sith Lords when Obsidian did the sequel instead of bioware, same could be applied to Neverwinter knights 2.
NwN2 was my baby for a long time, it wasn't nwn1, I didn't cry myself to sleep cause it was different. But liked it all the same for what it was and being part of the same world, forgotten realms (neverwinter). i did die inside when nwn online came out though.
@prop85
You obviously don't agree with me on probably any level, so here:
its a hour long, watch it or don't, question would be what would you do then.
Guys, I'm sorry you feel that way and I used to as well, but after spending a lot of time playing the game and also reading a lot in r/dndnext over the last couple of years I've realised that D&D has a lot of imperfections. There's no point slavishly recreating it RAW. Even the developers have regrets and are doing surveys to see what people would like changed in 5.5E – which at this rate will come out just after BG3. So even if BG3 was a perfect adaptation, it would only be rules-accurate for a year at most. WotC is even deprecating short rests, based on the most recent books where all the racial short rest recharge features have been changed or removed.
Funnily enough, Swen seems to be in complete agreement with you. Throw everything DnD that is not an immature fratboy fun out of the window, make DOS 3, slap a "DnD!!!!111" sticker on it, sell it to unsuspecting audience (preferably through Steam, as it has an almost non-existent refund policy) and count the money!
He has a good business head on his shoulders, that Swen, I give him that.
Guys, I'm sorry you feel that way and I used to as well, but after spending a lot of time playing the game and also reading a lot in r/dndnext over the last couple of years I've realised that D&D has a lot of imperfections. There's no point slavishly recreating it RAW. Even the developers have regrets and are doing surveys to see what people would like changed in 5.5E – which at this rate will come out just after BG3. So even if BG3 was a perfect adaptation, it would only be rules-accurate for a year at most. WotC is even deprecating short rests, based on the most recent books where all the racial short rest recharge features have been changed or removed.
Yeah...no. This "defense" is the weakest of weaksauce; there were plenty of good to great D&D games from the early 90s up until the mid 2000s. If the task of adapting the latest iteration of D&D (not to mention the Forgotten frickin' Realms!) was too challenging or annoying for Larian, they shouldn't have stepped up to the plate.
I’m not going to bother debating whether those earlier games were truly close adaptations of the rules of the time. But just out of curiosity, what did you think of Descent into Avernus? The module that serves as a prequel to this game. Is Wizards of the Coast doing the Forgotten Realms justice?
Guys, I'm sorry you feel that way and I used to as well, but after spending a lot of time playing the game and also reading a lot in r/dndnext over the last couple of years I've realised that D&D has a lot of imperfections. There's no point slavishly recreating it RAW. Even the developers have regrets and are doing surveys to see what people would like changed in 5.5E – which at this rate will come out just after BG3. So even if BG3 was a perfect adaptation, it would only be rules-accurate for a year at most. WotC is even deprecating short rests, based on the most recent books where all the racial short rest recharge features have been changed or removed.
It's not just the RAW that I have a problem with. You can homebrew a lot of things in a way that still keeps things more or less balanced. Imagine what will happen if they add multiclassing. The game is already incredibly easy because exploits are features, and some fundamental mechanics are straight up broken.
If we get to high levels, a Sorcerer/Fighter/Thief will be unstoppable. 4+ Fireballs a turn depending on how you set it up. That's all from the changes to Quickened Spell, extra bonus actions, and Haste.
They could have solved the problems with the reaction system long ago if they mixed RTWP pause with their Turn Based system. You could even implement the Diviner Wizard's Portent RAW that way. It just needs a little bit slower animations. Instead we got toggles, meaning we might end up Counterspelling cantrips later.
Time is nonexistent.
Sneak Attack should have been a toggle, Rogues can apply it on any turn once. Opportunity Attacks, Commander's Strike from Battlemaster all could make great use of it.
Gale's and Astarion's introductions are still horrendous. Insulting and assaulting my character, then demanding that we join forces? And Gale still has the True Resurrection scroll, which can fix all of his problems, or Astarion's.
The dream rape is still in. You dare recognize it as the most obvious honeytrap in the world? Nah, you WILL enjoy it, and your party members will humiliate you as well.
My friends and I spent days doing nothing but giving feedback with the help of one of Larian's discord moderators. Result was: no communication, feedback ignored. During one of their Panels, when they changed (not removed) high ground advantage, Swen told us "it's all our fault". Even if he didn't mean anything malicious about it, it hints at how they design things.
And the list goes on...
I think I have every right to feel this way. I paid 60 bucks for this. An early access title where they wanted to "collect feedback". In reality, it was just for the funds and nothing more.
kind of wonder if people had this same feeling with Star Wars Knights of the Old Republic II: The Sith Lords when Obsidian did the sequel instead of bioware, same could be applied to Neverwinter knights 2.
NwN2 was my baby for a long time, it wasn't nwn1, I didn't cry myself to sleep cause it was different. But liked it all the same for what it was and being part of the same world, forgotten realms (neverwinter). i did die inside when nwn online came out though.
KOTOR2 is still very much a sequel though, and not only because it runs on the same engine. While Obsidian subverted a lot of SW tropes, it is still building using blocks set up by Bioware. I was someone who didn't enjoy KOTOR2 when I first played it, but I never heard it argued that it isn't a proper sequel.
NWN is a better example. For me NWN one the weakest cRPG I played, and probably still is, so NWN2 was NWN1 done properly. But I can imagine someone who loved NWN1 tool-box design to be disappointed with a more conventional direction NWN2 took.
Damn, I should replay NWN2 at some point. It's in this sweet spot that it's not memorable enough, so I can recall all that is has to offer, but it's done well enough, so it's always enjoyable to return to.
Then they should have just created their own fantasy RPG.
If they are going to take the D&D IP, make it a D&D game.
I totally concur but we’re beyond that now and just have to accept Larian’s idiosyncratic take on BG or simply don’t play it.
It’s clear to me that for every reversion to a more D&D implementation they also add in some other homebrew interpretation elsewhere, like they can’t help themselves. I feel there’s some serious fingers-in-the-ears cognitive dissonance going on, the way that communication is simply a series of infrequent announcements and some of the more heavily critiqued or requested aspects are seemingly ignored. The fact that it is primarily designed around co-op play is beyond me, given the knock on effect that is having and the majority will be single players.
Then they should have just created their own fantasy RPG.
If they are going to take the D&D IP, make it a D&D game.
I totally concur but we’re beyond that now and just have to accept Larian’s idiosyncratic take on BG or simply don’t play it.
It’s clear to me that for every reversion to a more D&D implementation they also add in some other homebrew interpretation elsewhere, like they can’t help themselves. I feel there’s some serious fingers-in-the-ears cognitive dissonance going on, the way that communication is simply a series of infrequent announcements and some of the more heavily critiqued or requested aspects are seemingly ignored. The fact that it is primarily designed around co-op play is beyond me, given the knock on effect that is having and the majority will be single players.
When push comes to shove, they will add more Shove.
It's pretty clear at this point the game isn't for you. There is no point to waste time here whining about it. Just move on to other games closer to your tastes
I totally concur but we’re beyond that now and just have to accept Larian’s idiosyncratic take on BG or simply don’t play it.
Well there is more than that. Even though not likely to happen people can demand refunds. Enough of that occurs they will see a problem. You can write reviews to make sure others aren't roped into this fraud. Right now somehow this game is mostly positive on stream despite the deception. You can file complaints with the BBB in the U.S. and whatever org there is in France. I've begun that process with the BBB. Still haven't found the relevant org or authority in France. You can write to WoTC, to state you don't want Larian to get to use the IP again. etc, etc.
And I'm leaning to the last part of what I quoted from you as well. Just not playing it, which will affect their steam data.
I totally concur but we’re beyond that now and just have to accept Larian’s idiosyncratic take on BG or simply don’t play it.
What does accepting entail though. Giving up on a reasonably well designed combat? Functional UI?
I knew little about 5e when I first played BG3 and complains I had then are the same I have now (aside from some that’s been addressed, like high ground). I do hope balancing is simply not done at the moment, and that Larian keeps things as they are for shits and giggles, to compensate for subdued early level DND experience.
. Anyhow, piggybacking on a popular IP in order to prop yourself (or your company) up should be some sort of crime.
