Larian Studios Forums Baldur's Gate III Baldur's Gate III - General Baldur's Gate 3 vs Solasta comparison

Playing Solasta and BG3 back to back you get a good feel on what kind of <developers> did the game.

More mature, planned out, knowledgeable on RPGs-D&D, passionate, our audience are RPG lovers, experienced and forward thinking for Solasta...
More silly , flashy young gun pretty graphics, lets try this and that, our audience is EVERYONE, copy/paste our previous DOS2 work for annoying stuff, kind of all over the place (literally all over the world now...)developer for BG3.

My god if Solasta had half the budget of BG3...wed have a legendary game.
Larian, hire these guys and let them run the show lol.

Multiplayer beta this weekend sounds fun. I thought the official campaigns wouldn't support it, but it looks like they managed to get it working. It's worth noting that they've mentioned that only the host needs to have the relevant DLC for all players to gain access to the DLC classes and subclasses too.

Next campaign sounds like they've taken a lot of feedback in regards to the story, so let's see how they've improved. They are streaming multiplayer right now at least.

EDIT: Ah, they added incantations to spellcasting.

I am an RPG lover (counting Planescape: Torment, BG 1 and 2, NWN2 amongst my all-time favorites), and Solasta was a letdown for me, personally. It mostly felt dull and uninspired, and calling it "mature" with its constant failing attempts at witty writing and its bumbling plot is honestly a bit too generous.

I do have my gripes against certain elements of BG3 (such as certain mechanics and rules either just missing or not working as they should), but judging the entire game and how its plot and interactions would end up working by the little piece we have now is kinda pointless? And as far as combat goes, BG3 leaves Solasta in the dust by a mile in my book. I would never tire of saying over and over again how the raw 5e is both primitive AND boring compared to 3.5e, and Larian adding flair to it at least makes it tolerable and interesting. All personal opinions, obviously.

That said, I am looking forward to seeing how Solasta can improve, because I didn't "hate" it, was just left with a "meh" for the final verdict. It didn't annoy the living hell out of me like Kingmaker did, that's for certain.

hmm wonder if the writing would be better then

At the very least, the introduction of official multiplayer for Solasta should help bury the argument that proper reactions slow down the pacing of a multiplayer session forever, now that people will witness how it works in actual practice.

Cannot be said any better than this.^

The ONLY shortcoming of Solasta is that it is low-budget, with all that a small budget entails. Every single thing about that game that someone could complain about is easily fixable with more resources available to the devs. So, no inherent limitations the way BG3 has built-in limitations (toilet-chain party movement, for example).

I only need two more things for Solasta to be awesome for me:
(1) Level cap raised to level 20.
(2) Multi-classing.

One thing I will say about Solasta as a negative that I'd also like to see - well maybe more than 1:

- Feats kinda stink. I'd have liked to see more traditional 5e feats implemented - Spear Mastery, for example. And what's the point of giving us languages if you're not really using them - or the Comprehend Languages spell? If it doesn't have a value or use, just don't have it in the game. (Maybe for future state, is what I'm thinking.)
- Replayability. I think one of the ways BG3 is far superior to Solasta is that almost all the dialogue is the same regardless of how many times you play through it. I'd have rather had less voice acting and more dialogue branches than voice acting and pretty much no variations in dialogue. Almost every conversation, though they give you options, is the same because your options are typically required to select before you can move on with the conversation. You can either select dialogue option 1 or 2, but before the conversation continues, you must choose both. It just depends on which one you want first. There are times this is not the case, but the variations are rather limited. So, replayability is MUCH less enjoyable than BG3.

Example: in the Dark Tower, you talk to the blonde lady. This has some replayability because if you Persuade and succeed, you have a different ending than if you fail or if you choose another option. That was good for replayability. However, in Coperann, when you're talking to the Baron or the Cenard, etc. there is pretty much no variation for most conversations. The options they give you MUST both be triggered before you can move on. SO not replayable-friendly.

Feat implementation in Solasta is absolutely something that can be fixed with money. Right now they rely on the 5e SRD, which does not contain all of the feats in the 5e players book. In fact, I think that it contains a very small number of feats. They are therefor forced to entirely home brew the feats.

With money to buy a full 5e license (or direct backing from Wizards) they could implement those feats very easily, and I am sure that they would do it compitently.

Oh, no doubt. I'm just saying, the feats were not impressive in the slightest. I'd have rather had them come up with some much cooler feats than what they did.

Example: Even if you didn't do Spear Mastery, create a feat for Spear-Wielders. Increase Strength by 1 and allow those who wield Spears to do a Charge attack. If you move 3 or more squares and then attack, you get an extra 1d6 die on your damage roll, or something like that.

There's so many things they could have done with feats, but I feel that they just kinda sorta didn't care.

This yet haha...

Solasta is still crap in this way.
+ Well I guess this is for me only something to do while I wait for BG3... and it is Dungeons Dragons at least slightly they did not get full DnD license and instead somekind of limited DnD license.
- Ugly graphics. Ugly dolls Hahaaa!
- Forget about movie effects.
- What freedom? Ultra linear.
- Forget the notion of explore.
- Bugs.
- Clumsy control feeling. Bullshit that Neverwinter Nigths 1 is more clumsy then this.
- Jump here and there and confusing terrain with different height positions.
- I can not play this with brother or with friends.
6.5/10

vs

BG3
+ Very good graphics.
+ BLAH BLAH BLAH etc.
+ I will play it with my brother for sure and maybe with also with some friends. However right no not yet play with by brother. My brother said he will play this with me when it is full release. When is BG3 full release? Well I my best guess for BG3 full release is roughly January-June 2023. Yes it could be release with very end of 2022, but I do not believe that will happen.
9.25/10

Terminator2020,

Interesting list of criteria. You mention bugs for Solasta, but not for BG3. So the latter is bug-free, in your opinion? Or are you just one of those shove-loving knaves, who postulate that Larian games have no bugs in principle, and that everything which might look like a bug is, in fact, a planned feature?

Care to elaborate on this one? The majority here, myself included, think it's rather the other way around. Or do you enjoy Larian's toilet chain? Oh, hang on, you are a fan of multiplayer, so no LTC issues for you. Okay, but the question still stands - how Solasta controls are "clumsy", exactly?

Honestly, with your selection criteria, I don't see why you would ever need BG3 at all. D:OS2 has been released 5 years ago, you can play that one. It's practically the same, and it has everything you consider important.

There are bugs in BG3 still and more will come but they will fix them one by one..... DOS2 I did buy that long time ago but this is not about DOS2 vs BG3. Well anyway I like more Dungeons Dragons and BG3 then DOS2. BG3 have also better graphics then DOS2 at least now after 6 patch for BG3 the 7th patch was about Barbarian class etc.

In Terminator's defence regarding the bug issue, BG3 is literally unfinished. Even accounting for budgets, I don't think it's entirely fair to compare a game still in the process of being made to a game that's complete. Having said that, I disagree with them on almost every other point. Particularly the whole jumping thing. I would argue that BG3 is far worse in dealing with height positions. And I can't take an argument seriously even on principle when one of the points given in a game's favor is literally blah, blah, blah.

ROFL. But why 9.25? Might as well say 10/10 and be done with it lol.
Seriously though Ill add a <few> more negatives to your weird list for BG3.

-Shit control system. Stupid toilet chain.
-Awfull Pathfinding.
-Pointless Items overload. Too many potions, scrolls, and food makes many class abilities beyond pointless. For example.
-CRAP D&D 5th system. So much missing or just weird Larian house rules.
-Just 4 joinable companions. Give us 6! But....
-Less than 10 companions for the whole game anyways apparently. Probably 8 ??? BG2 had 18. Dont give a shit if <well they are more detailed>. Less is less. And Larian has the funds.
-INCREDIBLY cringy cinematic dialogues. Looks like shit most of the time. TO MY EYES. I love movies/good acting; and this is just <meme calore> bad.
-Poor D&D atmosphere; Super silly Larianized world. Still way too cartoony graphics...I guess thats what kids like these days.
-No day/night time or calendar. POOR ATMOSPHERE building, again.
-This is Baldur's Gate game right? Doesn't even remotely FEEL like a BG game. AGAIN POOR ATMOSPHERE building. DOS3 in Faerun.
-Incredibly slow passed turn base battle system.
-Blend shit looking hard to use UI.
BLA BLA BLA etc........

In my honest opinion BG3 is a solid 7/10 game. And thats being VERY kind. IF it weren't for the graphics and cinematics (which I dislike personally...) Id give it a 5/10 alone for gameplay and rest.

This whole topic is just:
"me like Solasta" > "but me like BG-3 more!" > "but me like Solasta more" > "but me like BG-3 more!" > "but me like Solasta more" > "but me like BG-3 more!" > "but me like Solasta more" > "but me like BG-3 more!" > "but me like Solasta more" > "but me like BG-3 more!" > "but me like Solasta more" > "but me like BG-3 more!" > "but me like Solasta more" > "but me like BG-3 more!" > "but me like Solasta more" > "but me like BG-3 more!" > "but me like Solasta more" > "but me like BG-3 more!" > "but me like Solasta more" > "but me like BG-3 more!" > "but me like Solasta more" > "but me like BG-3 more!" > "but me like Solasta more" > "but me like BG-3 more!" > "but me like Solasta more" > "but me like BG-3 more!" > "but me like Solasta more" > "but me like BG-3 more!" > "but me like Solasta more" > "but me like BG-3 more!" > ...

Why pretend that there is anything deeper?

Yes I too agree about feats. They themselves acknowledged this at one time and have tried to make them better, but not having the full license is very limiting in this regard.
About dialog and choices, there also the issue was money. You can clearly see that the game is very strong at the beginning and then slowly loses steam as you go to the end, with the end being especially weak. This is entirely money-related, where they began to run out of funds to pay their devs and needed to get the game out the door in a hurry towards the end. But, they clearly have intent to go back and fix at least some of those things. For example, we known many areas of the game where they have implemented something as a placeholder even though it is not active in the game. Languages is a good example, where for some languages, those languages themselves are in the game but if you mouse-over them a comment comes up saying this language is not implemented in the game. You have this also for many other things like favored enemies and favored terrain and so on. Well, in subsequent patches or DLCs they do try and go back and add in those elements that they didn't quite get to previously. So the game is obviously a living game, one that is going to be constantly added to and upgraded so long as they keep making new campaign DLCs.

Given that Solasta can't use 5e official feats, that was a great time for them to develop and release a set of balanced feats that are all about equivalent to +2 ASIs, but just add versatility in characters' gameplay. As many of us know, 5e's feats are...not the most balanced.

I'd actually prefer for Tactical Adventures to redesign the feat system entirely, going back to something closer to 3.5e where feats were all much weaker but you got them in addition to ASIs, but I respect TA's choice to keep things as close to 5e as possible.

Because although some people are doing this, many are not and are pointing out the good and bad in both games, hoping Larian implements some of the good from Solasta into BG3. THAT is the real point of this thread. It is people hoping Larian will make BG3 better by pulling ideas from Solasta and even other cRPGs within the genre - like Pathfinder.

So here's my good/bad BG3 vs. Solasta list (not all-inclusive by any means, just the main points):

BG3 Pros which are Cons for Solasta that I wish they'd improve in that game
- High replayability. Oh man! I've never played a game over and over again so many times from scratch. So many options and choices based on your character like they are all custom designed for my specific character each time. SO many ways you can go. Do you want to save the grove or destroy it? Do you want to skip it all and just go straight for the jugular - going right to the Underdark? Do you care about your companions or not? Are you a murder hobo who just wants to kill everyone? Go ahead. See what happens. And I love that you discover new things each and every time you replay the game. I've played now almost 600 hours and am still learning new tidbits about the overall story and so forth. You THINK you know something, but then you replay it and learn another little tidbit of knowledge and it changes your whole perspective. That's the main thing I love about this game. It's what truly makes BG3 top on the list of any cRPGs that I want to play. Solasta's is not so well done. Solasta is rather linear. I've been playing it also since EA, and even after the first playthrough, it was hard to try playing it again a second time. Everything happens in pretty much the same order every time. Yes, some of the dialogue is different here and there, in that they quip off different one-liners, but overall it's the same exact story each time. You don't really miss anything depending on the choices you make, so your choices don't really matter that much.
- Graphics. Need I say more. I totally disagree with anyone who says the graphics are bad. They need some tweaks - shout out to Niara, because Halflings need some serious tweaks - but by far the models and graphics beat out any other cRPG that is similar. Honestly, I'd prefer Solasta's over Pathfinder, but I'm sure others will disagree. That said, BG3 blows both away. Solasta does have some good models. So, I must say, those who totally destroy its models and graphics are, in my opinion, a bit off base. However, there aren't many that look great by any means. Some are downright nasty and ugly, and we pick the ugly models just for a good laugh.
- Story. Geez. Again, BG3 blows the rest away, at least in my opinion. Solasta's is okay, but it's about as deep as one of the D&D movies we've seen in the past. It has cheesy voice acting for most of it, and the story is pretty basic. Pathfinder Kingmaker (haven't played the other since I can't even get through Kingmaker)? Wasn't really feeling the story. Sorry. I know some probably totally disagree, but for me it was just meh. BG3, as I said above, has an intricate story, and we've only got EA so far. As I said above, you've got to really dig in to understand it all. Those who think it's a boring, dumb story that has no depth aren't digging deep enough. It took me FOREVER to piece together a timeline to make sense of it, and I still find myself changing timeline stuff as I discover new things. Just take Lenore's story alone... or Omeluuum... or the hag... or Minthara's... each character seems to have an actual background, even down to the most minute goblin character. That is another huge thing I love about this game.
- Characters. Yes. I like them all. I know some people get all, "These characters are all stupid. I don't like even one." But I do. Even Astarion, who a lot of people seem to REALLY hate. He's actually one of my favorites. It's always good to have humor against a dark setting of murder, bloodshed, and tadpoles in your heads that'll turn you into monsters. Solasta's characters - beyond your custom 4 - are pretty cringy at times. Merton, for example, actually says, "You're all a bunch of mamby pambies." Ugh! Really? And the Princess Peach-wannabe is REALLY poorly done, in my opinion. I liked Gorin, but you only really talk to her once or twice because she's a merchant, and I kinda liked the Scavenger Halfling lady you first meet. But, again, she's not a major character. I just... the Solasta characters are really not deep especially in comparison with BG3 characters. They're all just, well, meh.

These are probably the top 4 things that are most important to me in a game, and they are why I love this game so much.

Solasta Pros which are Cons for BG3 that I'd like to see improved
- Combat and overall Gameplay (more D&D 5e). It's balanced, strategic, and easy to learn. Everything is laid out for you and is progressive, as D&D is meant to be. You start with a few options in combat, and you progressively get more and more each level so you only have to learn a few options per level. It keeps you from getting overwhelmed by everything you have to choose from. At level 1, fighter can attack, shove, disengage, and dash. Done. Rogue can attack, shove, disengage, and dash. Done. At low level, it teaches you the basic maneuvers and gets you familiar with them. Then it builds upon them so by the time you're level 8 or 9, you have gotten to know your characters really well and are familiar with ALL of the choices you have to work with. In BG3, at level 1, you can do all the things mentioned above plus attack with cleave with this type of weapon, and pommel, and topple with that kind of weapon, and now throw enemies, and so on and so forth with every weapon having extra abilities and so forth. Then, add to this that wizards and clerics and druids and such have a lot of spells to get familiar with, and it's overwhelming. It's hard to remember what all your character can do in a single round. It's also unbalanced. It actually takes me MORE time to take a turn because I'm trying to figure out what are all my options and are any of them better than just moving and attacking. I like options. I do. However, I don't like that you have so many options that it's hard to determine what you should actually do. When playing multiplayer, it really can slow you down a lot because not every player is as familiar with the game as I am. So they see a lot of options and go, "Um. What does this option do? Huh. Is that better? Should I do that or this or that or this?" Yes, it adds some additional strategy - and I like strategy - but it really kills the game in a lot of ways. Besides not giving players the ability to really get familiar with anything before something new comes flying at you, it also leaves the game no real place to go. You start with lots of abilities, and by level 4 you have an inventory full of possibilities plus a ton of special abilities per character/ spells, etc. It's just too much. Solasta's combat system is more tamed down, uniform, cohesive, progressive, strategic, and far less volatile and chaotic. Though combat isn't AS important to me as the story, characters and so forth, it IS an extremely important element in any cRPG. If combat is frankly as boring as BG3 is currently, where I just have to discover what gimmick to use and exploit it, then it will be a HUGE hangup especially for later in the game. If I'm finding combat super boring by level 5 and beyond... yeah... it's going to get REAL difficult to get through the game. Besides this, combat is so extreme with BG3 that you have ridiculous things happening, like enemies shoving you 30+ feet off a ledge and killing you. You have people picking enemies up and throwing them, also ridiculous distances, and doing more damage with throwing enemies than you would with a regular weapon. Solasta doesn't have such weird extreme mechanics, and that's what I like. Combat is more realistic because it is more controlled and orderly. I can determine things tactfully and strategically. In BG3, it's more experimental and wild. Try throwing that grease bottle at that torch and see what happens. Hah! Boom! Enemies go bur! Hmmm. Now try throwing that enemy into the fire to see what happens. Hah! Enemy landed hard and took 8 damage plus got set on fire for an additional 4. Throw a bottle of grease and Boom! I know. I know. Some people like chaotic combat without any real thought or strategy, but I don't. I want something I can rely on and get familiar with. I don't like experimenting to see what works and then having to reload a dozen times per combat just because what I tried didn't work.
- UI and controls. Though Solasta could have been better, because the UI was bigger than necessary and they didn't exactly provide you with a lot of hotkeys (so no just pressing C to Crouch and be sneaking) the UI was laid out well for new players. I actually learned from Solasta that certain rules I'd been doing wrong in Tabletop were, in fact, wrong. I'd just homebrewed my own rules and thought they were actual rules and was playing it my way. Then I played Solasta and its UI taught me a few things. What is ACTUALLY able to be performed and when and where. Wait! I can't just cast Cure Wounds AND Healing Word in a single round. Yes, that was a homebrew I was allowing and thought it was actual rules until I played Solasta. When they grayed out Cure Wounds after I cast Healing Word, I was floored. I even went out and looked it up and said, "Dang! Can't believe I didn't notice that before in the rules." That's how well the UI is laid out so that it teaches you how to play the game. You don't need many tutorials at all. Each round, you know exactly what your options are, and it only takes you a few battles to really get a hang of the basics. Movement is clean and crisp, and pathing is spot on. When you encounter a trap, and you notice it, the game stops you so you don't just plow right into it before you can do anything about it. Camera is sometimes difficult, especially in regard to verticality, but it's better than BG3 which gives you NO ability to go up a few levels of elevation so you can actually see things better. Also, Solasta has FLYING both as an option for YOUR characters AND enemies. So, harpies don't just fly close to the ground. They fly up in the sky, hovering above you. You can also cast Fly and join them, hurling magic from up in the air. I'm not as much of a fan of the Grid movement and so forth - as I do prefer BG3's line movement mechanics especially in combat, but Solasta is definitely superior in terms of movement mechanics, UI, camera, and overall controls.
- Banter. BG3 is getting better at this, but Solasta is still better. I like that characters in Solasta are interacting with one another all the time and even poking fun - playfully - at one another. You miss an enemy and your ally says, "You suck!" or "Do better next time." Or, if you chose a nicer personality, they'll say, "You'll get 'em next time." During dialogue sequences, they are playfully bantering back and forth. It makes for a better cohesive party feel rather than in BG3 where it feels more like it's YOU and the Origins. You are the star, and they are the supporting cast. In BG3, it's kind of a, "Whatever you like, MC. If that's what you like, MC." I want more interactions amongst party members, and since there are more than 4 party members in BG3, I'd like to see a party of 6 so they can ALL work together at the same time to be one complete party of 6 rather than having to only take 3 with you at a time and getting some interaction just between those you take with you while 1 or 2 members are in the doghouse.
- Personality choices/Alignment. This is something sorely missing from BG3. I'd like to be able to create characters with alignment and personality choices so that their facial expressions and dialogue align. Yeah, this might be difficult in BG3, but it'd be really cool. If I create a Neutral Evil drow sorcerer, I definitely don't want to see him looking like some soft-hearted idiot when he's talking to someone. I want him to look callously at them as if they are fools and inconsequential to his personal quest. I don't want my hardened battlemaster looking all scared and weak and such when facing a few goblins. I want to give her a personality where she stares down an ogre without batting an eye. In reverse, I want my soft-hearted cleric to be more friendly and personable looking. I don't want scenes where he is looking at people like, "Gonna kill ya. Gonna die." Solasta does alignment and personality choices, so characters do respond to different situations with different comments. Solasta could have still done it better, but it was better than BG3. Also, alignment means that if there is a holy item, certain characters shouldn't be able to use it, or if there's an evil item, certain characters shouldn't be able to use it. So a Selunite cleric shouldn't be able to use a Sharran amulet, or vice versa.

Like I said, I'm sure there are others, but that's my personal comparison main list, and I'm only even presenting this because BG3 is still in EA. If it was a full and complete game, I wouldn't even bother. I'd just accept it as is. But, they want our feedback, so here it is.

Excluding your own post ... (whoah btw O_O )

Personaly i didnt see any constructive for few months around here ...
All was just "solasta good, BG3 bad" not sure how that were suppose to help anything. -_-

Jesus Christ, people, you need to format your posts with more spacing between paragraphs.