Originally Posted by robertthebard
But what is it about SRs that's bothering you so much that you feel like you can't just play it out the way you want, instead of changing the game to suit you? Is it that it actually has a limiting factor on it, and you'd prefer that to be removed?

(I've made the following spoilers to cut down on the overall length of this post, for it's lengthy.)

There are multiple things that bug me:

SR is SO pointless in BG3. The ONLY real benefit of it is that you don't have to teleport to camp and then click on a bedroll to acquire the benefits. In other words, it's 2 less clicks, and maybe 2 minor transitions, and the results of a LR are far more beneficial - full recovery as opposed to just HP recovery. And then, to top it all off, you only get 2 of them. Meanwhile, you can LR as much as you want without penalty or legit cost.

In D&D, the WHOLE point of SR is that, as a DM, you want to try to make it so that the players are doing as much as you can possibly get them to do in a single day. You want your players to feel like they are not sucky. You want them to feel like their characters are tough and skilled. You want them to adventure for hours and then end day at the end of a quest or objective. So you allow SRs so they take an hour break here or there when needed so that they can keep going.

The main issue I have is that in BG3, I feel like I'm constantly adventuring for 5 minutes and then my characters take the rest of the day off. They run around, talk to a few people, get into a fight, and then long rest. Sure, I don't HAVE to do this, but the game allows and even promotes it.

Besides what I mentioned above, meaning SR has no real purpose other than 1 click healing as opposed to 3, one of the worst parts for me is that if I don't long rest often, my party members start complaining about how spent they are and how they need a break, or MY character will make such a comment. And then, as if that isn't enough, if I don't LR often, I miss out on some fun dialogues with party members, like Gale's Mirror Image and Go To Hell dialogues, which I rather like. (Note: The SH dialogue about "Is this a good idea, we have tadpoles in our heads is appropriate ONLY if you LR before reaching the grove. So it makes sense to miss that one if you don't LR often. However, the others could happen at any point in time, but you miss them entirely if you don't LR often.)

My point is that D&D is supposed to be played in the opposite fashion. SR should be encouraged 5 times more and LR should be discouraged so that players are LRing as little as possible.

My Suggested Solution:

In BG3, my issue is that you have multiple time-sensitive story elements, and it doesn't matter one bit how much you LR. The ritual in the grove will continue endlessly for weeks if you need it to, for absolutely no reason. The goblins never find the grove and attack it, even though you may have freed Sazza on the same day you came to the grove. She NEVER goes back to the camp and waits for you even if you spend days to rejoin her. The dragon appears in the telescope near Nadira on the hill, and it is STILL in the area and STILL near the bridge on Risen Road even if you spend weeks in the game to get there. Waukeen's Rest burns endlessly. The tadpole never gives you issues no matter how many Long Rests you use.

Stop. Right there. THAT'S what they could use to limit Long Rests. THAT would fix both long and short rests. They establish right from the beginning that you have tadpoles in your heads that could turn you into mind flayers. It could be within hours. You need to find a healer. So why not USE that to actually discourage long rests? THAT is what I mean by "timed events". Even after you find out that you may have some time, they could still use the tadpoles to discourage you.

How? Simple.

I try to Long Rest on the beach. Shadowheart stops me. "I'm not sure this is such a good idea," dialogue commences, but the end is rescripted. She explains that we could turn into mind flayers in HOURS. We could maybe take a break for about an hour, but she then refuses to rest any longer than that. "If you want to waste the rest of the day, that's up to you. I'm continuing on."

So, you can long rest, but you lose Shadowheart temporarily (able to reclaim her at the Grove) because you chose to do something stupid like Long Rest when you are supposed to try to find a healer and fast before you start to turn into a mind flayer. They establish almost immediately that you really want to find a healer fast, and her threatening to leave you if you long rest would certainly deter most people from actually doing it, especially if the game suggests (as it does currently) that a short rest is recommended. Even 2 Short Rests should be prevented by the game at this point, only allowing 1 because you're supposed to be urged to continue before ceremorphosis starts turning you (which it begins within HOURS of infection).

And here's the final part of this suggestion. They follow through with the threats. They warn you not to long rest too much, and then if you do, you start to have the Dream Lover dreams, or some other events happen that let you know that you shouldn't just long rest after every fight. You don't just have the dreams because you use your illithid powers. You start to have them because you are spamming long rest.

Bam! Right there, you have a consequence that is already in the game, mind you. They would just need to set different triggers for them.

THAT is all they'd need to do, and before I get people jumping all over time limits (AGAIN) and saying how they hate them, I'm not talking about you get only 1 week to complete EA or you turn into a mind flayer or something. I'm talking you get like X Long Rests before your first dream. Then you get another X Long Rests before someone appears at your camp and says that fortunately the ritual has been interrupted but unfortunately Rath is imprisoned (or something similar). Then X Long Rests later, Lae'zel gets frustrated and warns that you'd best go to the gith patrol and pay attention to her or she's leaving. Then you Long Rest again, and she follows through with leaving you (again, however, only temporary. You can pick her back up again once you go in that direction. As soon as you hit Waukeen's Rest, you find her in a bush. When the goblins/drow attacked, she was caught in the conflict and severely wounded. She never made it to the patrol). You Long Rest again after facing the gith patrol. That night, you have another tadpole dream.

THESE are the things I'm talking about. Timed Events that remind you that each day you take, stuff happens. Things happen. The world is changing with each passing day.

Notice, not a single one of the events I mentioned hard lock anything. You can still do Lae'zel's gith patrol quest. It's just that if you don't do it quick enough she temporarily leaves your party. She doesn't permanently leave. She just temporarily leaves.

Notice that you don't turn into a mind flayer. You have dreams that are letting you know that you are not on an endless timetable. You need to prioritize your missions.

Notice that the grove doesn't get sealed off. Something happens to warn you that you're running out of time to save the grove. You need to make it at least somewhat of a priority (if you care).

Finally, unlimit the number of short rests per day so players can use them as much as they need to for classes like fighters, monks, and warlocks who are supposed to be able to reset spell slots and special abilities per short rest for just such a reason that this helps them keep the party going even after all the wizards and clerics have run out of their spells and such. Use Hit Dice for HP restoration because Hit Dice allows you to use less potions, but there is even a limit to them so you don't just short rest forever without eventually needing potions to keep going.

ALL of these things can be done in a cRPG. It is not impossible, and it actually wouldn't take THAT much extra work UNLESS they decide to make it more complicated than it needs to be. (You don't need a cinematic dialogue for EVERY tiny conversation in the game. You don't even NEED to voice act them all.

NOTE: PLEASE DO NOT COPY ALL THIS DOWN IN RESPONSES. It's long enough as is. Thanks.

Last edited by GM4Him; 20/05/22 04:20 PM.