BTW. For the record, I never said I LIKED the idea of him being Jergal. I'm just guessing based on the evidence that he is.
I honestly don't care. I never use Withers' powers because he isn't needed. Plenty of revivify scrolls that work days after someone dies. It's much less expensive... And that only IF I die. He's like a lawn ornament at Halloween to me.
And if you don't like him, psst... Don't open his sarcophagus. 🤪
Elsewhere I voiced the idea that we, the tadpoled, are already dead by the start of the game. I would be okay with it being Jergal if we're dead and only we can see him.
Edit: It also lets him go wherever we go without anyone noticing or it being a plot inconvenience. Edit 2: It also explains our easy access to resurrection and his ability to only resurrect the tadpoled.
Last edited by Zerubbabel; 26/08/2203:53 AM.
Remember the human (This is a forum for a video game):
BTW. For the record, I never said I LIKED the idea of him being Jergal. I'm just guessing based on the evidence that he is.
I honestly don't care. I never use Withers' powers because he isn't needed. Plenty of revivify scrolls that work days after someone dies. It's much less expensive... And that only IF I die. He's like a lawn ornament at Halloween to me.
And if you don't like him, psst... Don't open his sarcophagus. 🤪
He shows up automatically under certain circumstances iirc. You are also robbing yourself of one of the most useful EA utility items if you don't open it, and potentially missing out on a ton of unrelated content as a result.
So I think 'just don't wake him up' is far from an ideal solution. And this all doesn't really address the critique of 'why did Larian write a scenario where you are introduced to one of the most important characters in the setting right out the gate in Act I only to go all 'pay no attention to the ancient god 'lich' standing off to the side in your camp' and utilize him as a debug vendor?
BTW. For the record, I never said I LIKED the idea of him being Jergal. I'm just guessing based on the evidence that he is.
I honestly don't care. I never use Withers' powers because he isn't needed. Plenty of revivify scrolls that work days after someone dies. It's much less expensive... And that only IF I die. He's like a lawn ornament at Halloween to me.
And if you don't like him, psst... Don't open his sarcophagus. 🤪
He shows up automatically under certain circumstances iirc. You are also robbing yourself of one of the most useful EA utility items if you don't open it, and potentially missing out on a ton of unrelated content as a result.
So I think 'just don't wake him up' is far from an ideal solution. And this all doesn't really address the critique of 'why did Larian write a scenario where you are introduced to one of the most important characters in the setting right out the gate in Act I only to go all 'pay no attention to the ancient god 'lich' standing off to the side in your camp' and utilize him as a debug vendor?
Lots of assumptions here, and the point I was making was if you don't like Withers just don't open the sarcophagus. There's no denying he's a great safety net should you actually run out of revivify scrolls, but rather than having the option to kill him because you don't like him, why do you open the sarcophagus to begin with? Poke around in a crypt and raid a tomb, and you're asking for some undead thing to haunt you. I'm just saying.
But as far as him being one of the most important characters, I'm not so sure he's THAT important. That's what I mean by assuming here. I think he's meant to be mysterious and for people to wonder what this strange corpse thing wants with you, but is he super important to the story? Probably not. But then, I'm just assuming also. None of us really knows.
Regardless, I think his inability to die is a key element of his character. Whether he is Jergal or not, the fact that he can't be killed seems to be important to who he is.
BTW. For the record, I never said I LIKED the idea of him being Jergal. I'm just guessing based on the evidence that he is.
I honestly don't care. I never use Withers' powers because he isn't needed. Plenty of revivify scrolls that work days after someone dies. It's much less expensive... And that only IF I die. He's like a lawn ornament at Halloween to me.
And if you don't like him, psst... Don't open his sarcophagus. 🤪
He shows up automatically under certain circumstances iirc. You are also robbing yourself of one of the most useful EA utility items if you don't open it, and potentially missing out on a ton of unrelated content as a result.
So I think 'just don't wake him up' is far from an ideal solution. And this all doesn't really address the critique of 'why did Larian write a scenario where you are introduced to one of the most important characters in the setting right out the gate in Act I only to go all 'pay no attention to the ancient god 'lich' standing off to the side in your camp' and utilize him as a debug vendor?
Lots of assumptions here, and the point I was making was if you don't like Withers just don't open the sarcophagus. There's no denying he's a great safety net should you actually run out of revivify scrolls, but rather than having the option to kill him because you don't like him, why do you open the sarcophagus to begin with? Poke around in a crypt and raid a tomb, and you're asking for some undead thing to haunt you. I'm just saying.
But as far as him being one of the most important characters, I'm not so sure he's THAT important. That's what I mean by assuming here. I think he's meant to be mysterious and for people to wonder what this strange corpse thing wants with you, but is he super important to the story? Probably not. But then, I'm just assuming also. None of us really knows.
Regardless, I think his inability to die is a key element of his character. Whether he is Jergal or not, the fact that he can't be killed seems to be important to who he is.
I'm personally not advocating for killing him. But not waking him up requires some metagaming I'd rather avoid. hence my angle of critique is that
#1 once you talk to him he won't take no for an answer & you are stuck with him. Not opening the Sarcophagus is also not the solution to avoid him you seem to think it is, since he can show up in other ways.
#2 Yes, he is that important, both specifically for the background of the BG games, since he is responsible for the rise of Bhaal, without which we wouldn't have a BG series, but also because he was one of the oldest, most powerful gods (and perhaps may still be). His introduction and presence in your camp is....strange & more than a little jarring, to say the least.
So my feeling is that should we have an option to not recruit/kick out the skeleton from our camp? Yes. Should Larian have dropped a thinly-disguised elder god into our midst in the beginning of the game? No. Even the notion that a busy-ish Jergal would be interred 'waiting' in a casket like some common undead is odd. Some sort of representative doing jergal's work would make more sense. But he still shouldn't be mandatory, and his presence in the game as of right now seems very transparently- as I phrased it- a 'debug merchant'. There are no cutscenes with his arrival. No party members talk to him or about him from what I recall. Nobody notices him during the goblin/tiefling party.
I think it's a given Withers plays an important part in the story.
Which is why it's incredibly lame that they're using him as a rez vendor at camp. Nothing kills mystery or excitement better than being a convenience vendor who has nothing better to do than hang out at your camp and wait to be useful.
I also frown at the low to non-existent threshold Larian has at throwing undead / lich / dragons / mindflayers / everything at low level PC's. A creepy undead casually hanging out at your camp should raise questions and force reactions. But not here. Companions, Volo, Scratch, Tieflings, Halsin.. everyone just coexists naturally with undead without any questions asked. Sometimes it feels like nothing has any meaning in a Larian game. They just throw in everything and the kitchen sink without thinking twice.
I'm also worried for the plot that involves a VERY high number of factions already. The plot could be trying too hard and imploding on it's own impossibility. Mind Flayers, altered tadpoles, Githyanki and dragons, The Dead Three, Shar, Selune, Jergal, Zhentarim, Baldur's Gate, The Harpers, Shadow Druids, The Nine Hells and Devils, Zariel, Raphael, Mizora, Hags, Drow, Duergar, Cazador and Vampires....... JEEEZ!
Watching the alternative video, man, Larian is just awful at writing things sometimes. I really hope both introductions to Withers in the actual release aren't like this, because they both feel so artificial. "I'm here to be a rez bot" is essentially what he says. It's just awful. "go away". "no". If this guy is really a god in disguise, it's going to be a "huh, you're kind of a dumb god eh?" moment.
Sometimes it feels like nothing has any meaning in a Larian game. They just throw in everything and the kitchen sink without thinking twice.
I'm also worried for the plot that involves a VERY high number of factions already. The plot could be trying too hard and imploding on it's own impossibility. Mind Flayers, altered tadpoles, Githyanki and dragons, The Dead Three, Shar, Selune, Jergal, Zhentarim, Baldur's Gate, The Harpers, Shadow Druids, The Nine Hells and Devils, Zariel, Raphael, Mizora, Hags, Drow, Duergar, Cazador and Vampires....... JEEEZ!
I think its an expression of their lack of confidence. It requires real courage to take a "less is more" approach in any artistic endeavor.
