Larian Studios Forums Baldur's Gate III Baldur's Gate III - Suggestions & Feedback The Hag - Missing The Choice To Kill Her After Deception

Question!
Are those two corssed swords in left bottom corner presented in this dialogue?

You cut your screenshots so i cant check.
But if they are, you should be able to attack her at any time during that talking.

Wouldn't that end the dialogue without being able to choose both Mayrina and power?

Nah, the attack option is not present during the conversation since the party is already in combat with her. Nor can companions be selected during this scene as they're all present for it.

Naturally I could just leave one companion hidden out of combat and then snipe her after I get the reward, but the journal and the story will still treat the events as if I let the Hag go. So I'll just kill her for now without the power and hope they add a dialogue option to kill her later.

+1 to an option to kill the hag after deceiving / intimidating her!

Yeah, definitely need this option thrown in the dialog!

I’ve been thinking about this, and can certainly see it’s something a character might want to do and therefore we should be able to *try* to kill Ethel after getting her hair. I am less convinced that we should be able to succeed.

The choice we currently have, between power and ridding the Sword Coast of a dangerous being (or killing or letting survive a really cool character!) is a meaningful one, and I think it cheapens it if we can have it all. Plus, it would mean there was no reason, after a bit of meta-gaming, for pretty much any party who wanted to kill Ethel to do anything other than have a go at deceiving her first, which would make the end of the fight more same-y.

I’d be fine if Ethel were given an out. She’s had a bit of time to regroup while you’ve been bargaining with her, perhaps that’s given her the energy for one last invisibility spell/potion and sprint to one of her faerie rings to teleport away.

Hags are known for their deals. Maybe she gets some power over us if we try to betray our deal with her; she can trivially stun/sleep/control us or something like that.

Cool! Yes, something like this.

I see the angle of what you're saying, but I don't think it is a case of having it all because;

• Getting Auntie Ethel below 15hp and keeping her there until she gets her turn is incredibly hard as any class can easily overshot 15 dmg per hit.
• The risk of failing to obtain both Mayrina and the Power are quite high.
• You do not get to choose who does the talking as the dialogue is proximity based mid-combat.
• The Deception check is 20, the highest possible value and is supposed to be a false promise by all means of the word.
• You cannot apply any buffs for speech (such as Guidance or Shadowheart's Enhance Ability to give you an Advantage) because you are still in combat during this scene.
• You only have the Charisma bonus, Inspiration points and most of all, luck to succeed this roll.

And to make things worse, I managed to fail all 5 rolls consecutively as I was counting on my speech buffs to make it easier. Boy was I wrong when I remembered I was still in combat

Now that I think about it, this actually is the hardest speech check to pass in the game.

But if we were to fail in delivering a killing blow or continuing the fight, I'd rather have a [MELEE] roll check for that. Succeeding such a roll would deliver a killing blow or the fight continues to the death. And failing the roll, she simply runs away. That'd make some DnD immersion right there as far as I'm concerned.

But I definitely do want to kill her no matter what, so the fight will be the same-y for some individuals. I personally will never choose her power over killing her, as one attribute point is of less worth to me than a satisfying story outcome.

Well, if trying and failing the deception check could then lead to her escaping without giving you any reward if you then failed a subsequent melee check, rather than simply being able to choose one of the other options as I think happens currently, then I agree that would mitigate my concern. I’m not sure that I prefer it to the current set of possible outcomes, but I’m not sure that I don’t either! It would partly come down to the difficulty of the melee check.

EDIT: Actually, is that what you meant? Or were you just saying that if we *passed* the deception check, we could then have a further melee check to see if Ethel can escape, to further reduce the chance you’d get it all? That also would somewhat mitigate my concern, but not nearly as much as making it possible Ethel could escape whether you passed or failed the deception.

Actualy ...
The highest possible value is 30.

There is also a lockbox in Grymforge that requires 25 to open.

I am talking about speech checks, not Sleight Of Hand checks.

Wich follows the same rules as any other skillcheck.
Maybe you mean "Highest value curently presented in EA" ... ?

Feel free to prove me wrong by submitting a screenshot of an actual CHARISMA speech check during dialogue requiring a roll higher than 20 within the Early Access in the current 4.1.1.1755403 version. This should be pretty obvious, as the feedback is always solely and exclusively based on experiences within the current Early Access version.

Otherwise without proof this is just a pointlessly nitpicky off-topic debate, which I will not participate in.

You want me to contradict myself? O_o
Not going to happen. :-/

Wait, if you fail the deception check then you can simply choose one of the other options? That's it? No penalty for trying to be greedy and deceive the hag??

As far as I'm aware, yes. Failing the deception you just get the option to take Mayrina, the Power or kill the Hag.

To be clear, if you try and fail to Deceive the Hag, then can you still attempt Intimidate her for both the power AND Mayrina? If you can't do this, then that's better than what I was thinking.

But I think there should still be some penalty for failing to deceive her. Maybe she no longer allows to choose Mayrina, or the power she gives you is slightly worse, or something. If you can roll a check for a better result, then failing that roll should have some consequence.

Ah, by the other options I meant killing the hag or letting her take Mayrina. I was seeing intimidate as a different way to get the same option, and no I don’t think you can do that if you fail to deceive her. Sorry for any confusion!