Larian Studios Forums Baldur's Gate III Baldur's Gate III - Suggestions & Feedback Character Creation Feedback

Wait...so how is Sune supposed to be pronounced then? In Swedish, we would fully pronounce both vowels in two syllables, "Su -neh"(it's actually a, now uncommon, male first name). But in English, I would also think it should be pronounced like rune, ie "soon"

In english, it's mostly 'soon', like the joke, but with a very delicate, 'eh' trailing e vowel - it's hard to describe in text. The 'soon' syllable is strong, but there is a very soft tail to it.

Like my name - the first 'a' is almost silent, but not quite - if you take effort to deliberately pronounce that first 'a', then you're doing it too hard, so it should come off as mostly "Nigh-Ra", but there is a delicate 'a' that's just barely there, leading into, or attached to, the second syllable. Sune's trailing 'e' is similar, but in her case, you can pronounce it as strongly or as softly as you like and still be considered correct (and indeed, I should be clear, Black Elk is right in that generally, the most common pronunciations strengthen that 'e' sound rather than reducing it - and while all variants that include the trailing vowel in some form are considered correct, the realms page for her recommends this stronger pronunciation)

For me if it was an English word I'd default to Sune - rune, but when it's a foreign word (actually a non-Romance word), especially a made up one, I default to phonetic, every vowel is a syllable, reading. For Sune in particular, it's actually like how I hear people with Swedish or Italian accents pronounce 'soon'.

I remember listening to an interview with David J Peterson, the guy who made the lexicon for High Valyrian and Dothraki used in the Game of Thrones show, who said there are things that most fantasy authors add to 'fantasy' languages, probably subconsciously, to make them sound totally foreign, they're sounds that are absent or rare in modern English but are present in other languages, like glottal stops, creating this weird thing were you're trained to read fantasy words with your best attempt to approximate the 'foreign' way the word would have been formed. He was of course juxtaposing George R. R. Martin who never really set out to make a Valyrian dictionary, with someone like Tolkien who was and did make an Elvish dictionary.

Love it! Even now, when I see Rune I say it like a Swede if I can, cause it just has the power that extra power that way. Now I can also imagine a Garbo/Bergman/Sydow/Dolph angle on it too! (since I mainly still know the things I know from the cinema if I'm honest hehe) Just gives it that little something extra though right?

Like when Conan prays to Crom for the first time essentially.


That's what I'm thinking. A good short bark at the start, but maybe gets even more intense and elaborate as you progress.

Yeah I like that idea too, of taking a couple liberties with the emphasis on the Sune 'eh' for dramatic effect! lol

Anyhow, will try to find some more images over the weekend. I'm still trying to get my head around all the million things I'd love to see in a BG3 for char creation, pulling at the marley's chains with the rando digressions for sure. I do hope they go big in October with something fun. I hit the boards pretty hard past few days though, and the doggos need to roam, so I'm off for that. Catch ya in a few all!

OK digressing back to appearance right quick. Just because the default hair spread was shown on the previous page, here's the mod competition... So good!




Kittentail's tresses and some various styles just capped off the nexus page for that one as an example.

See how in the previews she gave those multiple angles, showing front as well as a profile, or a triple view. I think that's what would be cool, basically put it like a magic mirror view. That would be trick! The background is still distracting, but I can imagine a more isolated visualization where instead of seeing all the trees and waterfalls we see the reflected image of the PCs head from 3 angles. Like it was a prism or 3 mirrors vanity view. That way it could still have the play with the pull around, but you'd see the back and side same time? Anyway something along those lines. Where you could pull up a page view and then go in to tinker once you've made the selection.

Oh and because of the bodies!



So there is a glimpse of the stacked phenotype, again quick cap from nexus Alana's page preview, but seeing stuff like that gives one hope. Even down to the font choice for the CC! Little touches like that.

Even just glancing at the mod section...



You can tell there is a definite desire for just more out of a char creator. You know, you see those top lines and what people are into, with changing colors and equipment and the looks. It's like the whole game in a way hehe.

I'm not sure if this has been mentioned yet (Because this thread is very long so far with many good points, though I can't read them all right now!), but I would genuinely hope we get the choice of having a tail or not as a Tiefling.

I know it's not a huge deal to most, but I can't stand it writhing around with awful physics. Plus, I prefer my Tieflings without tails...

Yeah the tails are pretty hit or miss, it's one of the few things that's animated in the Char creation screen, but even there the physics is weird and tails are still clipping through the floor. There should be some options for alt tails one would think, and a "none" option too, if the player just wants to imagine something more vestigial that isn't shown.

Speaking of wild swings, a quick note on the voices.

So right now there are really only 4 characters in BG3 EA, because of the voice sets. When you only give us 2 bark sets for each sex, every character is bound to feel identical regardless of how many haircuts are on offer. We should have a couple dozen different choices for voices by now, and some options with verve, but instead we still just got the same 4? I don't see the rationale behind holding out during EA for that. I mean if they have material just waiting in the wings for this stuff, then just start releasing it as you go. It's been like 2 years with the same faces and same voices and the same clothes. Why not wow us with something novel during Char Creation for a change? Something more significant than hair highlights I mean. New voices would be significant.

I'd rather hear new PC voices than see a new area unlock, or a new Paladin or Monk who just looks and sounds exactly the same as my Bard/Barbarian/Sorcerer/Druid did. New voices, new body phenotypes, more heads, more outfits! That sort of stuff hehe. I just feel like they're doing it totally backwards sometimes. Char creation is first - it's the first part of the game we experience. It extends the shelf life. Anything new that's added there immediately makes the whole game feel newer by extension. Yet somehow Char creation stuff still seems to be low priority material in EA? Baffling! Aside from the new Classes the char creator is basically the same old same old. It looks pretty much exactly the way it did when we first started. I don't know, but I just expected a lot more by now. October is fast approaching, how about giving us something more for the guising? I mean right

Honestly, I suspect this is largely because Larian have already patted themselves on the back super hard for how amazing and awesome and great they claim their character creation already is... and because they have assured themselves of this already, it's a low priority that they just add more hairs to when the along-side resource management allows for it behind other priorities. Most recently, we saw that rather tan making actual improvements to the character creation system as a whole, or offering larger scale flexibility expansions (such as body types or face customisation), they were focused, instead, on adding more hair layering - it's a subtle statement that makes it look as though they don't really feel there's anything that needs fixed or improved with the creator itself, which is disappointing.

Yeah it's really hard not to feel a bit down on the lack of progress for this one. Like I keep hoping, basically every patch, that I'll log in and finally see some sweeping changes to the Char creator, since after controls/UI I think it's the most important thing they could be sinking the zots into, but it hasn't really happened. I can't figure why, especially during EA when they're asking everyone to replay the same content over and over again, and most of it already at the level cap. I mean how long does it take to get to lvl 4? Maybe 2 hours of gameplay? But once you're at that point the only thing left is gear progression or the min max at a super low levels trying to bust encounters. They can gather telemetry on the gameplay, but they can't really gather it on the Char art assets, because the options are just too few to discover anything meaningful there. If they instead put the strong emphasis on Char creation (by constantly providing new material there) I think there'd be more of an incentive to keep playing during the EA, even when everything else might suggest just waiting until full release so as not to burn out.

Basically using Char creation as the draw, or as an offset for the fact that the game is otherwise very truncated and incomplete. You have to give the player a reason to come back and keep pressing on right? I think Char Creation is the ticket there, because if you can make the Character/Avatar feel different enough, then the whole playthrough gets that knock on effect.

Also, just because I mentioned it before in a couple places and keep touching on it in this thread, I think what BG3 should try to achieve is essentially a Portrait suite.

If we could animate our Avatar and capture a still using dress up and emotes (control the marionette, the camera, the lighting, and the backdrop etc) within the actual game, then BG3 will have given us what no other D&D crpg seems to have been able to thus far - a proper Character Portrait creator.

They could totally pull this off I think. The modelling art we've seen thus far is at the right level for it. In the "show us your character" thread there are many great character portraits, but they are almost all screens capped during gameplay, not within the Char Creator, because the PC avatar can just do stuff in-game that you just can't achieve in the Char Creator. I've heard the desire for more CC content derided on occasion as fit only for dating sims, but I don't think that's the case here at all. The Character Portrait is a hallmark of D&D going back to earliest days. People want their Characters to have character and to look and feel like unique creations. It's the essence of Dungeons & Dragons, and the beating heart of the thing. Any zot spent here would be a zot very well spent. I just wish the game offered more, like a lot more, hence the feedback hehe.

ps. here I was trying to add this earlier, but for some reason the boards didn't like webp. I wish the forums were more image friendly. Anyhow, just something to try and convey the distinction between the avatar and a portrait, or at least something that captures more the spirit of what a portrait might be...



I used Gale cause he's everywhere and a good example. He already has a strong character visualization just from the eyebrows and the back combed hair and whatnot, but it's impossible to tell one Gale from the another, when he's just down to that deadpan staring-into-the-void mannequin/headshot where all that is stripped away, like all the character has been scrubbed out basically. And that's what we get for our PC, with no emotive or gestural qualities to play stuff up.

Compared to the Gales, any PC I might make will seem pretty devoid of character. If they went with the emotive marionette route though and gave us a wardrobe, a camera, a light source, and an environment to stage, then the player could just make a portrait for themselves, and have this be the thing that displays rather than the headshot. Give us a Large and Small cap to sub in for the paper doll on the Char sheet screen and for the headshot, and suddenly the player can express way more character at a glance. If that makes sense? Something conceptually more like this...



A little goes a long way, and even if the character isn't fully visualized like the portrait cap the whole time, at least it gives some expression to what the player wants their character concept to convey. I think they could totally do it, and they basically already have. I mean I'm just pulling up the top line Gale images from a quick search, and you can see the material is there. It's just that the player doesn't have access to the same tools to visualize their PC that the devs have to visualize their Origin NPCs. All they need is a way to build the screencap into the game - into the gameplay I mean. Make that the thing in Character creation, and if we get a cooler look going along the way let us recap again within the portrait suite. Like just have that be a thing we can pull from the "appearance" tab. Get some colored lights and some colored threads and they're right on the money already, but I wish they'd go for broke and really do it up right. That would make the game feel some much more Baldur's Gate to me. Just instantly from that alone. That to me would seem like a real swing for the fences, because it would allow the player to become the artist and really get creative with the posing and the emotes and the dress up.

+1 to this thread, loads of great stuff.

My 2 main issues during Character creation are

1/Asking me to select background first when i have no idea what it will influence in the game. background influences your skills but you usually want one that goes with your race and class. So you first select race and class, and then you have to navigate back and forth between background and skills.
My proposal? simple. just let me select my background when i select my skills. they are related anyway and i wont have to do back and forth between menues...

2/ why this => arrow on the top right of the character selection menu to go relook who you love? There is plenty of space in the menu to add another tab. Or is it because we need to do it last? I always feel like navigating with arrows if not necessary makes it more complex than it should. Just add a tab...

Makes sense to me! hehe

October is cool, and here already I guess. My hope as always is that the next patch gets us a more House of Humor style spread with new costume threads and face masks and body suits within the Char Creator. I think for as fun as Halloween is, the Saturnalia is more important though, cause if you head into Dec winter breaks and high holidays and a new year without something to chew on that's tough. I catered for 20 years, and the one thing you can count on is that nobody really parties at the end of January, and Feb is totally deadsville. You gotta hit in Nov/Dec for end of the year celebrations. So I hope they do!

I think it will be fun when this game gets to the point where someone could remake a BG1 or BG2 within the BG3 engine. You know like maybe using the old sounds, but revamping the visuals and trying to do something more in line with the newer rules and dynamics. That seems like a thing that might be doable cause the old CDs still got that winning audio haha, and maybe after a few years in the kitchen the controls and party size UI stuff will be dialed to the point where it's feasible.

A fun challenge for the Char Creator/Models would be to redo all the BG portraits but in Avatar. So basically a BG3 version of this... but where they all actually fit the part and sort of look like that. Especially the gestural stuff - you know the Yoshimo fist pump, or the classic Edwin wizard hands etc. The BG1 portraits especially had some fun stuff going on with that, Dynaheir looking like a boss and Jaheira ready to kick ass with her quarterstaff. Eldoth's smirk, Faldorn's claws, I mean they all got at least something going on.





The BG2 portraits are solid as well for that too, the gestural stuff I mean, or at least everyone has a head tilt or some kind of expressive quality to their mug going on. What distinguishes a portrait from a mannequin is that sort of stuff. I'd like to see a Char Creator that is more emotive in that way, so it could get us closer to the essence of portraiture. The variety not just in terms of the glances or the outfits, or equipment, but also the lighting and just the colors. The two portrait sets are rather distinct going from BG1 to BG2 and I think some are stronger than others, but when you see them together you can get a sense for what gives a Character portrait 'character' on the quick read.

ps. here's something fun. So one thing I used to enjoy puzzling out was a way to make the two portrait sets (BG1 and BG2) look more uniform. The first thing I notice when comparing the two sets is that the BG1 portraits are all very saturated, like the vibrancy is almost off the charts, and they're generally darker with pretty high contrast. The BG2 portraits also fairly saturated, but also much lighter, and for some reason that kinkade purple/yellow is everywhere with the BG2 portraits lol. I mean beyond the execution of the paintings themselves and just into the overall levels and color palette. I did some experiments with Edwin, putting the Edwins I found side by side...

The middle Edwin (third from the left) is the standard BG1 Edwin portrait, the Edwin on the far right is basically the standard BG2 Edwin portrait but with the vibrancy juiced slightly. The Edwins on the far left have the saturation knocked way back by about 15 percent and that just about almost works I think. The Edwins between the BG1 and BG2, first has the BG2 face just pasted onto the BG1 background. Still super high saturation but rebalancing the Cyans/Magentas so that the reds would appear a bit more crimson and the golds a bit more golden I guess, prob just to get more Red in there - or then you got the second BG2 face pasted onto the BG1 robes version lol. I think that also almost works too. For Edwins at least you see a lot, because that robed look is easier to mess with in mirror image, though it would have been nice if we could control the lighting to get something even a little darker or more in shadow for the BG2s a bit more like the BG1. There's a bunch like that floating around in minor variations. Anyhow just to show how even the two pretty different styles could have been made a little more cohesive with that sort of stuff alone.



For Viconia, I see more tweaks to hue, especially in the BG2 comps like pushing from yellow to green or blowing out the levels or darkening the tone and things of that sort. Probably along the same lines as blue Edwin lol. Sometimes you see her with red eyes and things of that sort. The purple green Viconia variants are kinda cool though. Maybe to capture the ankheg plate vibes from BG1 I guess? Again knocking back the saturation for the defaults on either portrait gets you like halfway there, but the visualization and art style there is pretty different. The BG1 portrait is more dynamic I'd say, even with some of the oddball foreshortening, whereas BG2 is more demure and kinda bland that way, but I think the BG2 ended up more iconic in her case. Still gives a sense of the desire for more color variety there. Recolors were I think the most common and you saw a lot of those.



Overall when comparing the sets you can see that the BG2 portraits tilted pretty heavily towards yellows and pinks and lavender purples, all pastels really, and you don't get the nice deep blues or deep greens cause those are more muted and washed out there in BG2. The BG2 crops were also a bit closer, tighter in on the face, than the BG1s, which is another reason they didn't play all that well with each other. On the whole I always preferred the BG1 looks myself. Also just the fact that there were more of them I guess, with more variety and range. A lot of the BG2 characters were wearing that 'too cool for school face', or like pursed lips with steely glares, whereas the BG1s just had a lot more expression going on. Part of this was probably owing to the painting style I'm sure, or how they were rotoscoped and the detailing of the cartoons, but still, you can almost get the two sets to play nicely together just with some elbow grease on the levels. One of the popular things I recall seeing a lot for custom Portraits early on, was just a major color change for a BG1 portrait, so keeping the same face but with a different colored robe. (Blue Edwin basically lol) But you saw a lot of stuff like that.

That's why I think lighting and color would be a good way to distinguish one character avatar from another in BG3. In BG1/2 these portraits were all meant to display pretty small in the actual game, but even at a tiny scale you could still get a nice color sweep for a party comp and some flare in the individual facial expressions that still read at that size, which was nice. BG3 should try to do more of that within the Char creator, and give players some tools to manipulate the model, pose it and emote it, and then dress it up to suit their taste. That would be legit!

pps. lol

Different body types are a must. I hope they get implemented once we get half-orc as a playable race.
I also would like to see more faces or at least the ability to have all the available ones fit at least the characters of the same type (for example, make all elf, half-elf and drow faces available to ALL elves).
Also maybe the ability to change the texture of the skin after picking the face? Some presets come with freckles for example but what if I want a different face with freckless?

Oh and...
Please add scars! And the ability to change the color of each eye while also adding new textures for the eyes. I really want Zevlor's flaming irises for my tiefling! But that type of eye would look great on a warlock of any race, really.

Was thinking the exact same thing going through your posts (I agree with all of it).

These classics came to mind:



Some other games have this concept built in character creation. An example:



In a more artsy DnD style it could look like:



Speaking of the art direction of BG3, I have to say I'm not a big fan. The character models seem too polished and fairy-tale like when Faerun has plenty of gritty. I have a list of about 20 characters since I played BG2, some that I like to recycle for new games, but, except for my dwarven cleric, I simply cannot achieve the remotest resemblance with this editor, and definitely not human males. Most faces look like retiring choir boys just old enough to hammer a nail into a wooden plank. It wouldn't hurt to add some faces that don't look like they were just wiped clean with baby tissues. The stubble beard looks too akward to help make your character look more rough or rugged. Perhaps adding a few sliders for age, complexion and body types wouldn't hurt either.

Yes I would also really love to have more <fantasy> variety in the creator! It's really too clean, and everyone looks similar...like regular Earth humans are "dressing up" putting on a <your character> costume...is probably the best way I can describe it?

Planescape (TSR) is probably my favorite D&D setting for characters looks...