Larian Studios Forums Baldur's Gate III Baldur's Gate III - Suggestions & Feedback Bard Feedback

Couldn't see a thread for this so made one!

Subclass: College of Lore
Progress: Did all the content I could find in EA

Bard is one of my favourite classes in 5e and in my experience (as DM much more than player) at the table one of the strongest. But I think BG3's version is actually a bit behind the power curve compared to other classes. Not being as useful as they are in pen and paper is sort of inevitable because of less emphasis on what they do well, but not only do they not really have anything to bolster them in a combat role in compensation for missing utility, they are weaker in and out of combat than they should be.

Going through specifics-

Viscous Mockery: The piddling damage is always sort of a downside but against inflated health pools and large numbers of enemies in encounters this spell sucked. It didn't help my luck with getting it to stick seemed to be cursed, but there's not a lot of soft targets for wis saves either. In context it doesn't really compete with a crossbow, let alone a crossbow that's been dipped in a candle.

Dissonant Whispers: I'll chalk this one up as unfinished but it's kind of the bread and butter of Bards' spells at low levels and one their very few worth while damaging spells. Missing half its utility is a significant nerf to the class. In fairness it's a spell that is about swinging the reaction economy in a context where major changes are coming to that but this spell need to do what it's meant to do (deny reactions to target, trigger useful reactions in allies)

Cutting Words: This is another victim of how reactions are implemented but it does get a buff to compensate. But it's too much of an exercise in precognition on the player's part, it's clearly overall a nerf still. If you got the inspiration back if it was never used that would help a little. I get there might be some concern with this one that even if there was pop-up system for reaction it might trigger too often, limiting it to attacks, checks where the degree of success was within the range of the inspiration dice, along with hits it would probably be fine. It's a turn based game and the amount of opportunities to use this feature is its strength.

Friends: This cantrip was the cause of so much frustration for me. It is kind of worthless as implemented. The spell as written is kind of vague on down side but how its been converted into mechanical consequences makes it unusable. You don't really know if the consequence will trigger, if it will be disapproval conversation, which in itself makes the spell a net negative (you've traded a check without advantage for check with advantage followed by a check without advantage, or it's a cantrip with a ridiculously high material component cost), or straight to hostile. The best example I found of this not making the slightest sense was using it at Waukeen's rest with the Bard option to encourage the guards to knock down the door, going immediately to combat... in the middle of a burning building. Even from a simulation point of view it should be specific checks with friends that trigger consequence not any check with an NPC. If you aren't willing to role back the consequences by reloading then this cantrip is far too risky to use, and if you are then why not reload on failure. Either be upfront about what the consequence of using it will be and moderate those down a bit, remove the downside if it can't be implemented sensibly, or remove Friends as a trap spell choice.

Level 2 spell selection: It kind of needs acknowledging that Suggestion not being there kind of guts this spell level for bards and makes them worse at what they do. It does open up the possibility of taking a combat spell but the one recommended, Phantasmal Force is abysmal. Heat Metal is situationally great and buffed massively by the Fire Circlet, but even in BG3 it's a bit too situational. I guess there's also hold person but that has a lot of overlap with Hideous Laughter. I personally didn't take Enhance Ability as my second spell and ended up regretting it massively. But whatever spell choice a bard makes for their level 2 spell it's going to end up as a major part of their kit for a few levels.

College of Lore fixed skill selection: Not sure if this a bug or not, if not this is horrible and pointless nerf. Either way it was a nasty surprise.

Itemisation: not really a whole lot that's synergistic let alone anything that's bard specific. Finding the barbarian clothes made me a little sad.


Overall: I love Bard and will probably Bard in full release (multiclass into Life Cleric or a couple of levels of Warlock offsets a lot of their problems in this game's context) but in combat it kind of felt like a weaker control Sorcerer, no twinned Hold Person but also (and mainly) no choice not to be a control Sorcerer. The stand out part of their kit in my play through was Faerie Fire. But drop Faerie Fire hide at the back and spam dipped hand crossbows, occasionally throw out a cutting words which might or might not do anything isn't really the most exciting. A couple of skill Expertise doesn't really make up for that.

Little s suggestions: The thing Bard sort of needs ASAP is a synergistic item. A baby Instrument of the Bard with no spells but takes the more generous (and better) interpretation of inflicting disadvantage on saves against all their spells would do a lot to emphasise what's good about their combat kit. Dissonant Whispers desperately needs something in place of the big fat nothing it got to replace its utility. Lore bards need their skill selection.

Also there needs to be more opportunities for group jams with their instruments.