Larian Studios Forums Baldur's Gate III Baldur's Gate III - Suggestions & Feedback Intentional or a mistake that you can't move moonbeam and use heat armor in beast form?

Per the co-creator of 5e, you're supposed to be able to: https://twitter.com/ImRaijen/status/775125051263819776?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E775148210364948480%7Ctwgr%5E%7Ctwcon%5Es2_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.sageadvice.eu%2F2016%2F09%2F30%2Fcan-you-move-a-moonbeam-spell-as-a-druid-if-you-shape-shift-into-something-like-a-bear%2F

Yet, you can't in this game. Are they working on this or is this somehow an intentional nerf?

Don't expect it to change:

In 5e, you retain ALL of your class abilities when you wild shape, and are able to benefit from them as long as you can practically do so (Druid-Barbarians can Rage and use Reckless Attack while in a wild shape, for example).

This includes all functions that are a part of any spells you cast; you can attack with spiritual weapon, call lightning bolts, channel sun beams and yes, move your moon beam, all while in wild shape. You just can't *cast* a new spell.

In Larian-verse, you do NOT retain ANY of your class features when you wild shape, at all.
This player, jaded though she be, feels that this is unlikely to change, no matter how much anyone asks.

There's been a lot of hyperbole on this board, but this would LITERALLY RUIN DRUIDS. This is the entire point. The bread and butter of a moon druid is to cast call lightning while flying around. Literally the reason druids have all these multiple turn activation spells is BECAUSE they are designed to function with the beast forms. The class is designed around this entire dynamic. If Larian doesn't fix that, they may as well delete the class.

Sadly I don't expect it to change, but it's another great point. Please also post in "technical and gameplay problems".

That's a bummer.

I didn't even try it with moonbeam. That spells feels like the indoor lightning bolt for sure hehe, except we get to choose where the bolt is striking too. I had fun with it.

I trried the Flaming Sphere a few times, but it felt a bit wonky and kept getting disrupted. Seems like would have been more fun if done in a similar way to the moonbeam instead of as a summon for that one.

For wild shape, I always pictured the shapeshifted animal or elemental form as being similar conceptually to the conjuring or summons version of the spells. Like as if it pulled an actual animal from nearby into the Druids space for their mind to inhabit. Maybe the druid's normal physical body is phasing into some other space or nature plane, while there consciousness remains to enter the animal directly. Or their disembodied mind can manipulate the nature magic in the zone like a puppet master while that's happening too. To me that just seems like a more fitting explanation of why the HP works as it does, and gives a sort of logic to the animal forms available, as opposed to like a polymorph transmogrify into anything you can think of or that you've seen before with the right CR. But that's more like a lore or supporting explanation thing in my head I guess hehe. Wink at GOT " but backwards!" where it's the bodies teleporting to the wherever the minds were located rather than vice versa. That sort of works. Maybe the bear mind is hanging out in the human's body during that same time, just sort of chilling wherever the bear was called from, maybe down by the river lol. Anyhow, that's kinda how I pictured it explaining how the class features persist. Basically the druid becoming disembodied or sending their body somewhere else, while controlling the nature magic in the room + the called animal that they brought in to inhabit. But anyway, yeah, it would be cooler if we retained the class features and ability to manipulate the stuff that's already in play, whether lightning or flames or moonbeams or whatever

It wouldn't just be cooler, it would be the way it's supposed to work. I'm very worried about this, because it really does ruin the class. It's meant to be a full caster, including when you're shapeshifted. The way they've implemented flaming sphere scares the crap out of me if they only way they can give you something you can use is a summoned object. This is a big problem now, but it will be an absolute disaster if druid can't use its bread and butter, call lightning, properly.

If they don't include that then I hope add something else to wild shape

As it is wild shape is nerfed into oblivion. You can't control your concentration spells, you can't attack twice as a bear, the whole thing is messed up.

Is it still the same?

Oh damn, what?

I meant to keep checking If moving moonbeam also costs an action in wildshape, but now it's just gone...

Does wildshape even have literally any function aside being able to die 3 times before it eats into your HP?

Or do you also die now instead of changing back into human form??

My druid is so incredibly useless and weak next to the paladins and Astarion. Moonbeam doesn't even consistently damage anymore at the start of enemy turn. The 100% hit chance is nice. It works fine against low hp ranged enemies. At Level 5, though, that Moon druid will do 1/5th the damage of any other class.

It was meant to be a melee challenge, but... She just keeps losing concentration on Flame Blade for No reason. That spell is good for one or two turns

Not class features because there are none for the druid to retain currently, but druids do retain racial features and feats in wildshape. I tested the mobile feat and the fey-ancestry racial feature and both of them maintained in wildshape (i.e. I could not be put to sleep while in wildshape and I was able to attack and run away without invoking attacks of opportunity)

There also is a mod that fixes the wildshape / moonbeam issue, so I have hope Larian will be able to do themselves.

Ah, that's a fix since I last played druid then, Beargor - good to know ^.^ When I first played it all non-animal features, feats and abilities disappeared.

I'm waiting for multiclass, so I can make a druid-fighter, and watch Larian animate a bear doing a leg sweep when I use tripping attack while in wildshape...

Yea I had a feeling it wasn't always like this but wasnt 100% sure.

For multiclassing, I honestly have 0 faith that Larian will implement it correctly, especially for things interacting with wildshape (like barbarians rage) so I likely won't even touch it myself.

I actually just tested the fighter/wildshape trip attack (since you can get maneuvers with the martial adept feat) and it does not work, so I guess not all class/racial features interact how they should and kind of enforces my above statement.

I get the feeling Larian hates anything that makes the Druid fun. At this rate, a ranger's summon will be stronger than a whole ass druid. Unless druids suddenly become super OP at late level... which I don't really doubt either.

As is, flameblade keeps disappearing for no reason. Moonbeam isn't consistently damaging enemies unless they stand still. It eats my whole turn to get an average 10.5 damage at level 4. Compare to at least 21 pre patch. You can get around it by attacking ranged enemies only, but that bug is FOUL.

Enemies suddenly pretty much always pass the ensnaring vine check after patch 9, making it useless. At level 5, wildshape is weak, low hp and has no ranged options. Aside from that lightning spell at level 5, damage options are nonexistent.

I think it's bad luck, but my Druid is also almost always failing every attribute check possible. /Especially/ what she's specialized for. Unlike my paladins, who are suddenly masters of the arcane, history and nature. Those "karmic dice" are iffy. I have yet to get the opportunity to play and turn them off. I swear that druid was hit more often at 19 AC than the paladins at as low as 14.

Enemies resist thunderwave somewhat more, too, unless it's the giant fucking spider queen and Astarion holding a scroll. Don't throw spider queens onto paladins, it does weird poison damage.

Druid was the first class added to EA and it has sucked since and not been addressed.

The fact no one plays it on streams should tell you a lot. They also catered way more to other class releases in terms of special equips and items.

I don't know why they released this class first for everything to be bugged or underpowered.

It's really disappointing because the druid's resistance to dying was very useful on my casters only playthrough. In a no casters party, a druid is just wasteful after level 3. The moonbeam can take out low hp casters effectively, but that's it. A different dex class or a fighter specialised in ranged combat is just better

Moonbeam is actually bugged right now, double dipping. As a level 2 it does 4d10, but should only do 2d10. It does 2d10 when cast, and then 2d10 again at the beginning of the targets turn. So I guess if you hate it now as one of the strongest spells druids have, you'll really hate it when it's fixed.

But ya, wildshapes suck. They are good for level 2-3 content, as that's what they seem to be balanced around, but they suck against level 4-5 stuff. Even the level 4 wildshapes are roughly on par with level 2-3 stuff lol. Beastmasters level 5 companions are wildly superior to any wildshapes. Not even close.

I have a druid and it's not bugged for me that way. 2d10 yes, but I'm at times not getting the extra damage at start of enemy turn. If it moves, it doesn't get hit by moonbeam again. Often, anyway. Also, If you move moonbeam, you lose any other opportunity to attack. Before this patch it was a solid 4d10, moveable in wild shape. It feels nerved to hell. It wasn't a real 4d10 because it saves half the time, but it could be alright for a half tank/half caster.

The only way to go is Flame Blade, (18) Flame Blade again (18) with Item Bonus Action + normal melee attack (11). If flameblade deigned to work properly, that is. The averages are lower, but it evens out to hitting with one spell that doesn't suck.

I truly hope they fix these issues before launch.