Larian Studios Forums Baldur's Gate III Baldur's Gate III - Suggestions & Feedback Wolfheart's feedback on QoL

This not my first barbeque. And not my first Larian RPG.

We will see how will the things be in August.

Well, that feels unnecesary agresive ... :-/
But hey, if you wish to compare, lets compare!

Yes.

I get that is what you wish ...
But im affraid that doesnt make it true.

As far as i know, nobody ever said they cant ... many people claim they wouldnt be, mostly for good reasons tho.

Most important parameter here is if they "translate well into video game" ...
And to made it super clear, it dont really matter if *you* think they do ... what matters is if Sven thinks they do ...

Thats not true and you know it, its written in that link you posted last time, you just need to read whole sentence not just that part that suits you.

Basic math:

Potion of Healing ... heals 2d4+2
Meaning 4-10hp
It costs you Bonus Action to heal this way.
Uses of Bonus Action were described abowe.

Healing Word ... heals 1d4 ... if used by Life Cleric, it heals additional 3 HP
Meaning 4-7hp
It costs *you* nothing, bcs the one who is casting the spell is Cleric.
Uses of Bonus Action you just saved were described abowe.

Mass Healing Word ... heals 1d4+3 for up to 6 friendly targets around ... if used by Life Cleric, it heals additional 5 HP
Meaning 9-12hp per character
It costs *you* nothing, bcs the one who is casting the spell is Cleric.

Preserve Life ... heals 3* Cleric level to ALL friendly characters around ...
Meaning 3+ per character ... potential of this spells is basicaly limitless, bcs when you use it for example during Siege of Druids groove, you can heall ALL refugees at once.
It costs *you* nothing, bcs the one who is casting the spell is Cleric.

So ... taken over and over, basically every heal in game is better than potion.
But wait! There is more!
Bcs (and this is quite important part) by using certain artefacts each of just listed heals (that are allready better than potions) ... can be even stronger!
And that is power of healer.

Also, by using healer you have saved your own resources that can be used offensively (again, uses of Bonus Action were described abowe) wich leads to more damage ... wich leads to shorter combat ... wich leads to effectiveness in combat.
And that is true power of healer.

Yes, you have limited suply of spelslosts ...
Less and less limited actually as you grow stronger, but since there is no limitation of Long Rests and enough Food and Camp Suplies to rest thrice between each encounter ... this isnt really a limitation of game, that is just in your own head.

On the contrary.
You dont need endless suplement of healing ... bcs there is limited amount of enemies.
All you need is to being kept alive as long as there are enemies ...

The effectively you kill enemies, the less healing you need.
You use your own resource to attack > you are more effective.

It really is simple as that.

It certainly doenst feel that way. :-/
Actually reading this topic makes me question if you even played this game at least once.

This question was allready answered ... repeating it dont make your point true.

Well, if the group will never stop, you dont have three warriors ... you have three assholes!
And in such group nobody who isnt one of assholes will never have fun no matter the system.

Its foolish to blame game for that.

Just out of curiosity ...
Wich potion or scroll will restore Second Wind, or Adrenaline Rush for them? O_o

Hint: None.
Thats why even they WILL sooner or later rest.

Seems like somebody had some bad experience and decided to damn whole existence for it, huh?

You can relax, this is a single player game ... besides other options.
Meaning you can play as slowly as you want.

Feeling is mutual ...
You are the one who is arguing that nothing have purpose if there is other (seemingly more effective ... even if in fact its not) way to do things. :-/

Also, since you bited this ...
Looking up at what you just wrote:
You know that Sven had litteraly nothing to do with earlier BG games, right? O_o

//Edit:
One moe thing ... you keep repeating "placeholder", "placeholder" ...
As if that would mean anything.

Yes, we are all aware that there were (and sometimes maybe even still are) placeholders in this game ... aswell as experimental mechanics ... or things Larian simply wanted to try.
I would even dare to say that most people, that are still active on this forum since beginning of EA, were even eye withnesses on how certain placeholders are replaced with more or less finished, or at very least more advanced, version of themselves.

But what point would serve, if Larian would let us test a mechanic for TWO AND HALF FREAKING YEARS ... that will either never be used, or was long time ago replaced by something else that was finished and they find it better, it is something people ARE actively asking for (for example Cantrip limtation was requested several times) but will never be tested? O_o

What purpose would that serve i ask?
(Hint: None.)

Okay, folks, looks like it’s time to agree to disagree again, and let’s try to keep things calm, friendly and respectful.

Apart from bug fixes and of course added content, I HIGHLY DOUBT things will change much up to release in three months.
Those who believe that things will drastically changed haven't been gaming much in the last decade. Loving/hating Swen and Larian is irrelevant.
The EA released over two years ago, and based on the changes up to now and its current dev. once can easily conclude things are DONE and pretty much set in stone.
The game is finished. Larian is in final testing, bug squishing, platform compatibilities, and getting ready for release. After 5 years of internal DEV. thats just how things work for the last 3~6 months.

Im going to just reply shortly, your still not getting that most of the consumables is used with a bonus action, where as a spell is a real action in almost all cases, there is exceptions... so again, your trying to make out that if people have access to a endless supply of bonus action heals, that it wont go out on casters limited supply of real action healing... im not sure what im soposed to say...

Its like having the argument all over where people used a 1hp cantrip heal to cast is 114 times to heal the warrior, and not understanding the implications balance wise... lets agree to disagree...

Mod asked us to stop so im going to stop... eitherwise im fairly sure we are getting a fantastic game, and it will all be answeared in august

On the contrary, I believe that there are still features prone to changes or waiting to be added.
It is more apparent when you check SteamDB, where we can see that the main development branch and the private playtesting branches are living in parallel of the EA builds. If you are familiar with development, you can deduce that what we currently have is the version we had 3 years ago with arbitrary patches merged to it. This method is easier for them in order to isolate specific features for public testing, while others are held private indefinitely (multiclassing, missing races, monk, body shapes...) until they are deemed ready for the consumer.

I repeat ... calmly, friendly and respectfuly:

Bonus Action
Bonus Action
Action ... but potentialy infinite times stronger

Those links are not there for fun ...
Check them, if you dont believe me.

Alright, since you keep poking the issue... the problem is and i repeat, if i have 4 warriors, they can keep going, never having to rest, as they can access a magical storage, and more or less keep fueling what they do, with a unlimited supply of potions and scrolls... where as any group with a caster would have to rest that caster several times to refreash their spell pool...

and your healing word does a whooping D4 + casterbonus, you can ofcourse over cast it, for a whooping extra D4 healing... and again, all spell slots is limited... if we put this against healing potions... you can use a normal healing potiont 2D4+2, 4D4+4, 8d4+8 and ultimatly supreme healing potion that heals 10d4 +20 and its something anyone can use, with a bonus action... and you never have to stop to rest, andyou dont have to tie up one slot in your group for healing, as you can just use a extra warrior to dish out damage... and need more healing, just grab more pots and ointments or what you need, its a unlimited supply just around the corner...

now not only do a caster also have certain levels to get the dices, or higher level spells, it also tied up spell slots in order to get that healing... wheres potions is allways just a question of money... and even high level potions can be used by lower level characters... why have a character tied up on healing spells when you can have 4 warriors, with 10d4 +20 heals used with a bonus ation... to even be able to that kind of healing you need to be fairly high level, and what is the max in BG3, think Sven hinted something like 11-12...

If you are 9th level cleric, you can do use a fifth level slot and do a 5D4 + casterbonus heal... with a bonus action... where as same 9th level warrior just keep doing damage, never need to stop, and can chug 10D4 +20 bonus action heals... couse why sleep or rest, when you have a unlimited magical closet around the corner... and even heals with real actions, will have hard to top 10D4 +20, espechially with the soposedly level cap, and the problem allways comes back to, why bother with it, all your consumables is more or less a corner away, where as the casters spells is a long rest...

This is why alot of people have finished act1, and never needed to rest, and the stuff in places, never developed couse, why would it, no one need to rest... so again...

this is the 1hp healing cantrip all over...

Okay, I’ve asked once before and this is the final warning. I don’t want to start giving timeouts, but I will if folk show they’re not able to judge reasonably for themselves when to stop arguing and de-escalate.

There is nothing wrong with detailed discussion as long as it’s friendly, constructive and all parties are enjoying it. But that’s not the vibe I’m getting here.

i apologice, and will step away... my bad

About changes? We haven't seen the final build. Until aug we dont know exactly what changes larian has made in their build.

Talking about scrolls I'm curious whether larian will use 5e rules. Let's say they add shield scrolls (either by crafting or finding/ buying). At the moment a BM could buy all the scrolls and use shield, then why have a EK? Now a barb can use non conc spell scrolls, then start combat and rage. Larian changed wiz learning from any scroll...but I'm not sure if/ how they will further change scrolls.

But I can't wait to find out! Is it august yet?

No.

Yeah, when watching the video, I had thoughts similar to what Tuco (and possibly others) have expressed.

Wolfheart always sounds as if he is walking on eggs when giving feedback on his YouTube channel. For instance, he tends to phrase feedback videos as questions, like "Do we need improvements?" or the "It's Time To Make Some Improvements!? (QOL)" that I linked in the opening post.

But that very careful, very diplomatic approach didn't prevent the party movement scheme from showing up twice in his general (non patch-specific) feedback videos.

___


Side note, but that's not as minor to me. I like having my best tank at the front, and my most squishy character at the back. However, by merely selecting characters, Grouping and Ungrouping them (so, by merely playing the game, really), the order of portraits changes. So I have to re-arrange them if I want some control on positioning. Also, if I don't re-order portraits, it means I can't mentally associate the shortcut F1 to Lae'zel and F4 to Gale. Instead, I need to verify constantly where Gale is in the portraits column before clicking F#, by which time the shortcut isn't really saving me time anymore.

Interestingly enough, this issue recently showed up in a Reddit discussion. (Interestingly, there was a discussion about party controls on Reddit, in which just about everyone was complaining. Yes, Reddit.)

But hey, it's not as if this, or the generally poor usability of the party control system, is any news at that point.

___


Overall, I didn't mean to highlights specific feedback points, and I doubt there is much value in us going through the list, and adding our personal +1/0/-1 to each thing
Wolfheart listed. Larian most probably doesn't care about those anyway.

I don't know how Wolfheart assembled his list. Maybe he just went for his top 13 issues with the UI. Maybe he factored in what could be achieved more easily (by Larian before release, by Larian after release, or by some modder watching his videos). Maybe he factored in things that were not too controversial (just like he doesn't want to cross Larian, he doesn't want to cross his audience). I don't know.

Personally, my top 13 doesn't quite look like the 13 points he listed. But whatever. Between nothing and Wolheart's list (100%, can't pick), I'd take that list any day.

___


And thanks to The Red Queen for the moderation. It may be a thankless job, but it makes the forums more readable.

I believe he asked people to send him suggestions on his Discord, from wich he then picked what he concidered most relevant.

For some people that might be considered "minor"...for me this a game breaking annoyance. I am not (more like, I just CANNOT have the patience) going through a 200hour game with such system.
I would bite the bullet if the game was 10-20 hours of course.
Its like asking console gamers to play BG3 with a mouse and keyboard because it is just a superior control theme; and if you don't like it, well tough, no more controller support (aka; that stupid UI party control). The story and gameplay is amazing anyways! So tough it up.

I really hope Larian goes back to the traditional single player mouse/keyboard party controls UI. And keep the current system for Consoles/Multiplayer (controllers).
Having both, everybody is happy.

Seems like game have some pre-defined order of our companions, to wich it keeps sorting them when we disasemble our group via hotkey ...

I used mod to expand my group to 8 (3 Tavs + All companions) and i noticed it keeps sorting to same patern!

@Cour Turnipsome @DarthMalorn
Minor as in it's not game breaking (stop you from playing the game). I actually didn't know about it for a while, just recently noticed what was happening in the last test. Good to see more people are being vocal about it then, I only use reddit for marvel snap so I don't keep up with it.

I'd like to add that a additional hotkey to connect to top character when highlighted character is disconnected would be pretty sweet, along with a fix for what was mentioned.