Larian Studios Forums Baldur's Gate III Baldur's Gate III - General Why is Shadowheart so hush-hush about Shar? Silly? Needless?

I like the idea of SH being a selunite. My own theory is that she's not just a Selunite but a corrupted avatar of Selune herself. SH doesn't know much about her background but the other companions were very high level before capture - Gale would have been lvl 20 and a chosen so an avatar would be at that same level.

The other outside possibility is that she's a silverfire wielder.

Don't get me wrong I have plenty of critiques of BG3 but this isn't one of them - SH as Patty Hearst sounds fun. I just like redemption stories.


Admittedly, I have a whole headcannon about Viconia but the romanced Viconia doesn't behave like a good Sharran. Can't remember what triggers it but there is line with a good charname that suggest Shar isn't entirely happy her. The line goes something like "if I did that Shar would be even more upset with me than she is right now . . . "

SH is acting more like a Sharran cleric would. If anything she reveals too much too early.

I think SH might have been a Selunite Priestess. Chosen ones being trendy, she might even be a chosen of Selune.
And in my fantasies she would transcend duality in the end, and help reunite Shar & Selune as they were initially united, maybe lauching a new faith / becoming a chosen of both :
Lore : "Yet they were so close they saw themselves as one being, known later as the Two-Faced Goddess or the Sisters-Who-Were-One. They complemented each other[6][33][34][35] and brought order out of the chaos.[11]

Yep, mileage definitely varies . I'll admit that the idea of SH being either a chosen or even an avatar of Selune strikes me as just too much, especially as I think Gale was a chosen of Mystra (which I really don't mind and in fact like the idea of exploring someone who has been so high in their deity's favour and how they put their lives back together - or fail to - once they've fallen from it, but one is enough in my party).

I also really hope that it doesn't transpire that more party members were once really powerful and no longer are. At the moment the only party member that's definitely true of is Gale, until he pissed off Mystra. We know Wyll used to be at least somewhat more powerful but not how much or why he isn't any more, perhaps something to do with his falling out with Mizora or her capture, and for me even that's now starting to stretch it. But there's no evidence I'm aware of in game that SH, Astarion or Lae'zel were ever any more powerful than level 1 and I hope it stays that way.

I know I said I have a high tolerance for coincidences that lead to good stories, but I have my limits!

And I know some folk have theorised that the tadpole implantation has nerfed everyone's powers, but again I don't think there's any definitive evidence of that in the EA game and hope that's not the route Larian are going.

But I'd not completely dismiss any idea until I've actually seen it executed and perhaps Larian's writers could make it work for me after all, so I will try to keep my mind open.

Other people are clearly getting more out of the village than I am. In all my playthroughs I never really cared about the village or considered it more than just a village. I assumed that it was destroyed by the cult at some point before I read otherwise on this forum, and Kethric thorm certainly never stuck in my mind as a character, certainly not a potentially interesting one.

I don't have anything against coincidences either ingeneral. My read on Shadowheart's reaction to the village is just that it's reminding her of her childhood, and the statue is triggering weird powers just because of her connectionto Selune, whatever that may be. I just think that structurally it doesn't make sense for the ruined village to be where Shadowheart came from. We're going to be leaving this area and based on how thing are structured, it wouldn't make sense for us to come back. I also don't think that "you know that meaningless ruin from the first zone? That was actually your home!" would be a very interesting reveal. It's just an empty husk. If it were some sort of hub or it had any sort of initial significance or meaning then maybe I would feel different, but as it is now, it's just a generic ruined village with nothing special to make it stand out.


I don't know what a silverfire wielder is but I think having her be an avatar of Selune would feel cheap. Why would Shar have such a powerful being go on a mission like the one she was on? That sounds likea mission for expendable members. Furthermore, if she were that powerful and important then I feel as though Shar would be paying closer attention, and would have snatched Shadowheart back at the first opportunity. Having her just be a normal person I think makes for a better story. We already have Mystra, the dead three and potentially an archdevil connected to the story, I think having more divine involvement after a point would bog things down unless Larian is very deliberately giving us the opportunity to interact with all these gods.

tbh she doesn't have any obvious shar symbol on her. no black disk surrounding with a purple ring.

to our knowledge she is not from there. blighted village/moon haven was ruined at least 100 yrs ago. even she was there she would look much older now. the location is actually .

You right to say that 100 year old half elf would look like she were in her 40s or 50s but if she were chosen she wouldn't age so I'm not giving up on that theory yet . . .

Silver fire is raw magic. All of Mystra's chosen can wield it but few others can - perhaps one or two people in a generation.


Silverfire can repair places where the weave is torn -- transforming wild magic and anti-magic zones -- and the chosen are supposed to devote some amount of time to doing this. Silverfire wielders are like the antibodies of the weave.

https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Silver_fire

If that is silverfire in the animation it could make for an interesting clash with Gale if he is, as I suspect, linked to the shadow weave since the clash of silverfire and shadow magic can have catastrophic effects:

https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Silver_fire

Okay, perhaps I'd better put the pivot in career to video game writer on the back burner for now


Really? I was thinking late 30s based on a half-elven lifespan of 180 years vs a human one of ~70 and the guess that, as with the maturing process, the aging process for half-elves was of a similar duration to humans and it's the bit in the middle that's stretched out. But as you know the FR lore much better than I do, I guess I need to revise that. Plus I think 180 might be really old for a half-elf, so not comparable with 70 for a human. But while I'd put SH at mid-thirties if she were a human, I wouldn't say forties is out of the question as I don't think she looks all that much younger than me. But I'm probably fooling myself about that just as much as that there's a snowball's chance in hell that my outside bet will turn out to be true. And anyway all that comparison ignores that folk probably have harder lives in Faerun so could look older than a modern, western Earthling of the same age, even if Faerunian life expectancies don't sound mediaeval.

Despite everything, I nevertheless refuse to give up on my pet theory entirely until I play the game and find out what SH's real story is. And of course everyone else has the right to cling to theirs just as fiercely

no confirmation on her selune side but one thing can be certain about her Sharran path is that

Just a guess - you could be correct. I just guesstimated 40-50 since half elves start dying of old age around as early as 125 and as late as 180. I took 60 "humans dying early" age.

Off topic

@ALexws Yes, that's one of the reasons I believe she might be an avatar or chosen.

None of this still gets to my issue, which is how come Selune, a greater god, didn't do anything to protect her faithful and allowed Shar to take one of her presumably precious people? If this isn't explained in a credible and lore-appropriate way in the game, then the whole "brainwashed Selunite" story is crap. Plus, I hate redemption stories (sorry @KillerRabbit, we have to disagree on this). They generally don't pass the believability test with me.

I didn't think Shar and Selune generally got personally involved in the day-to-day fights between their worshippers, and in fact thought part of the reason for chosen was to do stuff on their behalf? If SH was somehow so special that Selune would have specific reason to intervene on her behalf, such as being a chosen or an avatar, then in that case I would expect some story about why Selune didn't or couldn't help her and I'm sure one would be provided at the appropriate place, which wouldn't be in the part of the game we've seen (whether it would satisfy us as individual gamers is a different matter). If she's just a member of the congregation, as it were, I'd just put it down to ongoing religious conflict and I'd be more surprised if Selune had done something than that she didn't! Thus far, therefore, and until we get more of the real story, I confess I don't share that specific issue.

it's not uncommon for this to happen. someone mentioned another Selune chosen got brainwashed and almost completely work for Sharran. even Selune herself fell for Shar's power in times of trouble.

Perhaps the core of SH's personal quest is that Selune IS reaching out to help her, albeit in a very subtle and inscrutable way. And that your choices are either facilitating or hindering it.

Yes. An avatar of Mystra was corrupted by Bane so there is precedent.

As to why Selune didn't intervene - I assume she did so in the form of granting her clerics the ability to fight back. We have to remember that when Selune descends to directly challenge Shar's followers Shar shows up soon after. And Selune is weaker than Shar, her power waxes and wanes while Shar has only gotten more powerful by absorbing other gods.

Of course Selune is usually backed by Mystra but I don't think Mystra wants to yet another direct confrontation between the sisters- the battle could tear apart Baldur's Gate.

Now I'm just making this up - I only have the silver-white of the magic, the fact that SH says the power is 'definitely' not Sharran in origin, the ambiguous language around 'the weapon' and the fact that SH is interested in the names of kids in the village to back up my theory.

And of course the guess that Larian wants all origin characters to be equally compelling. If Gale is a chosen who has a shadow mythallar in his chest - I wouldn't be surprised if Lae'zel was literally Vlaakith's daughter, that Wyll could become a grand duke of baldur's gate . . .

in fact, in datamine . As for Laezel, I think it is very unlikely. the current Vlaakithi is a lich and known for not having any descends. otherwise, Laezel would just be the next Vlaakith queen.

Well yes, I'm commenting based on people suggesting SH could have been Selune's chosen or such. Obviously if she had been just simply a nobody who worshipped Selune, then it's not relevant. Although then I'd wonder why she was selected by Shar for such a big, special task.

And no, Selune is not "weaker" than Shar. Specifically in 5e, she's a greater deity equal to Shar.

This won't happen in any run through the game that I may undertake. If Larian tries to make any of their origin companions more special/powerful/central to the game than my custom PC, that companion will be meeting a swift termination from the game.

I wonder if from Larian's perspective, they're thinking "oh, the player will WANT to be one of our origin characters, so let's make them really special", so in their minds, it's a positive, whereas the more older school types prefer to make their own character and resent having all their companions be more important than they are.

I'd rather play an origin character than my own Tav.