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Originally Posted by Sozz
Don't equate magic with being 6 years old

This also isn't what I asked or the scenario that I gave.

Can't I just say...

Don't equate magic with bear sex?

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Originally Posted by crashdaddy
You know I've just read the previous page and I now regret it. I think some of the comments there are maybe bordering on stuff that might be triggering for other members and I think maybe people should be mindful of that in their hypotheticals

Someone in this very thread said that the scene Larian depicted was triggering for them.

So is it okay for them to do it?

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amd will one of them lay egg ?

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Originally Posted by Lake Plisko
Originally Posted by mrfuji3
6 year olds can't meaningfully consent. If it was shown then it'd be rape, pedophilia, etc. (Which is bad)

An adult member of sapient/sentient species--human, elf, dragonborn, devil, dragon, lizardfolk, halfling, or a elf temporarily transformed into a bear--can consent. That's the difference.

Elves, dragonborns, devils, dragons, lizardfolk and halflings are not real things.

But bears are.

What if it was an adult elf that transformed into a six year old - would it then be okay to show on screen?

So if he turned into an owlbear you would be cool with it?


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Originally Posted by Lake Plisko
Originally Posted by Sozz
Isn't this what people already say about romancing halflings and gnomes. Do you agree with them?

This literally has nothing to do with the question I asked.

No - I do not equate being short with being six years old.
Bur nobody is saying that that is ok. What they are saying is that if you are an adult but are short as a six year old, you should still have right to have sex.

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Originally Posted by Lake Plisko
Originally Posted by mrfuji3
6 year olds can't meaningfully consent. If it was shown then it'd be rape, pedophilia, etc. (Which is bad)

An adult member of sapient/sentient species--human, elf, dragonborn, devil, dragon, lizardfolk, halfling, or a elf temporarily transformed into a bear--can consent. That's the difference.

Elves, dragonborns, devils, dragons, lizardfolk and halflings are not real things.

But bears are.

What if it was an adult elf that transformed into a six year old - would it then be okay to show on screen?
Man can you please stop making up the pedo scenarios im finding it really creepy, maybe just take 5min and move on from this thread for half an hour to calm down, understand your point and i understand where ur coming from, i dont really like the bear scene either so im going to actively avoid it, this thread is something im intrested in so just asking in good faith could you tone it down please mate

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Originally Posted by LostSoul
"Who else watched bear sex with their kid?"

I did not watch bear sex with my child.
+1

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Originally Posted by williams85
Originally Posted by Lake Plisko
Originally Posted by Sozz
Isn't this what people already say about romancing halflings and gnomes. Do you agree with them?

This literally has nothing to do with the question I asked.

No - I do not equate being short with being six years old.
Bur nobody is saying that that is ok. What they are saying is that if you are an adult but are short as a six year old, you should still have right to have sex.

... I agree?

I'm not saying short adults shouldn't be able to have sex. I'm not sure how anyone could get that out of anything I have said.

I'm saying depicting a six year old having sex, even if it is an adult that magically transformed into a six year old, is wrong. Just like depicting having sex with animals, even if someone magically transformed into an animal, is also wrong.

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Originally Posted by Lake Plisko
I think depicting bestiality in media is wrong.

This seems like a reasonable statement.

When "not wanting to see bestiality in media" becomes controversial, something might be wrong?

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Originally Posted by Xzoviac
Man can you please stop making up the pedo scenarios im finding it really creepy, maybe just take 5min and move on from this thread for half an hour to calm down, understand your point and i understand where ur coming from, i dont really like the bear scene either so im going to actively avoid it, this thread is something im intrested in so just asking in good faith could you tone it down please mate

It's cool man.

I also find the subject unsettling and sickening.

Just like... wait for it...

Bestiality!

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Originally Posted by Lake Plisko
Originally Posted by neprostoman
I also feel like this would be inappropriate and terrible. I also think that you have the right to have bad feelings about it and express your thoughts and opinion. I don't know the details of your private chat with RQ, so I can't tell if you are really getting offered a ban just for this opinion. But just letting things cool down does not mean abstaining from your opinion on the matter, right?

I don't really need to cool down... I'm not worked up, dude! smile

I think depicting bestiality in media is wrong. Don't think Larian should have done it, even behind a choice-wall. Don't think they should have shown it on PFH even if they warned people about mature content. Do I hate them now and think they are the worst people ever in the history of life? No. I think they made a mistake - a mistake they will stand by. I can respect that and move on from it.

But when you show something like that you are obviously going to have people sharing their opinion. I think my opinion is just as valid as anyone else's... and not only do I think it is as valid, I think it is just blatantly and obviously correct. So I see no problem in sharing it. I do not think I have said anything offense. If I get banned for it, then so be it! I guess I will have to do my BG3 discussing elsewhere.

What I meant is that your opinion is not going anywhere. The chance of you changing someone's mind in the discussion taking place in a forums format is zero to none, partially thats because the topic turned out to be so divisive and personal.

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Originally Posted by JandK
Originally Posted by Lake Plisko
I think depicting bestiality in media is wrong.

This seems like a reasonable statement.

When "not wanting to see bestiality in media" becomes controversial, something might be wrong?

You would think so.

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I think I am seeing two strains of thought, philosophically, in this chat and I think we can focus more on the forms of the arguments than on arguing with each other:

On the one hand, this makes sense WITHIN the universe it occurs and is not bestiality WITHIN the universe it occurs, given it occurs between two consenting adults under temporary magical conditions.

On the other hand, from OUTSIDE the universe WITHIN our OWN universe, it is unarguably a portrayal of a serious sexual taboo in its appearance at the very least.

Can we agree on that point?


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Originally Posted by Lake Plisko
I think depicting bestiality in media is wrong.
It. Is. A. Magic. Bear. In a magical, nonexistent world. The bear is an adult participating in a consensual adult activity. Context is so important, don't ignore it. Everything can be taken out of context by mistake, but you are doing it on purpose.

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But when you show something like that you are obviously going to have people sharing their opinion. I think my opinion is just as valid as anyone else's... and not only do I think it is as valid, I think it is just blatantly and obviously correct. So I see no problem in sharing it. I do not think I have said anything offense. If I get banned for it, then so be it! I guess I will have to do my BG3 discussing elsewhere.
You *think* you're right and you are not stating your opinion - you are calling for censorship. Opinion would be if you told us "I don't agree with this, I wouldn't show this to my kids, and I refuse to choose it.", instead you go "It shouldn't be in the game because I think it's wrong!" when in fact it doesn't show anything illegal. See the difference?

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Originally Posted by Vitani
Originally Posted by Lake Plisko
I think depicting bestiality in media is wrong.
It. Is. A. Magic. Bear. In a magical, nonexistent world. The bear is an adult participating in a consensual adult activity. Context is so important, don't ignore it. Everything can be taken out of context by mistake, but you are doing it on purpose.

Quote
But when you show something like that you are obviously going to have people sharing their opinion. I think my opinion is just as valid as anyone else's... and not only do I think it is as valid, I think it is just blatantly and obviously correct. So I see no problem in sharing it. I do not think I have said anything offense. If I get banned for it, then so be it! I guess I will have to do my BG3 discussing elsewhere.
You *think* you're right and you are not stating your opinion - you are calling for censorship. Opinion would be if you told us "I don't agree with this, I wouldn't show this to my kids, and I refuse to choose it.", instead you go "It shouldn't be in the game because I think it's wrong!" when in fact it doesn't show anything illegal. See the difference?

I understand the context. I am not taking it out of context.

This is why I proposed another sexual taboo that makes a lot of people uncomfortable in the same context or scenario. Not to 'trigger' people, but to point out that sexual taboos do not suddenly just lose all meaning because we put magic behind them. Magical bestiality is not okay. Just like magical pedophilia is not okay. Just like magical 'consent' or 'force' is not okay. I don't really want those things depicted in games.

Also - I do think we should censor bestiality. So... yes, I am saying that. I am calling for the censorship of bestiality. I do not think it should be in media we consume. You got me?

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I watched the stream on my own, though there was someone nearby I felt it would be really awkward to potentially speak with about this particular scene, so I dumped the volume by a lot and switched to another tab for its duration as it's also content I find distasteful. I mean it was pretty obvious what was coming.

Originally Posted by colinl8
As for trusting the rating and Swen's verbal note... I'm really jaded about that stuff. So often, that kind of stuff just means "warning: boobs". When they started the scene, and we see Halsin's ass, I assumed that's what Swen's note was about, "hey, two dudes are about to get naked and have sexytime," which gets content warnings for some reason, and my mind boggles why we hide normal human stuff from nearly-adult kids

I wasn't complaining about the scene or its inclusion at all, at least that wasn't my intention. I was just ruminating on the weird situation I was in when my assumption about the content warnings was completely wrong

Then maybe you've learned a lesson? Err on the side of caution, consider warnings to have meaning and not just pull a Barbossa: "it's more like a general guideline anyway"?

Last edited by Silverstar; 08/07/23 08:27 PM.

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Originally Posted by Zerubbabel
I think I am seeing two strains of thought, philosophically, in this chat and I think we can focus more on the forms of the arguments than on arguing with each other:

On the one hand, this makes sense WITHIN the universe it occurs and is not bestiality WITHIN the universe it occurs, given it occurs between two consenting adults under temporary magical conditions.

On the other hand, from OUTSIDE the universe WITHIN our OWN universe, it is unarguably a portrayal of a serious sexual taboo in its appearance at the very least.

Can we agree on that point?

Hunnid.

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Originally Posted by Lake Plisko
Originally Posted by mrfuji3
6 year olds can't meaningfully consent. If it was shown then it'd be rape, pedophilia, etc. (Which is bad)

An adult member of sapient/sentient species--human, elf, dragonborn, devil, dragon, lizardfolk, halfling, or a elf temporarily transformed into a bear--can consent. That's the difference.

Elves, dragonborns, devils, dragons, lizardfolk and halflings are not real things.

But bears are.

What if it was an adult elf that transformed into a six year old - would it then be okay to show on screen?
That's...a fair response. I'd say No, mainly because it's too close to a real-world issue. Sexual abuse of children is a real and terrible issue that exploits their vulnerability and messes them up for life, while sex with bears (from what I know) isn't a significant problem.

There's a degree of separation in the fantasy that is comparable to sex with dragons, devils, and other fantastical beings. Of course we don't live in a vacuum, and must consider the impacts on the real world. However, showing a sex scene with an elf-turned-bear doesn't get anywhere near the bounds where it may approach causing real-world-harm. Sex with an elf-turned-bear is much closer to the fantastical "monsterfucker" situation--wanting to have a novel kinky sexual experience--that is ultimately practically harmless.

I suppose the more appropriate follow-up question is: what if Halsin turned into a dog? Does that change it's "okayness"? Imo it's more iffy, but a wolf would be *more* acceptable than a dog.

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Originally Posted by Lake Plisko
Also - I do think we should censor bestiality. So... yes, I am saying that. I am calling for the censorship of bestiality. I do not think it should be in media we consume. You got me?
Well, too bad for you. Unless this particular kink will get illegal worlwide you can't really take it out of any media. All you can do is not consume it.

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Eh, I think it's a fictional world where people can turn into animals. So it's no different, to me in this game or any fictional setting, where you can have sex with someone that looks like a demon or a dragon. It's not just a bear or whatever. It's a person.

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