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enthusiast
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enthusiast
Joined: Jun 2020
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Wouldn’t mind EA telling Bioware to make something more like Baldurs Gate instead of more like Destiny. Since it’s what they used to be good at.
Of course it could be Starfield that everyone tries to copy soon.
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veteran
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veteran
Joined: Dec 2020
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Perhaps I'm just not reading it correctly, but while I think the basic point that other (smaller) RPG developers shouldn't try to make BG3 on a tighter budget is right, I don't think it's all that interesting. I don't think studios like Owlcat or Tactical Adventures, or even Obsidian (though they might get some more Microsoft money if BG3 does well) are going to make that mistake. And I think there will continue to be a demand for more independent RPGs and gamers will set their expectation for such games appropriately.
The studio I most hope will be re-evaluating their life choices should BG3 turn out to be the success is BioWare, for whom I think BG3 gives a kind of alternative vision that shows you don't need to abandon interesting and complex party-based combat and a high degree of customisation of your player character just in order to make enough money to tell an immersive story with high quality animation and voice acting. Of course, I take people's points that BioWare's position in the EA stable is restrictive, and both they and EA would also understandably concerned that there's a unique combination of factors that mean that even a BG3-clone couldn't be pulled off by someone else, but I hope they're at least considering whether they might have some lessons to learn from Larian. I think Biowares biggest problem is EA. Let's hope, that Larian can stay away from those big companies.
"We are all stories in the end. Just make it a good one."
Doctor Who
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veteran
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veteran
Joined: Mar 2020
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I think we might also not fully understand how BG3 happened. It is a massive step up ambition wise from D:OS2, and I suspect there is more at play here than Larian using success of D:OS2 for their next project.
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addict
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addict
Joined: Sep 2022
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In my book Larian IS a "minor" AAA studio now. Sadly.
BG3 will be for Larian what the Witcher 3 was for CD Projekt. Just not as successful.
Last edited by Count Turnipsome; 13/07/23 12:51 PM.
It just reminded me of the bowl of goat's milk that old Winthrop used to put outside his door every evening for the dust demons. He said the dust demons could never resist goat's milk, and that they would always drink themselves into a stupor and then be too tired to enter his room..
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veteran
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veteran
Joined: Mar 2020
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In my book Larian IS a "minor" AAA studio now. I think it s rather unfair, though it of course depends what you mean by “AAA”. They aren’t acquired by a publisher, so they are still very much an independent studio. Their business model couldn’t be further from AAA.
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addict
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addict
Joined: Sep 2022
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They sure don't qualify as an "indie" house. Founded in 1996, have a dozen games, worldwide offices, employ hundreds of people (400+). I think that qualifies enough to be AAA. Okay, maybe aaa? 
Last edited by Count Turnipsome; 13/07/23 12:53 PM.
It just reminded me of the bowl of goat's milk that old Winthrop used to put outside his door every evening for the dust demons. He said the dust demons could never resist goat's milk, and that they would always drink themselves into a stupor and then be too tired to enter his room..
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veteran
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veteran
Joined: Mar 2020
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Okay, maybe aaa? Indiaaa?
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veteran
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veteran
Joined: Oct 2020
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I think we might also not fully understand how BG3 happened. It is a massive step up ambition wise from D:OS2, and I suspect there is more at play here than Larian using success of D:OS2 for their next project. Agree! I am sure it took a lot of hard work, vision, and planning to make such a great game as BG3! There are a lot of fun AAA games, but they are much smaller in scope than BG3. Hopefully companies like Bioware and Obsidian (if they are making AAA games) can be inspired by BG3!
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Jhe'stil Kith'rak
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Jhe'stil Kith'rak
Joined: Oct 2021
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“Sorry our market research tells us that people only play Action RPGs with big empty worlds, minimal tactical consideration, and limited character interaction. Anyway, here’s The Outer Fallout: Inquisition.”
Remember the human (This is a forum for a video game):
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old hand
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old hand
Joined: Mar 2022
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I think we might also not fully understand how BG3 happened. It is a massive step up ambition wise from D:OS2, and I suspect there is more at play here than Larian using success of D:OS2 for their next project. Larian got a lot of funding from various sources. They sold 30% of their shares to Tencent, they made a juicy partnership with Stadia, they most likely have a lot of help from WotC who want to show their license in the best light, they got help from Microsoft employee for they console port, and of course there is all the orders from early access at 60$ the unit (more than pretty much any games nowadays).
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Jhe'stil Kith'rak
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Jhe'stil Kith'rak
Joined: Oct 2021
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Larian has changed.
Bigger funds, bigger team, bigger name, bigger fanbase, bigger company.
Remember the human (This is a forum for a video game):
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addict
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addict
Joined: Oct 2020
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I think we might also not fully understand how BG3 happened. It is a massive step up ambition wise from D:OS2, and I suspect there is more at play here than Larian using success of D:OS2 for their next project. Larian got a lot of funding from various sources. They sold 30% of their shares to Tencent, they made a juicy partnership with Stadia, they most likely have a lot of help from WotC who want to show their license in the best light, they got help from Microsoft employee for they console port, and of course there is all the orders from early access at 60$ the unit (more than pretty much any games nowadays). Is Tencent Larian's Warlock patron?
Back from timeout.
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Jhe'stil Kith'rak
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Jhe'stil Kith'rak
Joined: Oct 2021
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I think we might also not fully understand how BG3 happened. It is a massive step up ambition wise from D:OS2, and I suspect there is more at play here than Larian using success of D:OS2 for their next project. Larian got a lot of funding from various sources. They sold 30% of their shares to Tencent, they made a juicy partnership with Stadia, they most likely have a lot of help from WotC who want to show their license in the best light, they got help from Microsoft employee for they console port, and of course there is all the orders from early access at 60$ the unit (more than pretty much any games nowadays). Is Tencent Larian's Warlock patron? Fiend or Great Old One???
Remember the human (This is a forum for a video game):
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addict
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addict
Joined: Oct 2020
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I think we might also not fully understand how BG3 happened. It is a massive step up ambition wise from D:OS2, and I suspect there is more at play here than Larian using success of D:OS2 for their next project. Larian got a lot of funding from various sources. They sold 30% of their shares to Tencent, they made a juicy partnership with Stadia, they most likely have a lot of help from WotC who want to show their license in the best light, they got help from Microsoft employee for they console port, and of course there is all the orders from early access at 60$ the unit (more than pretty much any games nowadays). Is Tencent Larian's Warlock patron? Fiend or Great Old One??? Well they own all/majority stakes in a bunch of companies like Riot, Klei, and Funcom, as well as chunks of Epic, Larian, and Ubisoft, so I'd say Fathomless, only instead of fathomless water, it is fathomless money.
Back from timeout.
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veteran
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veteran
Joined: Jan 2018
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Wouldn’t mind EA telling Bioware to make something more like Baldurs Gate instead of more like Destiny. Since it’s what they used to be good at.
Of course it could be Starfield that everyone tries to copy soon. Skyrim I’d one of the most successful games ever, but despite that, nobody tries to copy Bethesda’s style of games (go in anywhere, pick up anything, do sorta whatever you want). That’s because as janky as they are, their games are also very difficult to make, especially for a studio that doesn’t have prior experience doing it, which is every studio not named Bethesda.
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veteran
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veteran
Joined: May 2019
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I very much hope this individual turns out to be correct, and that other RPG developers don't try to copy BG3. Since BG3 is a piss-poor game to me, the last thing I want is for BG3 clones to start popping up.
And to be clear, what I want in an RPG is very much great writing, deep and immersive story, strong character development, branching dialog, extensive character customization and reactivity, etc. But I reject the notion that we're getting any of this from BG3 in a truly meaningful and non-superficial way.
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old hand
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old hand
Joined: Mar 2022
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I very much hope this individual turns out to be correct, and that other RPG developers don't try to copy BG3. Since BG3 is a piss-poor game to me, the last thing I want is for BG3 clones to start popping up.
And to be clear, what I want in an RPG is very much great writing, deep and immersive story, strong character development, branching dialog, extensive character customization and reactivity, etc. But I reject the notion that we're getting any of this from BG3 in a truly meaningful and non-superficial way. If you want to spend your time discussing RPGs you hate, RPGcodex is two blocks away.
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enthusiast
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enthusiast
Joined: Apr 2023
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I never thought I'll say smth like that about a game, but IMO, BG3 has been in development for TOO LONG.
Look - they shifted release to an earlier date (I don't remember this ever happening in a gaming industry) ; PS5 and PC versions are coming out at the same time, while Larian always took a year+ to polish the original version and release the console one. Latest "woke dating sim in Faerun" additions, unnecessary dnd rule changes, some TV start voice actors etc. all look more like "bells and whistles" but do not actually improve the core product.
BG3 starts giving off CP2077 vibes.
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Jhe'stil Kith'rak
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Jhe'stil Kith'rak
Joined: Oct 2021
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I very much hope this individual turns out to be correct, and that other RPG developers don't try to copy BG3. Since BG3 is a piss-poor game to me, the last thing I want is for BG3 clones to start popping up.
And to be clear, what I want in an RPG is very much great writing, deep and immersive story, strong character development, branching dialog, extensive character customization and reactivity, etc. But I reject the notion that we're getting any of this from BG3 in a truly meaningful and non-superficial way. Okay, so great writing, immersive story, and character development are largely subjective. But how many major games in the last decade, or decade and a half, have given or promised you branching dialogue, character customization, and reactivity on par with what we've gotten or been promised/shown in BG3? I can think of 1, MAYBE 2.
Remember the human (This is a forum for a video game):
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veteran
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veteran
Joined: Dec 2020
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I very much hope this individual turns out to be correct, and that other RPG developers don't try to copy BG3. Since BG3 is a piss-poor game to me, the last thing I want is for BG3 clones to start popping up.
And to be clear, what I want in an RPG is very much great writing, deep and immersive story, strong character development, branching dialog, extensive character customization and reactivity, etc. But I reject the notion that we're getting any of this from BG3 in a truly meaningful and non-superficial way. If you want to spend your time discussing RPGs you hate, RPGcodex is two blocks away. If someone's posts bother you that much that you can only respond to them with snark, there is an ignore feature on the forums. Have you considered using it? As it is, your comment adds nothing to the discussion, and only creates more drama. On topic: on principle I have to shake my head at these types of ideas that a specific game is going to change the course of video game history forever. it's going to be a financial success, it's going to influence AAA games I'm sure, but it won't be "killing" anything, unless people are trying to compete in the exact same market to the exact same audience.
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